A
female
age
51-59,
anonymous
writes:Hi i know this is a site about relationships, and this problem is about my relationship with my 7 year old daughter in a round about way. I'm at the end of my tether with her at bed time, for the first few years she went to bed with no trouble, but within the last year i am finding it increasingly harder to get her to go to sleep. I've tried the bath, story and bed which i still do. I have tried letting her scream, but have had complaints from the neighbours. She becomes increasingly violet, pinching and scratching me. Its really stressful for both of us, and you can feel the tension before she goes to bed. Obviously the next morning she is very tired, which again causes conflict and arguments. She's tired at school and not concentrating properly, which affects her school. We seem to have gotten into a rut and I am very tired myself by the end of the day.Can anyone give me some advice on how to deal with this situation PLEASE.
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female
reader, Honeypie  +, writes (29 January 2010):
 Awesome, glad it is working for you all!
A
female
reader, AskEve +, writes (27 January 2010):
 I'm so glad things have worked out for you. Keep up the good work.
~Eve~
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A
reader, anonymous, writes (27 January 2010): This is verified as being by the original poster of the questionHi there,i thought i would provide an update on my situation.I spoke to my ex partner and my mom about the situation.My ex puts her to bed by 9.30 at the weekends,which has helped.My mom was not so easy to adapt.I hide her nintendo before i go out so she can not use it.Myself i enlisted my neighbours help.I got them to speak to my daughter and say they are being kept awake by her screaming.This seemed to do the trick.My daughter was mortified,and the screaming stopped that night.We have at least half hour quiet time before she goes to bed.We read stories and talk about what has happened in her day.The tension has gone.The violent behaviour i belive was because she was tired,that has stopped completely.She is fast asleep by 8.45.I also as good behaviour put her cd in her room and she listens to it whislt falling asleep.Thankyou everyone for all your help,i took abit of advice from each post and it did the trick.Thankyou again sooo much.x
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A
female
reader, AskEve +, writes (7 January 2010):
I can totally understand your frustration but there is an anxiety problem here, and you, the mother have to find out where the underlying cause of it is stemming from, my gut feeling is that it is coming from you. I feel something in your life has rocked your daughter’s boat a bit, if you read your question again, you will see your letter sounds a bit cold, and very to the point. Something has changed in your daughter’s time in the last year for her to behave like this. You should talk to the school (as she may be getting bullied) or not coping with her schoolwork or something at school, you should visit the school if anything to eliminate this as a problem. If all seems fine with her school then it is an environmental problem, i.e. her home life that is stressing this little girl and therefore you are not telling us the whole story.
I suggest too that you speak to your partner (and your mum) and let them know the problems you're facing with her and ask them to adhere to any specific guidelines you give them, not giving into her too easily and not watching TV or game playing too late at night, also not eating/drinking too late as examples. “You can feel the tension before she goes to bed…” WHO FEELS THE TENSION... obviously mum, and this has a knock on effect on your daughter. You need to change her bedtime routine and give her something to distract her i.e. a water bottle or teddy bear or her favourite doll for comfort. You have to sit it out and let her scream and if she disrupts the neighbours you yourself can apologise on your daughter’s behalf to the neighbours the next day, (maybe even take your daughter along with you.) If your daughter confronts the problem she will not scream again. As for the violence then that is where the distraction comes in, she can squeeze, punch, spit etc whatever she likes to her doll but you have to leave her to do this and if she pinches or scratches you then you must tell her that she will cannot come in if she is going to continue doing that to you and it must stop NOW. You need to be very firm and controlled with her though and not give in.
But there is a deep anxiety problem here and I fear you may not have told us the whole story. Children don't change overnight to that extreme without circumstantial changes going on around them.
~Eve~
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A
reader, anonymous, writes (7 January 2010): This is verified as being by the original poster of the questionThanks everyone for youe advice.I'm going to put a few ideas to the test over the next few days,and i will keep you posted.Thanks again.x
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A
female
reader, pancakes rule  +, writes (7 January 2010):
 i disagree with the people who seem to be going straight to the possibility that she may have problems. Although it's best not to write this theory off, just in case, I used to be like this when I was seven and I have babysitted for children who are the same.
It's most likely that she doesn't think it's fair that she has to go to bed when you don't, or that she just wants to do something more fun such as nintendo or watching telly.
I stand by the advice I already gave as I found it very effective when used on the kids I mind and even when it was used on me by my mum.
You should confront your mother if you think she lets your daughter stay up late because it isn't fair to you.
good luck
xx
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A
female
reader, LilPixie +, writes (7 January 2010):
 You've got some great advice there, but as i was the same at that age, i thought id let you know what helped me.
I always had my bedroom door open a little to let some light in as i was scared of the dark at the time. I always had a lot of teddys around me which made me feel more secure in bad (they protected me from all the monsters that hid in my room lol).
I also wanted to suggest buying her a little cd player along with some cd's of her favourite shows that she can listen to while trying to sleep. I know a lot of people will probably say it's a bad idea, but that's what I had and it always helped me sleep.
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A
male
reader, anonymous, writes (7 January 2010): well thanks for describing the ENTIRE SITUATION.
You are THE mom, your mom and ex need to get on the same page. They are playing "sugar daddy"(s) letting your daughter get away with unacceptable poor bedtime habits. So.. You are being made the bad guy.
It's the weekend so it doesn't matter, or "grandma should get to spoil her" does NOT FLY. 2000 bed time is 2000 bed time 7 days a week period. Your daughter should be in bed by 2000 so no intendo games krap after 1900. At 1900 she should be taking a bath or getting jammies on, picking up toys in her room, etc.. all things geared toward getting ready and being in bed at 2000. Or at latest 2100 bed.
You're the Mom, you get to set the rules. It is up to "grandma" and ex to play by the rules. Your child is not getting the very thing she needs for good sleeping habits. Consistancy. The problem IS NOT with your daughter, it's with your ex and grandma.
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A
male
reader, anonymous, writes (7 January 2010): Listen to this show on npr for advice on parenting.
http://www.parentsjournal.com/
It's a US show but it is available online.
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A
reader, anonymous, writes (7 January 2010): HI, I think there is something definitely bothering her deep I would say, have you had her physically checked for sexual abuse, I was abused as a child and I would not go to bed, I had nightmares, I played up, etc. I dont mean to alarm you but someone might be hurting her and threatening her to keep quiet, this happened to me and I kept quiet all my life about it until about 2 months ago when I told my therapist and Im now 29. The difference is tho my mother never came to me and asked me if someone was hurting me and if she had of sat with me I might of spoke up about it. There are so many other possibilities too as to why there is a problem, could just have to do with the break up. Good Luck!
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A
male
reader, anonymous, writes (6 January 2010): Just a couple of things about bedtime routine which we found very helpful - you may be doing them already, but they may be worth trying if not.Try giving her notice of bedtime once, or even twice: half an hour to bedtime now...quarter of an hour to bedtime now. This helps mentally prepare your daughter and she may protest less.We own a chiming clock which chimes every quarter of an hour; we found this very helpful as a marker for bedtime notices..."it's bedtime at the next bing-bong..."After our children are in bed, they have what we call "quiet time" with me, meaning they have ten minutes of my exclusive company to talk about whatever they want to talk about and do whatever they wish to do (within reason). They look forward to this immensely and it seems to help them to get ready to sleep.I hope things work out okay. Take care.
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female
reader, Angzw  +, writes (6 January 2010):
I forgot to add that with kids, sometimes the need for attention and intimacy may cause this behavior; as in negative attention is better than none at all. You should constantly reassure her with hugs and pats and kisses throughout the day. I still do this even with my teeanagers. Tell her constantly that you love her, until she is eventually rolling her eyes and saying "I know that already". When you discipline her, remind her that you are doing it because you love her eg. When Nintendo's are switched off don't make it feel like a punishment. Don't just say "right TV off" and that's it. To her it may seem mean. Tell her why you limit the TV and why it has to be switched off. She may still whine but eventually she will get it.
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A
female
reader, Angzw +, writes (6 January 2010):
At this age positive reinforcement is the best. You ask her during bedtime routine what she would love to do with you, maybe go to the ice-skating rink or something. You promise her that if she sleeps without a fuss 5 nights in a row then we go. You can even make a crazy 5 day calendar together and cross off each day in a fun way every night. If she kicks up a fuss before 5 days then she has to start again from day one. Or better still ask her how many good nights is her outing of the week worth. A big outing maybe more nights. If she succeeds then make that outing extra special. Then the following week try a new favourite outing as an incentive.
As for your ex, she needs to maintain this early routine when she is over there too and with your mum. Everyone needs to cooperate. Yes your separation may be affecting her and being an unusual situation this has caused some stress for her and may require an unusual solution. Maybe letting her sleep in your bed for a couple of weeks can be an alternative as it will help her feel more secure and connected to you. When my third child (age 5) was having nightmares at night some months ago, I let her sleep in my bed and after about 10 days she got fed up and said mommy don't be sad but I want to go back to my room now! You cannot spoil a child with love and concern. These stages they go through are temporary so just try a few different things.
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A
male
reader, paulofessex +, writes (6 January 2010):
 I think Caringguy and Honeypie has covered most of it. I would just add that if you are happy to obtain 3rd party help consider asking to speak to the school nurse attached to your daughters school, they are a valuable source of help and supportBest wishes
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A
male
reader, CaringGuy +, writes (6 January 2010):
I suspect the late nights at your ex partners house and such are the cause. A few women I know have said they're always bad cop because they set rules and no one else follows them. Have patience with her, because she probably doesn't understand why she can do one thing in one place, and another thing in another. Keep talking to her and don't give up, but really sit down with everyone and have a strategy. Be tough with your ex and mother as well.
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A
female
reader, Honeypie +, writes (6 January 2010):
I think you need to get your ex-partner and you mom all together and sit down and talk strategy that EVERYONE will follow.
Them you all (preferable together) needs to sit her down and talk to her. See if she can open up a little. Something is going on.
My 7 year old ( middle child) has a bed time at 8.30 - shower at 7 then no TV after that, just a book or two. Some kids need a little more time to wind down then others. However, none of my kids would throw tantrums because they have to go to bed. At the age of 7 she should understand that bed time is earlier on school night then on week-ends.
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A
female
reader, anonymous, writes (6 January 2010): I agree with caringGuy. Something is troubling your daughter and you need to get to the bottom of it. Its not just lack of sleep thats upsetting her. If she was tired there wouldnt be a situation at bed time, she would go off to sleep ok.
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reader, anonymous, writes (6 January 2010): This is verified as being by the original poster of the questionMy partner and i spilt two yrs ago,we are on very good terms and my daughter stays at his one night a week.He lets her stay up latebecause its on the weekends.I have sat her down and asked her if there is a problem she says no,i've said if there is i will help her and am there for her.She is tired most the time and feel the violence is a product of that.I do work and on occassion in the evenings.I have no choice.My mom looks after her.I tell my mom,no tv,or nintentendo after 8pm,but i suspect she allows her.My mom and my ex partner both spoil her and lets her get away with murder.I do feel that has something to do with this,but what can i do?I am always the bad cop because i am the one who sets the boundaries.
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A
female
reader, pancakes rule +, writes (6 January 2010):
Make it really boring to be up. If she gets out of bed, let her sit with you in the living room with the television off and just do your own thing, eg read. Have some dim the lighting in your room, if you only have a main light with no dimmer, invest in a smaller lamp and only have that on.Try going to bed at the same time as her and just have the house completely silent so that she doesn't have a reason to be up.good luck
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A
male
reader, anonymous, writes (6 January 2010): Your daughter may have some medical problems, again there may be some mental problems associated with going to sleep. How much boob tube do you allow her to watch before going to bed and what type of shows?? Is she getting sugar type snacks after dinner ?? If so that needs to cease NOW along with any T.V. other than true "kid shows". You might try a very small "night light" so it's not pitch black and put it on a 2 hour timer. No "napping" after 1600 period. Take all the sugar snacks and throw them in the garbage, better yet leave them in the grocery store!! Any "treat" is completely contingent on her eating her dinner all of it. Which can be something like jello or a banana or the such. Set at bed time and stick to it, absolutely no deviation because it's a special show. There is no show that special. Who is this "we have gotten into a rut" ?? Set the rules, get a cheap timer and use it. Give the kid set boundery's and stick to them. It's easy to start bad habits,, lot tougher to change them after they're set.
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A
male
reader, CaringGuy +, writes (6 January 2010):
To be violent and such, something is really wrong. You need to sit down and talk to her gently about how school and life are going. Has anything changed in her life (divorce, new sibling), or are you a working mum, busy? I think you need to speak to her gently and get her to open up. Something is upsetting her.
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A
female
reader, anonymous, writes (6 January 2010): Some suggestions:-Google Sylvia Rimm. She is a psychologist and advice columnist. She has written a lot about this topic.-Discuss the situation with your daughter during the day, when there is no conflict. Ask her why she won't stay in bed. Could she be afraid? If so, of what? (I was a terrible sleeper as a child, I was afraid of ghosts. The people I told dismissed it as an over-active imagination, so I stopped talking about it. Nobody ever listened and validated my fear).-Has there been a major upheaval or change in her life? How are things at school and with friends? Remember that things that are small to an adult can be HUGE for a child.-Could someone be abusing her emotionally or physically? These types of trauma usually lead to disturbed sleep patterns.-I highly recommend that you seek professional help. Talk to your doctor and try to get a referral to a psychologist.I hope that helps in some way!
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