A
female
age
36-40,
anonymous
writes:Why is it that when a woman is hurt by porn use it's always about why she should change herself to accept it and how it's her fault that it bothers her and how basically, it's all about the sacrifices she needs to make to accommodate him? Why is it NEVER about why the guy should sacrifice porn for her? Why is it normal for him to need to fantasize and masturbate to perfect women, but abnormal and wrong for her to be upset? I even hear about men who watch porn a lot and get furious to the point of nearly breaking up with their girlfriends because she watches too. It's not uncommon. So seriously, what the heck?
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female
reader, Lola1  +, writes (23 June 2010):
 Wow. I shouldn’t be venturing near this "pro-porn/anti-porn bee's nest", but I do want to address the OP's question: 'Why is the porn debate so one-sided?"
If you are referring to this website, I can honestly say that it isn't.
Anytime anyone has come here (that I have seen) to say that porn has killed their sex-life; that they feel their husband and/or boyfriend prefers porn over sex with them, many agony aunts and uncles have rallied their support behind them. I know, because I have joined them and invite you to actually RESEARCH this by digging a little deeper than you apparently have.
Porn, like all things is good for you, as long as it is administered in moderation. I LOVE a nice glass of wine with dinner, but if I drink it with breakfast, that is a bit much. Enjoying a little porn with your significant other or on your own, is a good thing - in moderation.
Let’s try to remember that sex is not dirty. When done right and by consenting people of a legal age, it can be a fantastic physical expression of love... and it feels good, too.
When I see one girl being used by five men and I can see the glazed very drugged-up look in her eyes (being a woman, I will look at her eyes.. lol), I feel sad for her. The porn industry is a dangerous one, and so are drugs. However, there are better examples of porn out there.
So many people (women mostly) ask men to examine their feelings, so they can be better companions. We tell our girlfriends to and talk things out with us, so they can understand theirs. This (we feel) helps everyone understand themselves more fully and be better lovers/spouses and better people. Getting in touch with your sexuality; understanding what turns you on; mentally exploring ideas you may sometime or may never want to perform in real life and pushing the limits of your imagination, is healthy too and can make us all better lovers. This can ENHANCE the physical and emotional intimacy of a relationship.
We can label pornography a vehicle of cheating, but where do we draw the line? If viewing sexually charged images is cheating, then what does it mean if we see couples making out on a park bench or accidentally walk in on a married couple visiting our house, while they are being ‘intimate’?
You are right, OP, that it is unfair for anyone to tell you to change your ideals. If you have a problem with pornography and feel it violates the sanctity of your relationship, you do not have to put up with it or learn to understand. Your partner doesn’t have to change either. It is, in my experience, impossible to make other people change. We can only change ourselves.
There are men out there who WILL agree with you on this issue. You may prefer to match yourself up with someone who better matches your ideals.
Good luck!
A
male
reader, dirtball +, writes (23 June 2010):
 Cerberus, the OP doesn't want our input, she just wants to argue. That's fine, if she thinks she is getting somewhere, but in reality it does nothing to change people's minds on the subject. The handful of people who have viewed this, may or may not have adjusted some views. My guess is it did nothing. I'll still watch porn if I feel the urge to...
What was the point of this exercise anyway?
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A
reader, anonymous, writes (23 June 2010): At the end of the day, porn is down to the individual man and woman their beliefs and morals.
Most men have been using it as a masturbation aid since their early teens. Most men I know including me couldn't really give a crap about it, we like to use, it's useful, it gives us a quick erection and gets us off quickly. No hassle, no mess, done.
There are many different types of porn and porn has many different meanings to different guys.
My favourite type is amateur, natural women with a bit of extra weight having real sex with their boyfriends and as I've stated lots of times before I have no feeling or emotion attached to it, just arouses me quickly and efficiently so I get things done quick. I can't actually stand to look at it once I'm finished.
Other guys love it and can watch it for hours and if a woman isn't being wholley degraded then they can't get off. That kind of attitude is alien to me, I just can't understand how guys get obssessed with it.
I'm not into that degrading crap like facials, animals, DP, deep throat, bodily fluid use, porn stars, gang bangs or any of that other thoroughly awful crap. Pictures also do nothing for me, I need videos because it's movement and sounds that get me aroused, not the woman but obviously there has to be a woman in the video.
OP in my opinion you have a very extreme hatred of porn, if you think it's cheating. You must hate the majority of men in this world so including me, you must think we're all a bunch of selfish, cheating bastards.
I'd seriously love to be able to find a way of putting your mind at ease or give you some pearl of wisdom that would help you not view it so negatively as to actually affect you the way it does, but I know I can't.
All I can say to you OP, is you really must consider whether porn is actually worth gving this much thought and effort to. Most of us don't give it a second thought but you seem to give it as much time and effort as those loser guys that are obssessed and addicted to it only instead of loving it you hate it, but what's the difference if it's still having that kind impact on you?
It's here to stay OP and it's becoming a lot easier to access it. You're seemingly obssessive hatred of it is only going to impact on you negatively and may even cause you a lot of heartache in the future. It's only as big a deal as you make out of it, perhaps you can't help how you feel about it and I respect your views and opinions but in my mind it's really not worth giving that much of a damn about and it's definitely not worth even the most minor emotional or mental trauma.
You want my advice? Do what you can to lessen it's impact on your life seriously it's really not worth it. Don't let it get you down.
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A
female
reader, Miamine  +, writes (23 June 2010):
 "Rationalize away why cheating with another human being is worse, but it's really not if you think about it rationally"
Sexual intercourse with another person risks my life with possible STD's including Herpes... Sharing bodily fluids, sweat, sperm, spit, is far more personal to me, than sharing bodily fluids with your own hand. The emotional connection, the kissing, the touching, the intimate sex movements with another person is nothing like the intimate movements you can share with a computer screen or magazine.
The arguement becomes ridiculous when you say such things as..
1. Action films are the same as romantic films... nope, I can put on a romantic film and see full nudity and sexual activity, and it arrouses the same emotions as pornography. "The Secretary" is a romantic mainstream film, it's subject matter is S&M, there is a nudity scene, and sex scenes, and it gives me the same orgasm as I get from porn.
How can you equate "The Secretary" or "The Piano" with "Die Hard" or "Dirty Harry"...
2. Cheating with a pornography magazine or video is the same as cheating with a live human being who breathes, sweats, can leave marks on the body and can actually form a relationship with your partner and cause your partner to fall in love with them and leave you..
Again, arguement seems ridiculous. If you feel this way, then are you also threatened by your guy watching television and movies where nudity is shown. Have you told your partner to give up porn, but given him permision to screw any woman he wants.
I think that if you tell him he can have sex with any real life woman he wants, you will find that he easily gives up the pornography. Real life sex with a real life woman, with lots of variety and choice, would probably beat pornography hands down.. but again maybe not.
3. Below, you and another anonymous woman talk about how you feel "inadequate", "hurt" and "not good enough"... do you feel the same when you see the beautiful movie stars, rich women who have money to have surgery? I'm not pretty, but the looks and behaviour of other women do not threaten me or make me feel "hurt, inadequate or ugly", no matter how much my partner looks or how fat or ugly I get. Confidence is feeling beautiful in yourself and not comparing yourself badly with others.
This argument again goes nowhere, you say women get hurt when men find women in porn pretty. The women in pornography don't have this problem, men and women who look at pornography don't have this problem, and many men and women everywhere, don't even care enough the issue to even disscuss it at all.
PS: Yes, I've seen the men in NoPorn.com, and other anti-pornography sites. I only seen one guy who had a real problem with addiction, he also had drug and alcohol addictions too. Most of the men I could see in these forums only discovered they had a problem when their wife told them they had one. These men are so scared to wreck their relationships, they allow women to tell them they are mentally sick.
Time and time again, I saw men who clearly said..."Please help me give up pornography, my wife has told me I'm sick and is threatening to leave me"..
As anyone who deals in addiction knows, you can't get an addict to give up something by threatening him. Addicts must believe they have a problem and want to change themselves. That's why in these anti-pornography "help" sites, these men can't seem to stay of porn for a couple of months, the longest person who had given up was talking about 3 months..
Most normal porn users find it easy to give up, through their own choice... Pornography is very borring and most people either cut down or give up eventually.
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A
reader, anonymous, writes (23 June 2010): This is verified as being by the original poster of the questionYes porn is an erection inducer. So is a REM cycle of sleep. Do I feel bad about him getting an erection from his sleep? Nope. Do I get bothered if he gets an erection from his own hand and brain? Nope. Do I feel bad about him getting erections and orgasms from watching other women? Yup. Trying to find a little name to reduce what porn is doesn't make it less hurtful or harmful. I can do the same thing for cocaine, it's a happy inducer. So it shouldn't be bad either. And why do you think it's irrational to be bothered? It's no more rational to be bothered or not bothered. In my eyes it's more rational to be bothered. It is a type of cheating. I've heard several times that it hurts MORE than cheating for him to look at porn. And really being hurt by cheating is "irrational" too. So long as he shares his love and still has time for you, what difference does it make if he sleeps with someone else? Rationalize away why cheating with another human being is worse, but it's really not if you think about it rationally. To say porn is fantasy and not real is not looking at it. You say we shouldn't try to take away the porn since he was doing that long before we came along, but most guys were also sleeping with other women before we came along and we have no problems taking that away.
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A
female
reader, anonymous, writes (23 June 2010): Ladies, I know how you feel because I've felt that way too, but like I said, it's irrational. It's just an erection inducer. Repeat after me:"Porn is just an erection inducer".Most men don't fall into addictions, really. The ones that do have problems, and wives/gfs should be upset. But otherwise, let's just accept it and move on. It's just an erection inducer and that's it.We're also erection inducers... but with that comes love, affection, intimacy and good times... OH! And good orgasms... remember when he masturbates to porn HE gives an orgasm to HIMSELF! As far as I'm concerned, most sensible men prefer to get an orgasm from someone else. When you have sex with your man, YOU give HIM an orgasm. What en ego builder. You make him have an orgasm... I think sometimes we also take this for granted.After all, what can we do about it? It's like a toy to them. And as far as I see it, if the porn has been around longer than you or I have been in our partner's lives, then why demand to take it away? Some guys will, but those who don't aren't bad guys. Let's start being more rational about this subject. It'll help us see things more clearly.
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A
female
reader, anonymous, writes (22 June 2010): There are a few posts from men who believe their girlfriends or wives are addicted to porn and are upset. But admittedly, they're WAY LESS than posts from women.
I guess men just don't think of erections as something significant as we do. And it's totally irrational, really. Why would an erection be significant? It's not. Not at all. It can come and go spontaneously. Erections don't mean love. Never have, never will. It's weird actually why we give such a damn about our partners erections...
The erection is meaningless. It's the intimacy that counts but we seem to forget that sometimes... and that's why porn is a big deal only when it interferes with intimacy. If it doesn't then it shouldn't be a problem, it's just an erection inducer...
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A
female
reader, anonymous, writes (21 June 2010): Celia, I can show you literally husndreds of posts from men torn over their wives not looking like porn stars. Go to noporn And look under the recovering addicts thread. Every single one of these men started with a little "harmless porn" read some of the posts and maybe you will undestand. This isn't even to mention the recent research that has shown , exposure to even mild porn cause men to rate their partners as leas attractive
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A
female
reader, anonymous, writes (21 June 2010): Celia,In my experience dealing with guys, both my ex and my guy friends prefer to masturbate with the fake porn. None of them has ever expressed a preference for amateur or alt porn. I know about these genres, I think they're better than the regular stuff. But guys I've met don't think that way.It still doesn't do anything for me, even if the sex is more genuine, and that's my thing. Of course I'm not gonna think every man or woman has to think the way I do.Anyway, the thing the guys I've met have all been about perfect porn stars, they enjoy seeing busty females on man TV shows, going to strip clubs and such. They're good guys, don't get me wrong, they're not jerks, not the cheating type, they don't really criticize normal women, but they are indeed vocal about their preferences and think the ideal body is that of busty women, caked in make up, slim, etc.I was reading another porn question and one of the uncles even said that they like a woman with the "hot, fake body" (his words, not mine) to have sex with, and a nice girl to meet the parents. And that it's a sort of Catch 22 situation because of course you can't have the nice girl with the hot, fake body (again, his words). I think his point was that women with a hot, fake body, who hadn't "been around", and were good girlfriend/wife material would be like winning the jackpot because it would give both the kinky sex and the "nice girl".He also mentioned that guys watch it for the porn stars and the sex. But what he said implied that the women featured are indeed a factor, and that if a guy says otherwise then he's lying.- Female anon below.
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reader, anonymous, writes (19 June 2010): This is verified as being by the original poster of the questionYeah to the anon below, men say they NEED porn to masturbate, but then you offer pictures of yourself, and they say they need variety. How is that not supposed to be incredibly hurtful? It's basically saying, yeah I love you but one woman is never enough for me. Plenty (not all) of guys say they'd be OK with their girl looking, then blow up when they actually find that happening. I've seen a fair number of questions on that.
To dirtball, feeling threatened by their hand is NOT the same as being threatened by porn. Most women who have problems with porn don't seem to have problems with masturbation. The general consensus among people who have problems with it is that masturbation is fine, fantasy is fine, but porn isn't. If men need a visual to masturbate to, why wouldn't homemade porn with a partner be enough? It never seems to be. Clearly it's not just the visual.
And to Cerberus, glad you found someone special. I can tell you guys are in love by how you were practically gushing. It made me smile.
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A
female
reader, anonymous, writes (19 June 2010): Fair enough, men fantasize and need porn to masturbate. That's OK, and it's great for them. But why do the women have to look so different from us normal women? Is that what you really want in bed? A perfect Barbie doll, with all plastic parts included? Because that's my problem with porn. I can't magically turn into one of those Barbie dolls, I would need tons of money, I would have to endure painful surgeries and possible health consequences (implants are not all that safe, and my boobs are too small for porn standards).
I mean, everyone can be kinky. You don't need to be a platinum blonde with 34DD fakes to be kinky. Any woman can take it anally. Any woman can learn to deep throat or give killer BJs. I did it. I gave my ex all that he wanted sexually: anal, pulling my hair, rough sex, deep throating, etc. And I didn't look or act half as bored as porn stars 'cause I actually enjoyed giving it to him. But he still watched porn. What for? There's little to learn from porn. Sex blogs are more educational. They give fantastic tips. I learned much more from sex blogs than porn and Cosmo combined. And he really enjoyed it. Said it would be one the things he'd miss the most from our relationship.
So why is it that men like that specific look so much? I mean, I exercise, but I don't automatically look like them. I'd have to dye my hair, get implants. It hurts. Call it insecurity if you will, but why are they more attractive? If women like me were more attractive, then porn would feature normal women. Normal weight, normal breasts, slim, toned, yes, natural hair color, not so much make up, normal lips. I have cellulite, is that such a huge problem? Is it a disgusting disease? Then why do they hide it?
I worked a lot in order to always be attractive and to be kinky in bed. I learned many things. I spent a lot of time secretly researching new techniques to surprise him, on sex blogs mostly. But still I always felt lacking. Because he still needed to fantasize about plastic women who looked bored while having sex and screamed like squirrels on drugs!
I guess I don't get it. And I agree that it's not the same as romantic movies. I watched Twilight. Why? Because my boyfriend told me it was fun. I feel asleep while watching it. And Robert Pattinson is not my type. So don't generalize. A lot of men like Twilight, too, and they're not gay either. Many men watch romantic comedies or movies. Many women watch action flicks.
I agree that Megan Fox = Robert Pattinson. Action movies = Romantic movies. Porn = Porn.
And vibrators... don't get me started on those. I refuse to use one, mostly because they can damage the clitoral nerves and leave it insensitive and I don't want that. But my hand, a vibrator, it's the same. And I can fantasize about the guy I'm dating if I want to. But that's me. I mean, I did that while I was dating: I fantasized about things we'd done together, about his reactions, his noises, his faces, how he grabbed me as his arousal grew, etc. That turned me on and that helped me get off. But the point is, you can imagine any guy when you use a vibrator/dildo/hand. It usually is the guy you're dating. Likewise with written romantic novels. You picture that special guy.
I don't know. My only problem with porn is the type of women they show. Makes me feel like that's the ideal that men want, and that natural women are second best, otherwise they would be portrayed as the ideal. I know it sounds like I'm insecure, but at least I'm honest. I don't care that much that men need images of sex to get off, just why do women need to be so different? Why does it have to be so unattainable for me to look like that? I want to give a guy everything, and yes I can learn many, many skills, but if I don't look the part, then I'll never be able to give him everything, to satisfy all his sexual needs.
Let's face it, men like looking at pretty things while having sex. I just wish I could be that pretty, as pretty as the women they adore to wank over.
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A
male
reader, dirtball +, writes (18 June 2010):
"She might as well feel threatened by my right hand." Well said Cerberus!
This argument never goes anywhere because everyone holds their own views. I find porn relatively harmless to most people, but that doesn't mean you do, or that you have to. I'd prefer to be with a girl who doesn't mind it, but that rarely happens.
In my opinion, the real root of the problem that women have with porn is two fold. First, they have negative self images and compare themselves to the women in the videos. Second, their men lie to them about it. Ultimately it is the lies that I think hurt them more, when they eventually find out about them.
Porn is not going away, in fact it is becoming more main stream. I bet you most pubecent boys could name at least 3 porn stars.
Cerberus, I envy your relationship. Hold onto her as long as you can!
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reader, anonymous, writes (18 June 2010): You make a pretty good argument and have taken some of my points and refuted them well, but again you dodged the real issue.
It's something we like to do, something we've liked to do since before we met you and will after you're gone, us watching porn is your problem not ours. We like it, you don't? then don't watch it or find a guy that doesn't watch it.
Simple as that and yes it is fantasy, those women aren't real. Perhaps you think they are, perhaps you think that's a real orgasm she's having, perhaps you think the character she's playing of a 'woman that loves to have her ass pounded by a football team' is real, perhaps you think Edward Cullen is real and vampires exist. Fair enough if that's what you believe. I'm just telling you they don't they're acting, take from that what you will.
My girlfriend has no doubt masturbated to the fantasy of other men during our relationship, real guys, guys in work that she fancies etc. I know of a couple of guys she thinks are realy hot and actually has a thing for, I have absolutely no problem with the idea of her getting off to mental images of them having sex with her. We all do that.
If she had a video of one of the guys she likes naked then that would be awesome, I'd like to see that and if she wants to use that video to get herself off when she's not in the mood for sex then why not? Damn I'd get some major kudos if I could find a video like that.
Look I'm in a very open and secure relationship, I know beyond a shadow of a doubt that I'm the one for her. We talk in great detail about other people we think are hot, every little part of that person that makes them hot and how they make us feel because neither of us would ever want to be with anyone else.
When she's away for a time she sends me links to porn vids she's found that she'll know I like because she knows my type when it comes to porn and she's nothing like those girls either, I'm nothing like the guys she likes when she watches porn. We both understand the difference between reality and fiction/fantasy. Reality: she's the most amazing and beautiful woman I've ever met and she's not stupid enough to think that some fictional character getting pounded from every direction by greasy guys with ponytails are any kind of threat to her. She might aswell feel threatend by my right hand.
I guess I just got lucky.
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reader, anonymous, writes (18 June 2010): This is verified as being by the original poster of the questionPorn is very different from fantasy. In fact they are opposites. With porn generally you are not fantasizing, you are watching. You may be using the video to fantasize with, but it is dictating your fantasy. Everyone fantasizes, not everyone looks at porn. Yup, the women in porn are real. And what may you ask is the difference between porn and fantasizing about a real live woman? Let's put this in a hypothetical situation. Say your girlfriend or wife had told you she'd been fantasizing about her coworker. Then imagine you later found out she'd been masturbating to a video of him naked (that he didn't send so you know she wasn't out sleeping with him).
And please see my answer lower down on the page about why comparing Twilight or a romance novel to porn is downright insulting. Saying men feel insecure about romance movies is not comparable to how women feel about porn. The comparison between insecurities over a woman watching a romance movies would be the same as insecurities over a man watching the newest action movie with Megan Fox. Basically you take something much less sexual than porn and say it's as damaging to men as porn is to women. So basically you say that everything sexually negative we do is multiplied by 10 compared to things men do? That's such an incredible double standard.
"Which are for women a source of emotional masturbation."
What is emotional masturbation? Are you trying to say women get as much pleasure from emotional things as men get from wanking? Women get as much pleasure from having orgasms and men get from having orgasms. There is no female emotional equivalent. Women have orgasms and enjoy them just the same as men. Like I said, I've been over this lower on the page.
"How would a woman feel if we asked her never to use the vibrator she always used since she was a teenager, because we feel insecure in comparison to its size or something? How would a woman feel if she were told that it was such a big deal to the guy that he's willing to break up over it?"
Oh boy the old vibrator analogy again. First off, a vibrator is different from a dildo. A dildo is shaped like a penis, a vibrator isn't. More of my friends (I can't speak for the rest of the female world) use vibrators than dildos. I don't know any woman who wouldn't switch to a small bullet non-phallic one if it was hurting her boyfriend. Second, many women physically cannot orgasm without a vibrator. Men can orgasm without porn. In one of the posts on here someone made the point that a vibrator is more comparable to lube than porn. Some men can't masturbate without lube. Neither the vibrator nor the lube have anything to do with anyone else. Porn is all about someone else. I really, really hate when men try to find a female equivalent to porn when the only female equivalent to porn, is porn.
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reader, anonymous, writes (18 June 2010): I seriously don't know how you guys don't get this.
"what beyond not being able to watch porn is the problem in the guy giving up porn?"
How about you try dating someone that demands that you give up your fantasies, something which brings a brief bit of release and joy into your life, because they feel threatened by them and are willing to end a relationship over it. A fantasy, something which we all have, something that's not real.
So yes the comparison between porn and twilight is wholley accurate, because for fans of twilight it brings a brief, benign bit of joy into their lives, so why the hell should they be told they have to give that up?
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reader, anonymous, writes (18 June 2010): It's the big deal that some women make about something we've done since our first erections and means nothing special to us but is our masturbation aid.
How would a woman feel if we asked her never to use the vibrator she always used since she was a teenager, because we feel insecure in comparison to its size or something? How would a woman feel if she were told that it was such a big deal to the guy that he's willing to break up over it?
Or that her guy is too insecure to be able to cope with her watching romance movies? Which are for women a source of emotional masturbation.
It all comes down to opinion, it means nothing to us, so what is the big deal? If it means nothing to us then why does it mean something you? You don't like it don't watch it? I don't like Twilight, I don't watch it, my girlfriend loves Edward Cullen, I'm not about to freak out and compare myself to him.
IT'S JUST FANTASY!
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reader, anonymous, writes (17 June 2010): This is verified as being by the original poster of the question"a lot of girls don't see what the problem is in the guy giving it up." I missed this first time around, but what beyond not being able to watch porn is the problem in the guy giving up porn?
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A
reader, anonymous, writes (17 June 2010): This is verified as being by the original poster of the questionWow female anon. You made me smile. :)
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female
reader, anonymous, writes (17 June 2010): But see? There are gems here such as:"so if a man needs a sexual release what should he do go to his nagging ol lady that makes it seem like sex is a chore any way."- Not ALL women are like this. Many wives (I'd say most) are actually SEXUAL BEINGS who enjoy pleasuring their husbands. I know that if I was married, I'd put even more effort in sex and pleasing my husband so he wouldn't get tired of the same 'ole, same 'ole. Of course, most women know that part of being a wife involves sex, if they don't then they're stupid and shouldn't even get married. I'm sorry that you married someone like that (I assume if you're speaking so much about married life is because you're married, otherwise, how would you know?). It's such a stereotypical view!"the way i see it if you dont like it pack your sht and leave that goes for the GFs if your married and he has a porn addiction you should help him get help if not leave."- Ok, it goes both ways. If you don't like a "nagging" wife or GF, then leave. Or get her counselling so she gets over her insecurities, if you're married.We all fantasize, fair enough. Some women are quite blunt and drool over actors in front of their boyfriends or husbands, and yes it is disrespectful IF the husband is not OK with it (as with everything, I mean, some couples dig porn and have no issues and that's OK TOO!!). But I agree that NOT all women like Twilight or whatever, and NOT all women want a hot, hung guy. Most women fantasize more about romance, which is something that normal men can easily provide. Just as women can easily provide spicier things, like learning to deep throat or trying positions that he wants. I myself did all this for my ex, even though I hated porn, didn't mean I hated sex. But I also didn't find Twilight or whatever titillating, did nothing for me.OK, let's continue with the gems:"Theres alot of porn hating female sout there hmm maybe if they went to the gym toned up a bit got rid of that cellulite there man wouldnt be watching porn.... now thats what the jerk in me wants to say but the truth is women need to realize that Men are different we think completely different. you and his porn are to diffrent things it doesnt mean your man isnt attracted to you. in my opinion f a guy wants to watch porn fine but theres a time and place he should do it when your asleep at work or basically when you dont kno hes doing it so as it doesnt offend you. seriously if men thought like women wed all have a hundred pars of workboots that we cant fit we where cute little sandals in a filthy subway and have a ton of dreses three sizes to small and we pile on make up and pad our bras to make our selves look better so we think then other women.Porn s fake and women are generally fake because this world is one big show"- WOW! I don't know what else to say! So stereotypical! So that's how you think about women? That we have nothing better to do than buy SHOES? I have a life you know, and shoes have always been of little interest to me, more functional than anything, but then again I'm very pragmatic. And to imply that maybe if women got rid of cellulite (FYI, cellulite happens in almost 90% of women, it's genetic and not directly tied to weight, it's NORMAL not a disease!) then men wouldn't turn to porn? Hey I'm slim, I have a lot of cellulite, is it my fault? I've never been overweight, I am fairly active and I'm toned, but I still have some on my fleshy thighs (genetic). IS IT MY FAULT!?!? But then like you, I'm gonna be a bitch and generalize because maybe men who watch porn are indeed jerks, since my ex did it and guess what??? HE ALSO CRITICIZED MY CELLULITE! I never criticized his gut, though."Well, If I was hung like a mule I could get it on with all those chicks too). Like I said it's a fantasy I think the word is vicarious."- So you say, basically, that you're settling? If you had a big penis, you think you could get it on with those "chicks" (I assume you mean porn stars). So, basically, you're settling for women who're less hot than those "chicks"? It's your fantasy to be with women like that. OK. But that means if you could, you would have a woman who looked like that in real life, it's just that it's not something easy to obtain. But in the end, the thing is that you DO think they are ideal and better than normal women. And that's what hurts.Some women are superficial bitches, yeah, not all of us are saints either. But most of us are not, not to that extent at least. From all the women I know, I've never heard any of them say that they would like their boyfriend to LOOK more like R. Pattinson, Brad Pitt, whoever. And even if they drool seeing these actors, I agree it's the same as guys drooling over the chick from Transformers, which is not the same as porn. Especially since women may like guys to be more romantic, like the characters, because I honestly wouldn't like dating a guy who was such a DOUCHE like R. Pattinson or Brad Pitt are, no matter how attractive they may seem. They're even bigger jerks than some normal jerks, since they've got such big egos that they think they can do/say whatever they want. They're movie star jerks!But I've heard guys say "I wish my girl looked more like that" about platinum blondes with plastic tits. A lot of guys actually. I didn't choose to have cellulite or small breasts, now I also have to grin and bear it when a guy watches porn just because I don't live up to that standard and he deserves variety? I prefer to be alone, thanks.
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reader, olderthandirt  +, writes (16 June 2010):
 Men live out fantasy sex via porn and obsese over the fact that they can never seem to make thier partner respond in the manner dipicted- We(yes I'm a man) then must assume it's because we are not as well hung as the men in the porn clips...I wish I wasn't so insecure about my "normal" size but I am and I'm certain most of my guy friends feel the same.( Well, If I was hung like a mule I could get it on with all those chicks too). Like I said it's a fantasy I think the word is vicarious.
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reader, Miamine +, writes (13 June 2010):
As a woman who has watched porn, I'll tell you that it's the body movements that are most exciting and not the people or how beautiful, well stacked or well hung they seem.. all that is irrelevant, couldn't even tell you what any of the people look like.
I do however prefer erotic fiction and romance much more than porn. Much more sexually interesting and raunchy in my opinion, and in it's effects, I see no difference between it and porn.. yes one is visual and one is text, but they both give me orgasms, and with the romance/erotic books I am fantasing about a man, with visual porn and real actors I don't do that at all..
It's sad that women find the need to allow no comparisons between pornography and other things. Being a woman I know this technique, it's saying that no matter what you do, you are perfect and you are woman and can never be wrong, however a man is never right, because the situation is always "different" and not the same at all..
If a man has an affair, he is a evil person who cheats, if a woman has an affair "it's different because she had her reasons".... hypocritical behaviour if you ask me...
No difference between pornography and erotic fiction.. I orgasm just the same.. and I can prefer the fantasy man (be he prince charming or long hung dick) over my partner, if my head is messed up.. but like most people who indulge in fantasy, I'm sensible enough to know that it dosen't replace real people and it dosen't make you compare reality with fantasy and find the reality lacking..
PS: My mum brought me the first "women's" magazine to show naked men with penis on view.. Me and my girlfriends hated it.. man dick was soft and it seemed more suitable for homosexuals and was a very big turn off.. the magazine went bust, we women didn't buy it, even though it was aimed at us...
When (some) women want sexual stimulation, they much prefer to watch romantic movies like "The piano" (man touching leg through hole in tights is the sexiest thing I ever seen) or read a book and use their imaginations instead.
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reader, anonymous, writes (13 June 2010): while reading this question i thought of something else. Why is there so much porn aimed towards men, mags etc also, and not much for women? The only time i've ever seem semi naked or naked guys in mags, they're gay mags! Not really my type of thing. Yet my fiance buys zoo every wk (bikini clad women but not nude) and there are so many nude mags out there for guys. If its so easy to access for men, why is there nothing aimed at women? I wouldn't mind bein able to buy a mag every wk with half naked guys, men just in jocks etc. If its fair for the guys why is it not fair for the girls? My partner says he doesnt care if i watch porn or if i have pictures of naked guys etc, but this is much harder to get then it is for him to get a bunch of pics of naked women. If you type naked guys or similar into google half the stuff that shows is again, for gay guys! I dont have a prob with this as such, but shouldn't there be something aimed just for women? A mag that we can buy thats similar to zoo, ralph, etc. The arguement is that girls aren't as visual as guys, but i dont think that is completely true. I enjoy lookin at a decent male body prob as much as my guy likes lookin at boobs. So why is there nothing ive seen aimed towards women? Just a thought..
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reader, anonymous, writes (13 June 2010): There are brain differences between men and women. IMO we are crazy to ignore this.
Its not an excuse to claim that men can do no wrong with porn and women are just as guilty every time they read a sexy novel. I am just saying this mental difference is real and it deserves to be taken into account, that's all.
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reader, Miamine +, writes (12 June 2010):
"Why is it normal for him to need to fantasize and masturbate to perfect women, but abnormal and wrong for her to be upset?"
Why do women always need to judge themselves against other females and put themselves down. Whatever happened to the feminist movement, to feeling secure and beautiful in yourself no matter what a man says or does...
Some women spend to much time watching what men do, and not enough on finding hobbies and intrests in life that make them feel confident and strong.
Why the hell get upset about what's in a man's head.. men don't get upset and watch what you do.
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reader, RAINORFIRE +, writes (12 June 2010):
 Theres alot of porn hating female sout there hmm maybe if they went to the gym toned up a bit got rid of that cellulite there man wouldnt be watching porn.... now thats what the jerk in me wants to say but the truth is women need to realize that Men are different we think completely different. you and his porn are to diffrent things it doesnt mean your man isnt attracted to you. in my opinion f a guy wants to watch porn fine but theres a time and place he should do it when your asleep at work or basically when you dont kno hes doing it so as it doesnt offend you. seriously if men thought like women wed all have a hundred pars of workboots that we cant fit we where cute little sandals in a filthy subway and have a ton of dreses three sizes to small and we pile on make up and pad our bras to make our selves look better so we think then other women.
Porn s fake and women are generally fake because this world is one big show
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reader, anonymous, writes (11 June 2010): "Soon the media is gonna have to think of other ways to mess up society and perhaps there will be a role reversal... elements of it have already sprung..."
What on earth are you talking about anon?
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reader, anonymous, writes (11 June 2010): There is no all inclusive activity that all men or women engage in....not all men watch porn, not all women object to it. Happiness lies in finding someone that shares your opinions/life habits in the areas that count. No one is going to be exactly like you, but you can find someone that has the same values and character as you. Life is made up of choices. It is the wise woman that chooses her partner and doesn't let the man choose her. If more women that object to porn choose to be with men that can live without it, things would change. The availability of porn on the net will not change, but people's openness of it being an acceptable thing in a relationship would.Porn addiction is a whole other topic. Any addiction in relationships is destructive and should be a deal breaker for healthy individuals. The behaviors that manifest from addictions make the desired substance a priority rather than their partner. If one person is addicted and the other is not, that unaffected person is giving more than receiving. There is an inherent imbalance in this scenario. Addicts, in general, lie about their addictions, spend a lot of time with their addictions and spend even more time covering up their tracks. All of this leads to inconsistencies in their behaviors. One minute they are present for their partner, the next they are not. When they lie to cover their tracks, they lose trust from their partners, their partners become suspicious....it's a viscous circus.Sorry, didn't mean to hijack the subject matter. I have had experience first hand with a partner that has a porn addiction and I fear for this nation's youth because I truly believe that porn is no less harmful than heroin. Some people can use it responsibly and others lose control of their ability to control their use. We will see what happens with the youth of today. I think in the future we will having education available regarding the usage of porn, but right now it is a novelty that is hijacking men's and women's sexuality with a free and unrestrained acceptance and that is sad.
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reader, olderthandirt +, writes (11 June 2010):
The aurgument is age old[women's sex drive and fantasy is nearly the opposite of the male's] Phsycological or physiological? who knows? All I know is that we were dating she did things I still wonder about and I had the stamina of a horse. Now we're older and there is NO sex.
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reader, dirtball +, writes (11 June 2010):
I think you're making overly broad generalizations. If it bothers them, then you'll quit?!? Really? I think not. Like anything in life we enjoy, our selfish nature takes over. My friend's BF hates that she smokes. He takes her cigarettes away when he sees her. She knows it bothers him, but she still does it because she likes it. She doesn't need cigarettes any more than most people need porn, it is just something they like and don't want to give up. People are selfish. Everyone is different. This argument goes no where because everyone has their own views. What your best bet is, is to find someone who shares your views. But be wary, what people say, and what they do is often very different.Also, you don't need to accomodate anyone. If your guy is watching porn and you don't like it, speak up. If he doesn't change, drop him.
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reader, anonymous, writes (11 June 2010): This is verified as being by the original poster of the questionNo the equivalent of a man watching porn is women watching porn. It's insulting to imply that reading Twilight is the same thing is watching porn because you're saying we're not sexual enough to understand. Women enjoy orgasms just as much as men and guess what. We masturbate too and enjoy it. Guess what, women frequently enjoy porn too. But 1) we care enough about our partners to not do it when it bothers them and 2) there isn't a lot out there for us and it's kind of unhot watching a woman get double penetrated up the ass or bathe in semen. We get horny and need to release too. To imply that we get the same pleasure from reading a tween novel about vampires that a man does from masturbating to porn implies that we are not sexual enough to enjoy masturbation, orgasms, or sex. That is NOT women's porn, it is a movie that doesn't show sex or a book that doesn't even talk about the actual sex. Romantic movies raise men's expectations of women too. To imply that that's women's porn is ridiculous. Women's porn is watching porn and nothing less.As for your first comment, drooling over a ripped body in a movie is the same as you drooling over Angelina Jolie in a bikini in a movie. Drooling over a huge penis and a guy who can last for hours in bed is the same as you watching porn.
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reader, maverick494 +, writes (11 June 2010):
I disagree with Cerberus. Comparing Twilight and those other things to some blow up doll doing the dirty on your screen is pretty off.
Also, it's stereotypical. I'm a girl and I hate Twilight. I'm also not going to drool in front of my boyfriend whenever I see a sixpack on the screen, which --I might add-- there are much fewer of than girls with big boobs. I mean, look on TV. How many hot girls are there with cleavage? Now compare it to the guys who show their abs? I think my point is quite clear.
I think a woman has a right to complain when her husband/boyfriend watches porn in such a way you have to be blind not to notice. I have no problem with it in general. I just don't want to see or know about it.
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reader, dirtball +, writes (11 June 2010):
I'm not getting into this debate again, but I do want to address one thing. Women in porn are *far* from perfect. Most are pretty skanky. Most people, men and women, carry very negative self images. Knowing their significant other is aroused by others often damages that more. This is an issue we need to deal with internally. I can't speak for all men, but for me, porn is about the act they are doing, not the people involved. They are all fake anyway. In my real (read "non fantasy") life I much prefer a natural woman. The more I love someone, the more I like their "flaws" as well.
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reader, anonymous, writes (11 June 2010): Why is it that when a woman drools over some ripped body unrealistically perfect guy in romance movies guys are just supposed to accept that?
How is it the guys fault for having a problem with that, yet girls see it as perfectly acceptable?
Why is it never even a question of a woman sacrificing watching Twilight with her friends, comparing their boyfriends and wishing they were more like Edward Cullen?
Why is it normal for woman to fantasize over having this guy and it's wrong for a guy to get upset about it?
We all fantasize, the only difference is women like to compare fantasy to reality, guys don't. Girls compare guys to onscreen hunks and they also compare themselves to porn actresses that their boyfriends watch. Guys don't compare their girlfriends to porn actresses we only watch porn for the short amount of time that it takes to get off, yet a woman will watch movies and buy magazines with pictures and details of the lives of Robert Pattison. They'll discuss him with their friends about how hot he is and great etc.
If my girlfriend wants to stop me watching porn then she can stop watching the Twilight series or any other movie with an attractive male lead because that's women's version of porn.
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reader, anonymous, writes (11 June 2010): I AGREE.
Think positively though- women are so exploited and degraded and unfairly treated in so many ways- it can't get much worse.
Soon the media is gonna have to think of other ways to mess up society and perhaps there will be a role reversal... elements of it have already sprung...
e.g. men getting angry about movies like Twilight and New Moon- featuring Jacob Black and his yummy abs and then telling their gfs to chill when they get angry about porn.
I hate the double standard.
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reader, anonymous, writes (11 June 2010): I agree with you that the porn issue should not be totally one-sided. IMO couples need to find a compromise they can live with. That may be the woman allows porn or it may be the man stops looking at it, or maybe something in between.
The way women feel about porn seems to bring up some of the same mismatched emotions that men feel about women's past sex lives. One gender feels like they are suffering an ongoing wound over something the other gender does not feel the same way about at all. The hurting person tries to convey how they feel only to hear, "Oh, grow up and get over it! Stop being so insecure!"
Times have changed and both genders have some compromising to do.
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reader, RAINORFIRE +, writes (11 June 2010):
most of the complaints Ive read on here are women saying their man watching porn makes them feel bad not wanted ETC.... ok thats not the mans fault. its his fault if his porn watching interferes with his husbandry duties ie paying the bills cutting the grass i wont even put sex nto that because some men cant have sex or dont want to regardless of the porn. porn is just a tool nothing more it can be pleasurable so therfore cause addiction but its not the mans fault that his woman feels bad that he watches it. so if a man needs a sexual release what should he do go to his nagging ol lady that makes it seem like sex is a chore any way.
Women have learned to use sex as a barganing chip as power but most men realize this they where masterbating and watching porn long before they met you and there not going to stop . the way i see it if you dont like it pack your sht and leave that goes for the GFs if your married and he has a porn addiction you should help him get help if not leave.
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reader, YouWish +, writes (11 June 2010):
 Those are all good points! Why indeed? Many guys would go ballistic if they knew their girls were masturbating while watching other men, yet they have no problem flipping on the internet to watch and get off on the silicone shaved beauties.
Not every guy watches porn. Others got into the habit when they were single, but got serious about loving their girls and put it away. Still others found themselves addicted, but realized in time how devastating to their intimacy it is. It's about finding the right guys.
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reader, Jmtmj  +, writes (11 June 2010):
 You really can go into this debate as deeply as you like, but at the end of the day this problem isn't going anywhere. A lot of guys don't see what the problem is and a lot of girls don't see what the problem is in the guy giving it up.
Nobody is really right, people just need to be upfront about how they view porn use before the relationship even begins. Consider it among those important initial "interview" questions or deliberately coincidental discussions that happen before you even consider dating this person. At least then you know what you're getting into and should you not get who you thought you were getting, all the more easy it is to reach a compromise or leave and find the genuine article.
We're never going to have the emotions women have and women are never going to have a penis. Case closed.
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