A
female
age
41-50,
anonymous
writes:Why is it that after sex , a man devalues a woman and views her as " cheap stuff " or " slut " but you don't hear women calling men " cheap " ?Why is it that for a woman to be able to make the man stay interested in her, i.e. want her not just for sex, she has to make him " work " to get into her pants ? ( eg. make him wait... make him try harder to win u over...) In other words make him find you valuable n priceless because he had to work so hard to get what he wants aka sex. And therefore in that process women have to suppress their desire to have sex with the guy jus so he stays...( freaking unfair !! ) . Women want sex too. But women don't devalue men after sex .Wish I knew a better way to make my question clear.
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male
reader, anonymous, writes (8 February 2011): I think of women as slutty when they engage in frequent sex with random partners to satisfy a primal urge and have no interest in the other person or the act itself. If a woman uses discretion, respects herself, her partner(s) and her sexuality and just wants to have fun or anventure, love or passion, and knows how to get it in a sophisticated, respectful way, I consider that very womanly and attractive....not at all slutty, regardless of the quantity of lovers.
Discretion, respect and mutual awareness are key.
A
female
reader, Miamine  +, writes (7 February 2011):
 I once had sex with a guy (one night stand) and then asked if I was now a "slut".....
Oh dear, the look on his face was priceless.. he looked so deeply hurt, so upset, that I could think about him in such negative terms. Poor man looked like a kicked dog.
It's the men you know, guess I could become a prostitute and I still wouldn't fit the "slut" tag.
Yes the guys I know, do call some women "sluts", but that is usually women who allow themselves to be treated badly, rather than women who sleep with many partners. Self confidence and assertiveness seem to make terms like "slut" go away. Several famous women including "Madonna" have loads of sex partners, yet never get called "slut".
I hate the word slut.. it has little descriptive quality.
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A
male
reader, Odds  +, writes (7 February 2011):
 "Real love is given freely with your whole heart and soul, without the fear that you need to compete."
This question is about the earliest stages of a relationship - first week or two, and the need to wait for sex. Sure, once the relationship is established, give freely with your whole heart and soul - I've told people on this site to do exactly that - once the relationship is established.
If you believe I'm wrong about that, go meet a new person and give them all your love and commitment a week after meeting them - tell us how that works out for you.
"As long as you have your sex first in your mind, you will lose in all of your relationships."
Never said sex is first in my mind, not sure where you got that impression. It is, however, an important part of any relationship. Witness the number of questions on this site related to "I love so-and-so, but our sex life sucks, how can I fix it?"
I don't really appreciate the implication that your definition of "real love" somehow makes mine a losing deal, either. I hope it works for you, though.
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A
reader, anonymous, writes (6 February 2011): "It's entirely possible to see a woman as a real person and still realize that sex and romance are competitive - there is winning, there is losing, and there are competitors."
Real love is given freely with your whole heart and soul, without the fear that you need to compete. It's two people who see each other for what they are and who love that, forgetting that they're sex vs sex.
As long as you have your sex first in your mind, you will lose in all of your relationships.
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A
male
reader, Odds +, writes (4 February 2011):
@ Anon "A lot of what you say holds..."
It's entirely possible to see a woman as a real person and still realize that sex and romance are competitive - there is winning, there is losing, and there are competitors. Trying not to say "players" here because, honestly, I think that's just a way to have fun while losing. Relationships are the way to go.
@ Janniepeg
You are absolutely right that a woman has to have actual value in addition to presenting it. You've got the "waiting increases value" thing backwards, though - it's more, "valuable girls wait." The waiting thing is to present the appearance of value; perception matters just as much as reality here.
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A
male
reader, anonymous, writes (4 February 2011): I trhink Jannepegs answer is good too!
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A
reader, anonymous, writes (4 February 2011): A lot of what you say holds true for many people, but these are also cliches.
Speaking about hetero relationships, as long as a man feels a woman is ”something“ to be won or bought, he will never experience a true relationship. He will never know the woman as she truly is. That relationship is based on his ego alone.
Not everyone thinks this way though. So just do as you feel, realizing though sex is sacred and a part of love and not something to be taken lightly imo.
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A
male
reader, anonymous, writes (4 February 2011): Odds' response is the most accurate and honest answer I have ever read about this. As a male, this completely resonates with me and I have bookmarked it for future reference. Next time a women brings up the "double-standard" argument, I hope they realize that men are also held to a standard(e.g. the female slut vs. male virgin parallel) except that this male standard is never acknowledged. Additionally, despite the fact that we as individuals like to consider ourselves as completely in control of every aspect of our existence, the fact remains that our actions are in part persuaded by our biology.
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A
female
reader, janniepeg  +, writes (4 February 2011):
 Men like women who play hard to get because they think that increases a woman's value. This tactic is not going to work a long time if the woman doesn't have value herself. For a man to appreciate you for the long term you need more than just holding it in. After he unwraps his "present" he may be disappointed if she doesn't really have what a virgin/maiden is supposed to deliver like if she can't hold a conversation, can't cook, is rude to her mother in law.
A woman is called slut because an experienced woman can compare dicks, and she is likely to reject an inexperienced man. A man's value is determined by how happy the woman is and if the woman is not satisfied sexually she is likely to leave. This brings great pain and feelings of failure to a man. The shaming of a "slut" is one form of oppression, which resulted in things like foot binding, genital mutilation, and confinement indoors.
If a man determines your value upon when you give out, this is not a man that you should be with. A man who sees your desire as authentic and at the same time encourage you to express that desire, is rare, and even rarer in Asia. If a man worries about whether I am going to cheat because I am more aggressive than the average Asian lady, then I would tell him not to bother because it's just not going to work out. Luckily, I had never been devalued in my life and if all men are close minded like that, I would just rather be single. Not all women who are true to their desires are sleazy and drink beer. We have sex because we enjoy being with a man, not because we want attention, or gifts in exchange.
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A
male
reader, Odds +, writes (4 February 2011):
Ooh, fun question.
First, women are worse to each other about the whole "slut" thing than men are, generally. At least that's what it looks like to me. And putting out early for one person makes it a good bet (not a guarantee, but still a very good bet) that you've put out early and often before. That's why no guy on earth believes a woman who, in the heat of the moment, tells him "I don't usually do this!" Sure you don't.
Flip side? Calling a man a virgin is an insult, not so much for women.
Second, women and men define what is considered attractive or unattractive in each other. He-sluts would be punished if women chose to dislike them (for example, by not sleeping with them). You won't find a man alive, including the he-sluts themselves, who doesn't think the world would be a better place without them, though.
Men choose to devalue sluts (and, by extension, value the women who make them wait) because we believe they are less likely to be loyal to us. This is a very powerful instinct which evolved over thousands of years to prevent us from being cuckolded. In a state of nature, being cheated on carries higher penalties (in a genetic sense) than it does for women - not to say being cheated on is no big deal to women, of course.
Thing is, paternity tests and birth control don't make that instinct go away. It's always there, and it creates emotions that we can't avoid.
On the other hand, women tend to desire more experienced guys - not necessarily as boyfriends (their loyalty is in question), but as baby-daddies. Promiscuous men's offspring are more likely to have lots of offspring, so it's evolutionarily advantageous for women to be impregnated by he-sluts.
Third, women know exactly what the terms of the game are before they hit the streets. They know that if they put out early, guys will leave them; they know that if they rack up too high a number, guys won't want them. This is a surprise to no one. Guys (and chaste girls) see it as a cop-out if girls ignore this knowledge, then demand to be treated like their less-promiscuous counterparts.
Fourth, guys figure, if a girl would put out for a guy for the price of two beers and a tequila shot, why should he invest any more effort in her than that guy did? If the next guy has to date her for six weeks, pay for her meals, drive her around, and be fun and interesting the whole time before he gets laid, it implies that he is less valuable to her than the guy she banged after twenty minutes for a few drinks.
I see as completely fair - in that it sucks for both sides. Most women can get sex virtually at will, and the price of that is that they are admired for being able to hold back, and shamed for going crazy. Most men have a difficult time finding someone new to have sex with, and the price of that is we are admired for being able to get laid, and shamed for being unable to do so. Only real winners are the small percentage of people who are the most most attractive - women so hot no one cares if they're sluts, and guys so hot they can get laid at will (the way an average-looking girl can).
Would like to point out, too, that if a woman waits long enough, a guy does not devalue her after sex with him - he values her more.
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A
female
reader, lemonyliz +, writes (4 February 2011):
Number one, I think you are meeting the wrong kind of men. Not all men devalue women post-sex. However, I understand your frustration and struggle because I agree that many men do. This is generally speaking because of how our society for the past several hundreds of years has trained men. That being said, there are also plenty of women who devalue men post sex. There is no real answer to this dilemma other than to find guys who have a little perspective, who won't devalue you or other women. maybe this means waiting to have sex for a little while-- but maybe it's worth it? I don't buy into the idea that you have to play hard to get and make them work for it for them to respect you. I think there has to be a lot of mutual respect and making them work and/or playing hard to get when that is just not you isn't respectful so much as insincere.
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A
female
reader, leylaness +, writes (4 February 2011):
 in a mans eyes and in womans to a woman who just gives in ana has sex with anyone doesnt respect herself so why should a man, thats how ppl think. Women are naturl more selective when it comes to men where as men arent, thats just the science of us. So seen as were expected to be selective a woman who has one night stands is looked on as being easy and does it with who ever. Its the way people think unfortunatly. If a woman wants to have one night stands she has to deal with everything afterwards unfortuantly=/. Be careful one night stands must be protected!!!! if a man sleeps with a woamn just as quick as she slept with him then hes probs done it before and you dont know what he has, pluse you migh get pregent and you dont want to have a child withsomeone who you dont knwo very well.
I dont kno if your talking abotu your self sweetie but if you are then be confident do let other peoples cments upset you and as long as you show that you respect yourself and that your not a "slut" they will treat you that way. Pople only treat you they way you let them treat you
good luckx
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