A
male
age
36-40,
*rOveranalysing
writes:I am a gay guys with have two other gay friends, who are extremely sexual and attractive. Every time we meet someone who is remotely attractive they make a b-line for them within minutes. They have slept with or tried to sleep with maybe 85% of the guys we meet and find attractive. This makes me feel really awkward and judgmental of them. I know I only like very few guys, but I never feel I have a chance and I’m also turned off when I know my close friends have been intimate with guys I’m into, it can create drama and competitiveness in me. It feels hurtful and like a betrayal. Their argument is I chose my value system and the world is for their enjoyment. I find myself moralizing and questioning how its easy to find a relationship built on love, when connections are never allowed to flourish because these two friends are like submarines and jump into bed with everyone at the drop of a hat. I find it distracting and upsetting. Their relationship to sex seems very laid back, they see it as just fun and its not connecting necessarily to strong emotions. They don’t necessarily feel the need to not to sleep with someone if they are an asshole, where I feel like a hypocrite if I do that. For me love/emotions and sex are strongly intertwined. I find myself paranoid around these friends and questioning our friendship as I feel they are targeting guys I’m with without considering my own emotions or my value system. I know I cant control who they sleep with nor do I wish to, but it seems their net is cast very wide, I don’t know if its really about the person or just about having as much sex as possible. My approach is more like spear fishing, and I single out people I want and go for it. I’m turned off if I discover someone is simultaneously trying their chances with 2 or 3 people I know, I feel it cheapens the interactions. This is jarring to me with my notions of slutiness and being easy, but they would argue they are liberated from that and are just doing what they enjoy, and its my problem if I can't get the sex I want. They also have no problem with getting with guys I’ve slept with or rejected immediately after, they see my relationship to those guys as totally unconnected to their own relationships. They don’t see it as sloppy seconds. They told me if I like someone to tell them, but they are so quick in their targeting of guys I’m left spinning and uncomfortable I’m not even able to gather my thoughts about what I think. Before I know it they’ve slept with a guy and are done with them (unless they decide to revisit). They argue I have a low self esteem and are threatened by them, and if someone likes me they will like me. My view is low dangling fruit will always be eaten first and they are not considering other around them and almost cock blocking. If I see a friend who is interested in a guy, and that guy is testing waters with me, I wont go for it because I know ultimately I might hurt that friend and my feelings are not that strong. I’m so confused about to navigate my way through hyper slutty friends and if I’m just a judgemental, insecure person. Please help.
View related questions:
cheap, insecure, self esteem Reply to this Question
Share |
Fancy yourself as an agony aunt? Add your answer to this question! A
male
reader, MrOveranalysing +, writes (22 June 2017):
MrOveranalysing is verified as being by the original poster of the questionAgreed, with both of you. I definitely don't mean to come off as judgmental (though I am being judgemental without realising). Im trying to figure out my own relationship between love and sex. I think you can meet a potential partner anywhere, including a club (in fact I think clubs might be your best bet if you're picky as you have plenty of options in front of you). But also to be aware that the guys who frequent clubs every week, arent really gonna be bf material, as drugs and alcohol are usually in the mix.I think the difficulty I've had also is just dealing with other people approach to sex. For some it really is just an interaction, which is totally their right to define. But if u have expectations and their expecations are "you are a fuck, see you when i see you". then its bound to cause friction.I think the every man for the themselves is very good for people who thrive on competition as you said, and might even be turned on by it all. Whereas I know myself, and its not reflection on my personality or attractiveness, I simply operate better and achieve more when I'm not thrust into those environments, cos I get jealous and also upset by the "no rules" approach of some people, which I see as a unethical and just plain dumb. But if it works for them, then cool. I think also these kinds of guys, definitely get a kick out of winning a guy over u, which i find quite weird and depressing, as its not really about the guy but only about how they "won". Whatever, to get what I want i must focus on my own needs and if someone doesnt make me feel comfortable, i just spend less time with them.
A
female
reader, CindyCares  +, writes (22 June 2017):
 Uhm- and you are looking for " meaningful connections" in gay bars and gay clubs ? Based on what, the meaningful conversations and sincere exchanges which you definitely cannot have in that type of venue ?
Pardon my cynicism, but I am not just talking by hearsay. I lived many years in New York, which has a flourishing gay scene , and being the " fag hag " ( pardon me for the politically incorrect term, then again I did not invent it ) that I always was, let me assure you that I am veeery familiar with the scene, and its dating and mating rituals, and its unwritten laws.
In that type of superficial, instant gratification ( but very fun at times, I agree ) venues and situations you refer to, I am afraid the rule is what your friends observe : it's every man for himself and may the best man win by whatever technique works. Your scruples and sensitivities have no place there. Your ethical code and mental approach to scoring, err, let's call it " meeting new people " if you wish, may also be better and more sensitive and mature than your friends'- it probably IS,- the problem is that you have no right nor reason to ask your pals to take it into any particular account- because that's not how it works, and that's not the way the game is played !
I understand your discomfort, you know ? still- you make me think of a guy who wants to play rugby then he complains because everybody is pushing him around or because he gets dirt on his shirt. If you don't like that- then don't play rugby ! Change game ! Play tennis instead !, and nobody will lay a finger on you- you know what I mean ?
Ref, your question if you should fly solo, the answer is a resounding YES . Of course ! You don't even enjoy the company of your slutty friends, it stresses you out - and you hate competing with them, while instead in certain situations it's all about competition, competition can be a big aphrodisiac , as I guess it may be for your friends.
And not only you should fly solo, but you should also fly over different lands, if you are really looking for a more serious connection. Have you heard what the Owl said ? He met his partner in a plant nursery !
The club and bar scene ( particularly the gay one ) is not "evil " of course, it is just not very conducive, if not accidentally and very seldom, to the type of thing you are looking for. If you want to buy a steak you go to a butcher shop, and if you want to buy a gold ring you go to a jewelry store. And you must know which is which.
...............................
A
male
reader, MrOveranalysing +, writes (22 June 2017):
MrOveranalysing is verified as being by the original poster of the questionCindy Cares, I am talking about more meaningful connections and potential relationships. Definitely. Do I think I'm morally superior? Only in so far that some guys are off limits, and I'm not doing this smooth Mr. Nice guy act to everyone, hoping someone eventually sticks. This reeks of desperation but also feels inauthentic as my goal is not "sex" per se or trophies, but amazing people who i am really into.Maybe its me that has changed, and I definitely enjoyed the game, but now I crave for more and feel disappointed that things don"t lead to more. I also find myself ruling out partners or being turned off if I discover they have slept with either of these two friends (thats 90% of people who we meet btw). Maybe I should fly solo, this way i know someone is hanging out with me because of me, not because of my friends and also removes competition/distraction element. What do you think?
...............................
A
reader, anonymous, writes (22 June 2017): I am gay also, and I have encountered similar problems with gay acquaintances. First, don't judge them if you tend to travel in a pack or clique. Running around in a group only places you in the position to be competitive; and keep tabs on everyone else around you. They are right to some degree, it's every man for himself. Only, they are free-spirits and like to live-up to the gay stereotypes of narcissism and promiscuity. Most people in their youth go through this phase.
So let them. They don't need you to be their moral compass.
If you choose to run in their clique; then don't be offended by their flagrant and slutty-behavior. First-off, telling them how it bothers you only bolsters their egos; and gives them more reason to show you up. It gives them an edge.
They get a thrill out of nabbing guys from you and each other. The objective is to see who gets him first. I think you're mature and experienced enough in gay-life to know this.
I do commend you. You are a breath of fresh air; to believe in emotional-connection and meaningful sex. You are boyfriend/husband material; but you're running with the wrong crew. They see your potential and they're jealous. They're doing their very best to throw you off-track, knock you off-balance; and to belittle you in-front of "trade."
"Trade": A guy being considered by a promiscuous queen for sex. The loose definition.
Portraying you as the frumpy one in the group. That way, the guys don't notice the better attributes you possess. So they'll cheapen every outing to nothing more than a manhunt and a slut-fest.
You're just too busy being seen with the in-crowd and hobnobbing with the popular-types; who flaunt their looks and show-off. You get your own little ego-boost by doing so! You're more mature and conservative. You don't care to stand-out as much; so you're the odd-ball and dim-light in a group of flashy self-assured glamour-queens.
My boyfriend and I are over 40, and we're hardworking and successful. My partner became a millionaire over the last five years. He has been owning his business since he was 24, and it took him over two decades to get where he is. His friends did everything they could to keep as apart.
They tried to poison his mind, telling him I was out for his money. They snubbed me at parties, and tried to embarrass me with glib comments and subtle insults. I'm well-educated and I've been around the block. I know how to handle the most difficult types. I'm successful in my own right, have a great career, and I don't need his money. I know not to hang in their groups; but we entertain them all the same. They've come down off their high-horses once they realized I don't scare easy; and I'm well-established and independent. Snob me if you like, doesn't phase me. He's still my guy! He approached me first. I did notice his hot bod, and tattooed biceps. I won't lie! It turns out he has a heart of gold, and it's not just about his appearance. He's real and humble. He's very boyish around his parents. I love that!
You need to travel solo, and let your own light shine. Stop being part of a clique; because the behavior you describe is characteristic of cliquish gay men. You harshly judge them, yet you belong to their group. You're thereby being judged by the company you keep. So the "trade" assumes you're just birds of a feather; and count you the same as the rest. Only they are more aggressive about what they want. They just go for it!
They are lucky at getting sex-partners; because when guys are looking for a quick hookup, they're the type most likely to find him. If you're looking for more, you should travel alone; so you are noticed for your own good-looks and personality-traits. Not judged according to the people you hang around. You lessen the competition by traveling alone or in smaller numbers. Break from the herd every chance you get.
You also have to be confident, and add some flirtation once you realize you have a guy's attention. He needs to know that you're as interested in him as he is in you. If you remain in a state of neutrality and self-righteousness; he'll think you're just a stuck-up prude.
I'm low-key, and that's how my boyfriend's friends all tried to classify me. I don't stand-out, but I'm told I'm a good-looking guy. Mostly by women and "twinks." They love me! I can turn a head, but I've found what I want. Yes, my own friends are envious. That's their problem. I don't flaunt, because I was dumped once thinking all was good. It can happen again, any time. You never know.
People were jealous that we took to each other so well. I didn't know anything about him. He was just a muscular-guy in a home improvement outlet; buying building materials, and he saw me in the garden department. I know what you're thinking...don't you dare go there! I am top, bottom, front, back, both-sides, and a center. I hate being categorized according to preferred sexual-positions.
He followed me around and asked me a dumb question, I knew he was just trying to get my attention. It's all now history and we're a couple now. BTW, I was "alone" at the time.
I have a good group of friends. One is a former entertainer; very stuck on himself, and always the center of attention. We've parted ways; because I just couldn't deal with him anymore. Of course, he put word out on me; but sometimes that's the gay community for you. You have to be your own man, you can have friends; but sometimes you have to part-ways when your values and morals clash. Row your own boat!
I wouldn't say you have to be like-minded. I like people of differing philosophies and points of view. I learn things from them, and it widens my outlook. They challenge my prejudices and help me to see things clearer and broader.
Like you, I just don't want to be mistaken as a groupie for their cause; or one of their cronies. So I mix and mingle; but stay a safe-distance from catty-types.
I try not to judge people according to the values I choose to live by; but I can choose my friends according to their best qualities and things we share in-common. If they offer me their opinions of me; I might offer them mine. Not defensively; but because they opened that door.
I'm not shy, I'm wise, and I speak my mind. I try to be a good person and help others. You have to be a lone-wolf sometimes to be noticed for your own personality and character. That's me. The loner, and the oddball!
...............................
A
female
reader, CindyCares +, writes (21 June 2017):
I confess that I am more on the side of your slutty friends. Non because I like promiscuous people of any gender or because I like promiscuity. But because, tbh, I find your predicament quite hypocritical.
Basically, you are complaining that they have got game and you don't.
Come on, unless I am grossly mistaken.. we are not talking about relationships here, or meeting someone nice and see where it leads... unless totally by accident.
We are talking about classic cruising here. Basic weekend night hooking up.
You all are hunting/ or fishing for sex.
Only , you are spearfishing your prey - and your friends cast their nets very wide.
Different methods but the intent is the same. Getting some. Their approach seems to be more successful, and they get first choice- but then , rather than convincing them to change their fishing method , you should change yours. Or, go fish in different waters. Or , even better, go solo on your fishing expeditions, without your " friends ".
Yes, sorry but to me you come off like a sore loser, - the kind of guy who says that being rich is immoral, and money is the root of all evils- just because he CAN'T, for the life of him, make any decent money and he would feel more comfortable if all their friends were poor too.
As for me, I don't buy that much that it is a problem of different value systems, different morals, and you being more ethical than them. Well if you are so different, and so disapproving of what they do, and feel so morally superior- why are you still hanging out with them ? why are you spending time with them, why are they still your friends ?? people with very different, incompatible values do not have much to say or to give to each other . Rather than holding on to them , basking on your moral superiority and gnawed by envy- get rid of them, and if it is really an issue of compatible values- seek the company of like minded people, who have similar approaches to yours to sex and ..fishing !
...............................
|
