A
male
age
51-59,
*amfam
writes: I am almost 40, married, to my grade school crush, I love her, more than anything. We were found each other 2 years ago after over 20 years graduating high school, we led very different lives, and now I am having big trouble dealing with her past. The details have not been easy to obtain, and I still do not have the who picture. We are trying to conceive, we both want it, but so far, it is not happening. I found out a few months ago, that she had an abortion at 14, I was shocked, and have tried to move on from that, not think about it. Since we reconnected, the men from her past have been an issue, too much to go into in one sitting typing this out. So I have had questions, to some I was told it was "none of my business" random fights from disagreements, statements, two nights ago, the biggest yet, I tried to get her to talk about her past, openly, so that I could hear about it, deal with it, and move on. She has been cheated on, and cheated. She has had one night stands, but will not say how many, or how often, as to the number of men, she does not know, she told me there have been so many, she has no count. We are going back to therapy tomorrow, a new therapist, who I hope can help with our issues. I have read endless posts on countless forums all saying this same thing, the difference being, they all had a number to deal with, I don't recall any being too many to count. She has threatened divorce if I am unable to stop harassing her about her past, deal with it. I don't know what to do, I am afraid bringing these things up in therapy will result in her pulling further away from me, my fear, my reason for the questions, is how do you go from being that person, to being someone how can be satisfied by one partner for the duration of our lives? It has been put on me, to change, to be okay with her going with friends to night clubs, bars, wherever, they all drink to excess regularly, and have been out of the picture for some time now, but after the fight, I feel it will be asked of me to accept her returning to that lifestyle, with no questions asked, or else. I am lost, hurt, and lonely, she is having very little contact with me until we go to our appointment, and I show improvement.
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male
reader, anonymous, writes (4 January 2012): Sounds like your wife has serious issues that she isn't dealing with.
Hanging out with the bottle, or the pipe, or the "bad old friends" from the "good old days" is just trouble.
Take this test for her.
As if you were her, from what you know.
http://www.lanarkleedsaa.org/pages/aboutaa/are_you_an_alcoholic.htm
Then ask her to take it...see what response you get.
Make sure to tell her that you love her first, and mean it.
Honestly, it isn't her past you are dealing with, it is actually her present behavior that is the issue.
A
male
reader, aresu  +, writes (4 January 2012):
 i cant believe this, people are still blaming you and accusing you of being the insecure jerk, and i cant really understand their logic. if what you say about the other guys thet are still in her life is true, then the problem is her, her past actions are still haunting her(and you for that matter), why would she keep her past partners close to you both, and keeping photos of them, and inviting them to your meetings? that not very respectful of you at all, one thing is to being unable to leave the long gone past behind, and other is to still have the past with her.
and i find the excuse that the past is the past to be very biased and unfair, nowadays is practically an excuse for people to excuse immature young people in doing wathever the heck they want in their youth and not confronting the consequences of their actions later, like if they did something bad and just expect people to forget about it and on top of that recieve a medal. if you want an example of how the past does matter, well i cant see more clear example than being unable to stop seeing her past partners, and on top of that while she has a husband too. you even said that she refuses to leave alcohol, even when you both compromised that there would not be any in your marriage, and got as far as calling the therapist 'a whore' just for even pointing that out, that is another very good example of how the bad past shows the kind of judgement we have. and besides is very tough to ignore the past if it keep rearing its ugly head isnt it?
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A
male
reader, anonymous, writes (4 January 2012): The problem with the "leave the past in the past" advice usually given to guys like you, is that half the time your partner that is the one who is failing to do that.
IMHO your "demands" of her sound like common sense from a man in your position. If she won't start working to meet you in the middle then I think you need to seriously consider a separation. I won't start discussing the specifics because the whole thing stinks to be honest.
Either she is married with children or she is still regularly hanging around her old drinking & fucking buddies. She needs to pick one or the other. Some people could handle some contact with their exes without getting themselves into trouble but it does not sound like she is one of them.
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A
male
reader, Yos  +, writes (3 January 2012):
 You are married, in love, and going to therapy, so clearly you want to remain with her.
You have read 'endless posts' about this so I won't repeat what you have no doubt read many times. Instead I will try to outline the steps you can take to get over this.
- First you have to recognize that this problem is something within you. She is not the one being tormented by negative feelings and emotions. You are. And you cannot change the past: you cannot change what happened in her life before you were married. There is nothing she can do about this: the problem is now only in your head. You have to deal with it.
- Stop interrogating her about this. Not only does your questioning provide you with more 'information' that you will obsess over, but it damages your wife's feelings towards you. The more you do it, the more she will dislike you, until she eventually leaves. You must face your desire to know everything and not act out on it with her. You said "I tried to get her to talk about her past, openly, so that I could hear about it, deal with it, and move on". This is not how retroactive jealousy works. Hearing about it dos not help you deal with it, it only makes things worse. Stop asking: you'll never get answers you want to hear.
- Do go to therapy, but go alone. You are right that if she is there she will continue to feel judged and interrogated, and pull further away. Also go to a male therapist, he will be able to empathise with you more easily on many of your specific concerns.
- Aim to let go of your need to judge her actions. You have decided to stay with her. To be happy and fulfilled in your marriage you have to change. You have to be come the man who doesn't judge his wife's past negatively. A man who loves her for who she is now and accepts that she had to go through her own life's journey to get to that place. You have to make a conscious choice: to decide to become a different person: a man who does not have those negative beliefs about her. This is difficult: fear of personal change and actually changing is one of the hardest things we can do in our lives. But it is also liberating and freeing when we do it, and one of the most positive experiences we can have. You quite literally have to change some of your deeply held beliefs to do this.
All these things I have described require only will on your part: that you want to do this. As long as you remind yourself that these are your aims, then the practical steps below can take you there:
Once you have accepted that this is your issue and that you want to change, and stop involving her in this, you can work on letting go of the negative emotions an images you are experiencing. This is very difficult at first, but gets easier with practice. The process I recommend is this:
- When you are feeling in a positive mood and warm towards her, come up with a few short sentences that describe those feelings. Why you love her. Why she is wonderful. Why you are good together. This is your personal mantra about your love for her.
- Be mindful: be aware of your thoughts and feelings. When you feel yourself thinking about her past, and the attendant anxiety and painful feelings, find somewhere quiet to sit alone. Do not block the emotions, instead allow yourself to feel them. But do not apply your 'normal' thoughts to them. Do not try to 'understand' them or 'work them out'. Rather repeat the few sentences you wrote about her before. Keep repeating them slowly. Focus on their meaning and try to remember the feelings you had when you wrote them. See that they are still true, and that the jealousy that you are experiencing at that moment is just temporary. Know it will pass. Experience that if you repeat your mantra rather than obsessing over details in her past, the negative emotions pass more quickly.
- Be patient with yourself. Initially when you try this your mind will keep trying to fall into it's pattern: thinking about her past, asking questions, making judgments. But go back to the words and what they mean to you.
- Over time this will become easier, until you find you are able to deal with the episodes of jealousy without fear. At that point you are on the home straight: once the jealousy is no longer controlling you it becomes just a momentary annoyance that soon becomes meaningless and inconsequential.
The aim here is to break the connection between your jealousy and your irrational thoughts that accompany it. To teach yourself so that the unpleasant images and feelings to not have to trigger endless hours of obsessing over her past, but can rather pass through you without sticking. It is the fundamental part of many activities such as meditation, tai chi, yoga and similar, and it works. But it requires patience and perseverance. But you love your wife: she is worth this effort on your part. And you also love yourself: you will be a much happier man when you have learned to do this.
I'll stop here, but if you like please read my post history. The majority of my posts on this site are about this subject.
Best of luck to you, and stay strong.
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A
female
reader, mystiquek +, writes (3 January 2012):
 I don't want you to think that we are all bashing you, but I'm afraid I am going to side with all the other posts here. I will state that I TOTALLY understand about feeling jealous/anxious about someone's past. My guy has only been with 1 woman (who became his wife) and yet it used to haunt me, even though I had been with several more people than him. Why was I jealous? I guess because I didn't know him then and I wish I had, I wanted him all to myself, but knew there had been someone else. The thing is though, you can't go back! Your wife is who she is and she can't change what happened to her. As Cindy says, PLEASE think about what she has been through, her life doesn't sound like it was easy. I had an abortion at 21 and it was the worst experience of my life. You can't even begin to imagine how frightened your wife must have been at 14! Yet she trusted you enough to tell you about it. It couldn't have been easy for her. Not everyone has a past that they want to talk about or remember. Sometimes you just want to move on! What honestly do you think will come out of her spilling her guts to you? REALLY REALLY REALLY think about it. Are you sure you want to know?? You loved her enough to marry her, and obviously she loved you too..so WHAT is the problem now?? Do you not trust her? Sometimes it really is best to leave sleeping dogs lie, unless you think she isn't healthy or has passed some sort of disease onto you, I truly don't see where this is going to get you. And again, as the other ladies have stated, if my guy was pushing at me about my past, I'd be really angry and hurt and I wouldn't talk to him either probably. Sometimes people deserve to have some privacy. Have you told her EVERYTHING about your past or would you? Maybe you're one of the lucky people who doesn't have a bad past, but just remember, not all of us are proud of what we have done, but hopefully it has made us a better person now. I wish you peace, I hope you find it and I hope that you and your wife can work things out. Its a shame to let the past ruin your future.
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A
male
reader, camfam +, writes (3 January 2012):
camfam is verified as being by the original poster of the question I would also like to add, that I am not harassing her about these issues, I never out of the blue start asking questions, or say anything about them, it is only when the men them selves show up, I find photos of them somewhere in the house, a FaceBook friend request, or like today, an invitation to a party that she wants to go to, that will for sure involve drinking to excess, and people from her past. I am not obsessed with know the number, I understand that it does not matter, it cant be changed, what I need to know is that she has left that behavior behind, that she is no longer that person, that she will honor our marriage. this becomes very hard for me to do, when she fights so violently for her right to drink, and be around the men from her past. I am not here to vent, or to be told I'm right or wring, or to get over it, I am truly seeking advice on how best to deal with this, maybe from someone that has been there, and overcome it. Thank you.
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A
male
reader, camfam +, writes (3 January 2012):
camfam is verified as being by the original poster of the question Firt, thank you for the response. I can understand some of the questions you had, why do I ask, all the rest. From the beginning, she has been misleading about the men in her past, unless I ask the exact right question, she will only answer what she needs to. My first trip here, and sever after, whenever we went "out" with friends one of them was "just a friend" who I was quickly suspisious of because of the looks, and remarks from him. I later find out she had dated him, had some sexual contact, and his roomate, with long term, and recurring contact with. Both were heavy drinkers, after many discussions, fights, we came to an understanding about my being uncomfortable with her contact with these men, especially when I was not around. When we decided to start a family, we also agreed that there would be no alcohol, while were trying, after reading studies about its effect. At first this went fine, then she stated that after getting her period, she should be able to drink then, until the next cycle begins. She was a regular at bars and clubs, this is where I can only imagine most of here one night stands began. You should know that our second therapist tried to get her to talk about alcohol, and some alcoholic behavior she exibited. Thats when she quit going, and to this days refers to the therapist as "That F'ing whore" My wife admits that she abused alcohol, but will not say that it was a problem, or that any of her croud have a problem. She herself had a DUI several years ago, some of her old group[ have as well, I have witnessed parents incapacitated infront of their children, so much more. Which lead to tonight, she wants to, and is going to one of these friends home to watch a ball game, it is on me now, if I say anything other than yes, let's go it will be fun, I am not moving on, showing progress. She dated in very close circles, roomate number 1 is the best friend of long term live in of the Aunt that lives in the same city. The Aunt is in my wifes words an alcoholic, that pretty much showed her the ropes when she was a teen, drinking, parties, and was the one there to help her out when she needed an abortion, that her parents, brother, most everyone does not know about. I am not judgemental about this, I have shown compassion for her situation, I have tried everything that I know, to get past all of this, the problem is her past wont leave us alone, and she is unwilling to do somethings that would help that happen. After we were married for nearly a year, the father of the aborted baby called, to say he was in town for one night, and would like to hook up. And FaceBook... my god if I were to start on that subject. Anyway now that we have had this huge fight, all these subjects are "needing revisiting" because I have been too controlling of her, I have to let her make her own decisions, which in the past, in my part of the past have always been in favor of the other men, not me. I know that there are people out there that have no problem with ex contact, I just don't knkow if I can be one of them, I love her, and more than anything want this work.
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A
female
reader, CindyCares  +, writes (3 January 2012):
 Let me admit I am not the best to advise about Retroactive Jealousy because ( luckily ) I had never actually met or dealt with anybody affected by RJ before joining Dear Cupid. My knee - jerk reaction would be : guys- and girls - let it go, the past is past, live in the present- which inevitably triggers a tidal wave of " yes but it's the past that shapes the present " etc.etc, I suppose it may be true, I don't know.
What stands out in your post is that she had an abortion at 14 , and all I can say about that is : have mercy . Have some compassion. Do you really KNOW any 14 y.o. girl in real life ? Do you see them, do you talk with them ?... Can you imagine what is like to be , basically, a child, yes a child, regardless of make up, tramp stamps and attitude, and having a child mind and emotivity, that put in trouble your physically adult body, which reacts in an adult way ( conceiving ) to something you aren't remotely prepared to or mature for mentally ?
Can you imagine the fear, the guilt, the shame, the shock ?... I was already of legal age when I started being sexually active, and I was more informed , educated and ( pardon me ) smarter than many girls my age, and yet I only had figured out by around 22 what intercourse was about and what I wanted and needed sexually , and what to do to get it. To take responsibility for my sexual choices, and not to let people use sex to manipulate me, disempower me, guilt trip me, or exploit me in any way ... that happened even later and maybe I am still learning.
Immagine being pregnant at 14 , and having to face an abortion. Was it legal, wsa it done secretly, could she count on her parents or was she left to fend off for herself ?...Was it painful, was she scared ?..Did her priest tell her she was going to hell, did her girlfriends laughed and circulated rumours about her ?...
Poor child. Yes, CHILD. This might easily have been the most horrifying experince in her life - I am a total stranger yet the idea bothers me and moves me.
You are the man who is supposed to love her - and yes you are "shocked ". From the rest of your post it sounds though you are shocked about her early promiscuity, it makes you think stuff, : it makes you wonder how many guys then had she slept with by 18, or 24, it makes you wonder if that was a sign of inborn recklessness or lack of morals ? It makes you think about her past, and want details, and how many exactly, and in which positions. I don't know, maybe your reaction is the natural, logical one. I feel that, much before and above that, the most natural reaction should be : " Only 14. Omygod. What have they done to my baby ".
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A
female
reader, anonymous, writes (3 January 2012): What exactly are your problems with your wifes past? If her past presents you with moral issues. Then in fairness to her, you should have asked all those questions before marrying her. And if she refused to answer your questions before marriage, maybe you shouldnt have gone ahead with the marriage and promised to love her come what may...or whatever you promised her. She cant undo her past but you can learn to accept it. So maybe some one to one counselling might help you, rather than couples counselling. Unless you can find a way to accept and lay to rest your anxieties, how can the marriage survive? I feel you are insecure and frightened that she will resume her old life style. Consequently, you are handling things in a heavy handed manner, which will drive her away. She must love you because she made promises to you and married you. She doesnt sleep around or go out partying anymore. She has settled down. The only problem is your retrograde jealousy which you really need to master if you want to stay married.
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A
reader, anonymous, writes (3 January 2012): I am sorry but honestly she is right, it is NONE of your business. Whatever she did before you were together has nothing to do with you at all. I am sure you have a past as well and she isn't pressuring you for details. Honestly I can understand why she is threatening to leave you, you refuse to trust her, accept her as she is now. It's far too much hard work for her to be with you. Whether she had an abortion as a 14 year old, has nothing to do with you at all, My best friend had one at 13 years old because she had been raped by her Uncle, so if you don't know the circumstances behind it, stop judging her on her past, and concentrate on the woman she is now. Everyone has done things in their past they are not proud of, things they regret, and they don't expect that the person who claims to love them to want to throw them in their face the whole time. The more you push, the less likely she will tell you anything. Just because your married does not mean she has to tell you every detail of her life before you were involved with each other, the point is you either trust who she is now, if not then maybe it is time to go your separate ways. Good Luck.
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A
female
reader, Aunty BimBim  +, writes (3 January 2012):
 You were quite prepared to marry her without the nitty gritty details, yes, I agree, it is shocking for 14 year old girls to have abortions but a way lot less shocking that 14 year old girls having babies.
Why do you need these details? Are you concerned for your health? What good is it going to do if you are given a number? What if she says 10? Will that make you feel better? what if she says 210, do you really beleive a number is going to solve your problems?
You say the nightclubs and bars and the people she used to mix with are out of the picture ..... doesn't that tell you something about the person you married, and now you have fears the result of the fight will be that you will be expected to approve of the nightclubs and drinking resuming.
You sound like hard work, what have you been doing for the past 20 years since graduation? I can certainly understand what is driving your wife to threaten divorce if you don't stop the harrassment!
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