A
female
age
51-59,
anonymous
writes:I am a proud mother of six children from the ages of 27-10. I am a stay-at-home mom and part-time Sunday School teacher and I volunteer for many church activities as do all members of our family. All of our children attended or attend our small church school and we were hoping that they all would attend b Bible college in a neighboring state. Of course, Bible colleges only offer a few majors and if none of those majors are our children's "calling" we want them to go to a good school that offers the majors they are looking for. There are only a few that we say "absolutely no" to, as we are paying their tuition and the only scholarships their school offers are to bible colleges. Our oldest graduated from high school, got an associates at Bible College in Missionary work and then has been all over the globe sharing The Word. Bible College is very strict in that students are required to go to chapel every week and to be involved as much as possible. They are assigned a mentor to whom every text/phone call/Internet look up is e-mailed to. This way, students are only looking at appropriate sites. There is also a mandatory parental-notification policy when a student gets into trouble on campus. The students have a curfew and they use the city bus system or the bus ministry if there is anywhere they need to go off campus. (I wish even secular colleges would have those rules in place too just for the safety of young students away from home for the first time! Of course, you couldn't force a child into church, but it would be nice to sign up for at least a safety person or a mentor! Imagine how much safer students would be!)Our second-oldest (24) stated that she wanted to go into nursing and that because of the classes we had here at school, she was very far behind (we admittedly do not have the money for the equipment such as microscopes and such and we also teach sciences from a biblical point of view). That made sense, and she attended the college here in town to get her associates degree. She did very well, living at home, and continued to be heavily involved in church. She even got a job at a hospital in town and contributed to our church and household for three years before she dropped a bombshell: she had saved up enough money to move to a very large city and there was "nothing" we could do about it. She planned to transfer to another hospital. We had monitored her to the best of our abilities: we asked a church friend to check up on her school website (he works in the technology department) to keep her safe, and to let us know if she was viewing anything we should be concerned about. We made sure that she had someone to pick her up and drop her off at the college and that her schedule was set up so that she would have little opportunity or reason to leave campus. We spoke to her friends in her classes and her professors and she was involved in evangelizing for our church right on campus with some other church members who went there. They all looked out for each other. She still managed to have a bank account we didn't know about and it came to a PO BOX she didn't mention. While that's not the end of the world, it's still dishonest and sneaking around. Also, she didn't know anything about the big city. Our pastor himself came down with his wife to the train station to help us talk her out of leaving. She was very disrespectful to him and my husband and I could tell she at least had the decency to be ashamed of herself, but she held her ground. We were able to find out when the train would arrive in the big city and we found a few people who lived there who could at least help her into her new apartment. All she had said was that she was moving in with "friends" and would NOT tell us who they were, only that we didn't know them. None of her church friends had any idea who she had been talking to, but a few people had mentioned that she was in the public library a few times and quickly shut down the screen when they approached. She had told them (and us) that a class was cancelled and she'd decided to go. That should have been a huge red-flag looking back. We were afraid (and it turned out we were right) that she had moved in with people she had met online. She flat-out lied about where she was living and no one was able to track her down for months. We were worried sick! It turned out that she had stopped going to church altogether and while she did work in a hospital, she was living with five other women she didn't know and she was then attending THEIR church. (Unitarian). We are very disappointed, but she is keeping her distance from us and hardly ever answering calls/e-mails and she seems offended and frustrated when we show up for surprise visits whenever we can afford it. We've sent many people from churches all over that city to her apartment and they have reported that she has asked them to leave her alone. We suspect that her roommates smoke marijuana and we know some of them drink and we've been tempted to call the hospital or the police and have them drug-test her, but that's impossible because it's such a large city and they want to protect her privacy. When we've come a few times, she's been VERY secretive about what she was talking about and with whom when she stepped away to use her cell phone or else she has texted like mad and refused to let us see it! Her roommates have been even more unwelcoming when they turned us away at the door and said that if we hung around, they'd report us for harassment! I just really want to know what is going on her in her life and she is being very secretive about it. She's still coming down for the holidays but say that people are church are "bothering" her too much and make her feel she's unwelcome when she's anything but unwelcome!Our next-oldest daughter is 21 and she just got her associate's from Bible College and she is working here at our church with the secretary. We're very happy about this, but she keeps saying she wants to save and get her own apartment to have "more space". That's understandable, but we'd really feel better if she lived with a roommate from church. That way, she can have someone to help her out to make sure she is making sound decisions and we'll be able to have a key to her apartment so that we can drop in and leave things for her or to take care of her apartment when she's out and about. We really don't want to lose her and I'm scared to death that we will! This daughter is adamant that she lives "alone" and that she could afford the rent but a) she has no furniture b) no car and no means to move anything she would buy to the apartment and c) she did admit she forgot about the costs of electricity, Internet, her phone and the like. We decided to do a "trial" where we figured out the average costs of living alone and she was barely able to pay the rent with the money she makes at our church (not much), and she was shirking her responsibilities with babysitting her younger siblings because she was "going out" and not telling us where! She also limited her time working at the church by picking up another job "for the holidays". We're really, really concerned about her but I'm not sure if I'm over-reacting or if it's mother's intuition. If a person (child, spouse, friend) is suddenly very secretive about friends, where they're going, what they're doing on computers (including going to the public library instead of using the computer at home), having a new throw-away phone they won't tell you about and insisting on moving out of the house when it's not financially possible ... all that really makes me worry. Is there anything I can do to keep her here without ostracizing her? I understand her desire for independence, but quite frankly, we need her financial help too. She's paying part of the mortgage and quite a bit of the groceries and she gives gas money to people who give her rides, but it's still a financial burden. And it's just impractical for her to move out of the house right now anyway! Considering how busy she is with church and working and taking care of her younger siblings, she really wouldn't be in the apartment anyway. What's the use of busting your head to make money for her own apartment if she is hardly going to be there anyway? Again, we understand her desire for independence, but there is a good friend of hers who would like to move out on her own as well. Both girls work at the church and there's no reason they can't live together to keep costs down and to keep each other in check. Most people think I sound like a crazy helicopter-parent, and I realize the "bad" things my second-oldest did (is doing?) are small compared to what it could be, but I'm genuinely scared! It isn't just because the daughter that moved to the big city is living a lifestyle we don't approve of, it's because it's DANGEROUS and she's very naive and trusting. Girls like her are targeted every day for that very reason! Also, her change in behavior and attitude really gets me (that is what makes me think she's using drugs). Now that our third-oldest is insisting on being independent and acting very secretive, I'm scared to death of what could happen to her.
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female
reader, Abella +, writes (29 November 2015):
 Based on your post and philosophy I guess you and I have different parenting styles. Your style seems perfectly valid to you.
My style might bother you.
do you trust your adult children to make their own decisions?
I am happy that your 27 year old has managed to travel the world, though no doubt it was under very strict control of the church when she did that.
Girls are married at 21 and mothers at 22.
By your reasoning it would seem that you don't even trust a 24 year old to choose their own career and to develop some independence.
While you remain so controlling can you not see that your own actions are driving your offspring (who are adults) away?
You cannot expect to agree with every action your adult offspring take and you cannot do so successfully even if you try to cover every base.
You will end up destroying all trust between you and them and possibly push them towards rebelling.
What is wrong with an adult having their own bank account and their own box number? I guess she craved some privacy and values her independence and expected that your stance would judge her every step of the way, if given the chance to judge.
I applaud her friends turning away your 'checker-up brigade" at the door because it is harassment.
I would be thrilled if I had an eighteen year old who had saved up money from an after school job and wanted to live independently and wanted to pursue a career of their choice.
Nursing is a wonderful choice. And can take a trained professional all over the world. From Nursing a trained professional can move out into all manner of allied careers with additional study into well paid and very rewarding, emotionally and professionally) careers. All credit to your daughter. You should be so very proud of her
But sending people to check up on her? that is really over the top. Where is your trust?
My aim with my children is not to have them tied to my apron strings for the rest of their lives but instead to raise them to be able to stand on their own two feet and think for themselves. And progressively from an early age that is what I have aimed to achieve.
sometimes it takes real discipline to not intervene.
Yes I do have some rules about visiting a home to play, or attending a birthday party where I have never met the family and they do not know us then yes I do want to speak to the mother of the other child and meet them first.
But mine are not 21, 24 and 27
Sure I have had challenges. but that is when I get them to think of the consequences.
Sure they sometimes are reluctant to do something.
I keep the 'door open' so to speak so that they know they can come to me and I will listen and not judge.
One of the earliest things I employ is the game consequences:
Taking them through the consequences if they, the whole street, the whole state, the whole world did as they wanted to do?
So, I ask them, at the time, "what makes you so special that no rules apply to you, but you still expect others to do what you are not willing to do yourself, like tidy up your room?"
I want my children to think these things out for themselves.
Lies are the big thing for me.
I will say, "no matter what you have done, please tell the truth. Whatever you have done I will still love you and give you my support and we can deal with the problem together. but lie to me and you destroy trust."
Or I will remind them that I will always love them no matter what, but sometimes I may not agree with their behaviour. And then we deal with it,
I want my children though to think out the consequences for themselves.
sometimes they know I will be disappointed, though I appreciate their honesty.
Such as the other day, "I know you are not going to be happy about this, but I wanted to tell you...."
I applauded the honesty and yes I was a bit perturbed just one month after the cast came off (broken arm) that daring bicycle manoeuvres were again being practised down the hill. So we had a big talk about safety first.
Are you hoping to control who they meet, who they marry, what car they are entitled to have and when they are to have children and where they are to live? If yes then is it any wonder that they have had enough?
Be careful what you accuse your daughter's friends of. They sound responsible and they know their rights. You have no proof that they or your daughter are on drugs. You are probably very wrong on that score if your daughter has been brought up well and understands the risks.
There are good and bad people all over the world. Many church organizations have had to deal with church workers and church pastors who have abused others. The rest of the world does not have a monopoly over the bad people. such bad people can be trusted people in positions of authority and can even be church officials.
Here is some reading matter that may help:
http://zenhabits.net/how-to-let-go-of-hyperparenting-and-learn-to-relax-with-your-kids/
http://bottomlinepersonal.com/mistakes-parents-make-that-push-adult-children-away/
http://www.parenting.com/article/helicopter-parenting
Hope you can sit down and work through what needs to change to ensure that you do not destroy all the goodwill that exists in your family towards you.
A
female
reader, CindyCares  +, writes (29 November 2015):
 This is not a joke.... it 's the latest literary effort of a long-time repeat poster :). Who, by now , has developed her own unmistakeable literary voice, ( which is a very good thing, btw ), with her own choice of words, rythm of narration, punctuation etc. - and always the same subject,with slight variations in the story plot : overbearing,super-religious parents who act in an hypercontrolling way. This time the story is narrated through the mother's voice, rather than the child 's.
I do not exclude that these postings may be ,in a general way, occasionated from a core of real angst,or from a really troubled parent/child relationship,- and if the OP feels she needs help with that, I think she'd better come out and say it and she would get the help and support she needs.
But as it is, I think that we can safely assume that this is not the narration of factual, literal truths. If nothing else , for the blatant, illogical inconsistencies in reference to the financial situation ( as pointed out with more tact and finesse by Tisha-1 ) and because of the fact that no college worth their salt would implement or approve that type of Orwellian " Big Brother " control ( all private calls and website visits automathically transferred to a tutor ??!!) because that would be actually illegal, and any disgruntled student could press charges / sue the college's a** off later on, even if, under mental coercion, they had signed a waiver or consent at first.
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A
female
reader, anonymous, writes (29 November 2015): I don't mean to offend but whilst reading this I had to wonder if it was idea of a joke. To care and worry about your children is perfectly natural but from what I am reading you are quite overwhelming in your parenting style that your children don't seem to be able to exert their own free will. I think being sneaky about things is a big sign that your children don't feel they can trust you. I think it is good that you want to encourage the right morals and the right kind of lifestyles on your children but what about what they want? Have you thought that maybe a lot of church can be too much church? Sometimes you need to break from what you know to find out who you are, what you believe specifically where religion is concerned. It really is great your love your children but I am reminded on Othello, it is not that he didn't love Desdemona but that he loved her too well. I think you are loving your children too much, certainly in their 20's you have to let go and allow them to make their own mistakes. Always be a safe home for them and they will come to you when they need you. Don't push away your kids because right not that is precisely what it sounds like. The reason I thought this was a joke is because it is all too much ... I was raised religiously and I could not handle that pressure you are dealing your kids. Please please love less
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A
female
reader, anonymous, writes (29 November 2015): If you were my mum, I would've run for the hills at 18. What good are you doing your children by having them "monitored" all the time and setting out rules for them when they're adults! It gives them the message you do not trust them and they are not capable to make their own way in life.Having people turn up on your daughters door is quite disrespectful actually, could be quite frightening for her and will at least leave her feeling like she can't escape even though she's physically moved away. Her friends told you they would report you for harassment; I wouldn't appreciate it either if my flatmates mother was sending over strangers and turning up on the doorstep. That is more frightening for the girls than life in a city. You don't send people to your daughters door to check up on her because that is bordering on harassment. You cannot control your children forever. You might not like the fact they're not as obsessed over church and religion as you are but that doesn't mean you shouldn't respect their decisions and you should continue to be there emotionally for them despite a difference in views or opinions. The more you try and shelter your children from what real life is like, the more they are going to want to experience it. My mother raised me to find my own views and beliefs; my aunt - despite being a devout Christian who was and is actively involved with her church - never had her daughter christened as she felt it was her daughters right to discover the path that was suited her. You've raised your children with your values but now you need to back off and let them be adults.Do you seriously think your daughter, who is a nurse, is going to be on drugs? Do you really think she would risk her job and something she worked years to train for just to take drugs? She is secretive because she is an ADULT and you are trying to treat her like 14 year old teenager. If your adult children want phones then they'll have them, trying to see who they are communicating with is intrusive and again, massively disrespectful. Your other daughter who wants to move out should do so. She is an adult too and whilst it's lovely she helps out babysitting, they're not her kids and she deserves to start living her life rather than still being treated like a child at home. Don't allow yourself to be fearful of your children making their own decisions. Now your youngest is 10 perhaps you should look at working more, so you see a bit of life outside of your church and realise it's not as dangerous as you are fearing it to be. Any parent worries, that's natural but to actively find reasons to stop your children moving on in their lives is wrong. Do not use your mortgage as an excuse for another daughter not to leave home; that's you and your husbands responsibility and you should be proud your children are ready to make decisions.Trust them more, you're not given them the credit they deserve. Don't try and hold your youngest children back either, let them see the older siblings succeed in life and they will have more positive role models.
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A
female
reader, anonymous, writes (28 November 2015): Woah you sound extremely controlling and one day your children will get so fed up of this that they may not want to keep in touch with you at all. What you've said of your daughter and she should have the decency to be ashamed.....ashamed of what? One of your children is paying part of your mortgage while you dont earn any money. Aren't you responsible to look after your children and not the other way around. They shouldn't be helping raise the youngest either. Thats your job.All parents get scared of what could happen to their children but raising them to be so naive is nor good. If she gets targeted it would be because you raised her to become some naive frail target.Life is for living! Not being nearly 30 years of age with a mother telling you what to do.
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A
male
reader, Been there Now over it +, writes (28 November 2015):
You say you are the mother of six children, 10 to 27 yo. At least three of these are not children but adults and should be treated as such. You've given them no space at all!I grew up with a church as the center of our household but I don't recall any mother interfering so much in the adult kid's lives. Calling up people to meet your adult daughter at her destination? You really need to step away from them before you drive them away from you. How would you like it if another adult tried to cram atheism down your throat? Well, that is no different that what you are doing the same thing to your kids. You tangled up things all by yourself and I really don't know what else to say here except that most of your friends are right, you are a crazy parent and you need help from a therapist outside your church.
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A
female
reader, Flower89  +, writes (28 November 2015):
 Stop! Stop!! Stop!!!
Ok, I was raised in a Christian households, my Father is a Church Minister & Mother is a very active member of our Church.
Growing up most of the time I felt controlled, not guided, controlled. Church 2 on a Sunday, Christian course on the Tuesday, Bible Study on the Wednesday & so on.
Yes I beileve in God, but I wanted to live in the real world too!
At 21 I was fed up been treated like a child & saved up enough to move out. Just like your daughter did! Reason I couldn't breathe or think for myself, I wasn't allowed to!
My advice is back off & let your daughters think for themselves.
Trust you taught them well.
I'm now 26, a Mother myself and only now are my folks accepting I'm my own person.
Don't push your younger one to the point where she feels the need to run away from you. Accept she's an adult & loosen the reigns.
Your the problem here not your daughter's, yeah they are naive because you never let them experience anything for themselves.
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A
male
reader, anonymous, writes (28 November 2015): You sound like an extremely caring and loving mother and I'm sure your children know that. However... You need to let them make their own mistakes. Firstly, please don't give your eldest daughter anymore surprise visits. She probably already finds them extremely intrusive and you really risk pushing her away if you do it again. And please don't send friends to check up on her either... You might consider it dangerous in the city, but I'm sure she's got her head screwed on firmer than you think. If she is ever in any real danger, I'm sure she will come running straight back home to you. Secondly, I'm sure your second eldest daughter will realise it is hard living by herself if she can't afford it fairly quickly, and then she might be ready to move in with her church friend. But I think you need to let her figure it all out for herself.I wrote a lot about the monitoring from the mentor at Bible College and about you thinking your daughter was being too 'secretive' but then I deleted it because I found myself becoming frustrated and being too harsh... I will just leave it with saying that it isn't right. It's a massive, crazy and unnecessary invasion of privacy. People need to have their own thoughts sometimes. I love my parents very much and the thing I am most grateful for from them is that they have never interfered with me or my siblings lives - but unconditionally offer their support when we need it. For example, my sister was moving to another country with her husband and my mum was heartbroken and really didn't want her to go, especially as she was pregnant at the time... But she never breathed a word of her worry to my sister and supported her and helped her. Similarly, when I decided to move in with my girlfriend of the time, she supported me and helped me even though she strongly disagreed with the decision and then when our relationship fell apart, she was there to help me pick up the pieces. Think of the prodigal son, his father LET him leave and let him make all those mistakes... and then welcomed him back with an open heart and open arms when he came back home. Let your daughters LIVE because they'll only drift away from you if you don't. All the best.
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A
female
reader, WhenCowsAttack +, writes (28 November 2015):
They are adults, and there is nothing you can do. You ARE driving them away with your actions. They are naive and trusting because you have sheltered them and not allowed them to have real world experiences, and now you are smothering them.
This is your fault, and you should now back off and allow them to learn how to be grownups. With luck, you haven't permanently damaged your relationship with them.
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A
female
reader, Tisha-1 +, writes (28 November 2015):
 I'm a bit confused as to your financial situation here. On one hand, you say you are a stay-at-home mom and part-time Sunday School teacher, as well as an active church volunteer. You then go on to say that "There are only a few [colleges] that we say 'absolutely no' to, as we are paying their tuition" which if you are not earning any money, means the wage-earner is your husband.
But then you go on to say about another adult child: "I understand her desire for independence, but quite frankly, we need her financial help too. She's paying part of the mortgage and quite a bit of the groceries and she gives gas money to people who give her rides, but it's still a financial burden."
Which would indicate that you are financially relying on a grown adult child to fund your home? While you volunteer and be stay-at-home mom yet still require your older children to babysit your younger children?
Wouldn't it make more sense for you to find a paid job (the youngest is 10 and presumably doesn't need that much babysitting)? Unless you are raising them to be childish and infantile?
Your oldest is 27 years old, then you have a 24 and 21 year old. They are no longer children. They are adults. You've done your job, you've modeled your beliefs as a parent.
It's up to them if they choose to follow your path or find their own way. At this point, it is out of your hands. Let go.
One other observation, as your 3 eldest have all demonstrated a clear desire to follow their own paths, and that path leads to living independently, perhaps it would be beneficial for them to learn more about life in the big city than to be fearful, as you've been modeling. Get some common-sense advice and guidance, get practical.
I do go back to that odd financial situation you describe. I think if you had more real-world experience by being in a workplace not attached to your church, and were bringing in income, you'd be less fearful for your grown up adult children, and would be able to prepare your younger children with more confidence.
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