A
female
age
36-40,
*lissfulRhythm
writes:Okay, I know there are a lot of questions on this topic already, but I still need help.My fiance watches porn, a lot. I don't know how much, because he never wants to talk about it, but I know it's very frequently. He said as much to me at one point, and he has an entire external hard drive of mostly porn.It's not just regular fake-boobed women, though. He likes amateur porn, which I feel is even worse. It shows that he isn't just watching porn for crazy fantasy, he likes real women... women who aren't me.I know some of the responses I'm going to get, so allow me to retort before they're even offered. I've tried to watch it with him, and he says that makes him uncomfortable. I've tried to see what he watches so that I can watch it too, but he doesn't want to talk about it. I've tried being more adventurous in the bedroom, and he likes it, but he doesn't stop watching porn.I feel like the more I try all these things, the more I'm degrading myself to get him to stop something that really hurts me. I've told him how it makes me feel, and he's seen me cry over it multiple times.Once, he went to a strip club with his friends, and I told him how much it upset me and he said he wouldn't do it anymore, but he doesn't understand that I see porn the same way. I see no difference between watching a woman dance naked on a pole in person vs. doing it online, and I've told him this, but he says it's not a competition between me and the porn.He says he prefers me over the porn any day, but it still feels like a competition to me.I haven't given him an ultimatum because I'm trying to be fair to him and avoid making demands, but I really just don't know what else to do. I can see myself marrying him and being happy for many years to come, but this porn thing is killing me and he won't even talk about it.
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female
reader, Miamine  +, writes (23 March 2010):
 "I dunno, I probably shouldn't have even posted anything online, I should just deal with this stuff like a big girl, but it just makes me feel so small and helpless."
Please don't talk like this when you talk to him. He has every right to disagree and see things differently. Try to put yourself in his shoes and see things from his point of view. Then ask him to put himself in your position and see things as a woman who feels that she's not good enough and feels her feelings about pornography are disregarded.
A
female
reader, Miamine +, writes (23 March 2010):
"but this porn thing is killing me and he won't even talk about it"
I bet you feel attacked from all sides. Pornography is something you dislike, and you don't think it's fair that your expected to tolerate such stuff. But you don't have to. If you don't like pornography and he won't give it up, you always have the option to leave him. If something is killing you and making you so damn unhappy, what's the point of continuing the relationship. Another guy may not watch pornography, you may find that you prefer a relationship like that better.
"I've tried being more adventurous in the bedroom, and he likes it, but he doesn't stop watching porn. I feel like the more I try all these things, the more I'm degrading myself to get him to stop something that really hurts me."
This is a big mistake you are making. Why would you degrade yourself for any man? Why would you do things your uncomfortable with. The women in amateur pornography do sex acts that they enjoy. The women in professional pornography do sex acts that they get paid for. Your boyfriend made you no promises, he did not say he would give up pornography if you became more adventurous in bed. You decided to do these things, and then you become upset when they make no difference at all.
"He says he prefers me over the porn any day, but it still feels like a competition to me."
Well your in a competition that only includes one person. Your racing and running all by yourself. The women in pornography can't see you, they are not competing with you, they are living their life the way they choose to. You however are living your life in an attempt to prove your better than them, your trying to elimate a fantasy, a mirarge, something your boyfriend dosen't link to real life stuff.
"I've told him how it makes me feel, and he's seen me cry over it multiple times."
What would happen if he were too tell you honestly about he feels, how much it hurts him that you can't accept him as he actually is. This is the guy, porn and all, he's not a perfect man, he likes to masturbate over girls in porn, he likes to do it alone, and he likes to do sex sometimes quickly and on his own instead of with the woman he loves. What if he were to break down and cry and says it hurts when the woman he loves tries to change him to suit herself and has no care for his wishes at all. Why are your wishes and your tears more important than his?
"It's really hard for me to talk about this sort of thing with him because I always end up crying."
Maybe that's a problem you have to tackle. If you cannot have an adult conversation about sex, pornography, sexual acts and raw male desire without crying, then maybe he gets the impression that you have some issues around sex.
Look at what you've said, you were not adventurous in bed, your willing to do sex acts that degrade you, just to keep a man from looking at sexy video's. You want to compete with women in pornography, who are made up beautiful to be on camera, and then the images are manipulated with computer technology to make them look even more beautiful. You don't like pornography, but you will look at it, or rather, look at him watching it and probably get even more insecure and jealous.
"he says it's not a competition between me and the porn.....I can see myself marrying him and being happy for many years to come, but this porn thing is killing me and he won't even talk about it."
You can't marry him if you feel like this, I doubt he will ever change. You will become angry and bitter, even though you already know that this is how he is. He won't talk about it, because your not talking, you demanding something of him.
Basically your problem sounds like this to him... "I feel that you prefer the pornography girls to me, I feel that you think I am ugly. This makes me sad. Now because I feel this way, you must change, you must give up looking at pornography to make me happy again"..
Problem is, he has not asked you to change, he has not asked you to give up anything. He dosen't think your ugly, he dosen't love you less. It's just sometimes he wants a really quick sex session, he can do that with pornography. He can't do that with you, you need time, loving and caressing. Pornography is quick sex relief, but with you he makes love. He see's no competition at all.
Go talk to him, but not just about pornography. Talk to him about how he sees love, sex and marriage. Get to know this guy your going to marry, find out what he likes and why, tell him what you like and why. Learn to communicate your fantasies, your desires, what you think of as great sex, what you think of as romantic, what things you could do together to make you both happy and strengthen your love. Listen and talk with an open mind, he might just surprise you with he tells you in return.
Much better to talk like this, than just say "Give up porn".
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A
male
reader, bharat mehta  +, writes (23 March 2010):
 Why we oppose PORN?
Because it is sexual? No, because porn is anti-sexual, so we are against porn.
PORN IS AN INSULT, DEMEANING, AND VULGAR REPRESENTATION OF SEX...is the reason. But, more profound reason for our hatred for porn is only, that we esteem sex as RELIGION....we hold sex as way of enlightenment.
We want, husband wife, or male female in any relations [ not prostituted relations] learn to live sex. But, one thing is beyond discussion....porn and prostitution...they are inherently evil...as they are faking, fraud, and quite against sexual morals. AGAINST SEXUAL PLEASURE. Pleasure is the morality of sex.
I am not here, just to support female who oppose porn...she may oppose for many psychological reason...but my opposition has favor...I oppose in favor of healthy and wealthy sex life.
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A
female
reader, BlissfulRhythm +, writes (23 March 2010):
BlissfulRhythm is verified as being by the original poster of the questionYes, watching porn is better than cheating, but that doesn't mean I should somehow be thankful.It's really hard for me to talk about this sort of thing with him because I always end up crying. I guess I'll just have to suck it up and talk about it this weekend when I see him again, but I know he's just going to get defensive and clam up. I do whatever I can to avoid coming off as accusative, but apparently he sees everything I say on the subject as some sort of indictment.I dunno, I probably shouldn't have even posted anything online, I should just deal with this stuff like a big girl, but it just makes me feel so small and helpless.Anyway, thanks for everyone's input.
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A
reader, anonymous, writes (17 March 2010): This sounds oh so similar to my finance. Mine only uses net on mobile phone to look stuff up and although ive asked him to tell me when he does it, or ask every day if he has, most of the time he says he hasn't and when I check his phone he has! Then he tells me im callin him a liar cuz I dont tell him that I check it. So I cant prove that I know and its really hurtin to know he's lying about it! I wouldn't care as much if he'd just tell me. Im really insecure in my looks and I dont have big boobs so I cant compete with the porn he looks up. Very interested in the answers to this as I can relate so much. I cannot understand why guys look s much and why its such a taboo subject. They're meant to prefer their partner over any other woman and yet even if they dont physically cheat they still mentally do it with porn!
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A
female
reader, anonymous, writes (15 March 2010): Does nyfungirl really believe that if a man wanted to be with a porn star he wouldn't be with his girlfriend? Of course he would. Men may be silly but they pretty much realise they have zero chance of getting a porn star. Therefore they settle for us average women. Women with a brain know this and are not necessarily happy being considered second best to a porn stars looks by their partners.
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A
female
reader, anonymous, writes (14 March 2010): i am dealing with this issue also and I have to tell you that it is killing my relationship with my boyfriend. It is affecting how I view sex and how I view my body. I have let it steal my self confidence, my joy in life. I finally told my boyfriend how it is affecting me. I didn't give him an ultimatum but if someone really loves you, I think they should respect that it hurts you. If not, it is time to move on because those hurt feelings will just build to anger and resentment, not good feelings to start a marriage.
I say tell him honestly how it is affecting you and give him a chance to cut back at least. If they have been doing it a long time, it isn't easy to just stop.
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A
female
reader, anonymous, writes (13 March 2010): Hi.You shouldnt degrade yourself just to redirect his attention away from his addiction to pornography. And if you did make any dvds with him, keep them in your sole care as so often there are problems with ex bf`s flaunting sex dvd`s after break ups. But if its not in your nature to behave like that, then dont do it. It might be fun at first but after awhile he will become bored and go back to him old habits.
And think about this. Hes doing something that makes you very unhappy. Hes being ignorant and wont stop for you because its a big sexual turn on for him when he watches other men and women. As time goes on he will most likely become bored with this type of porn and seek more hardcore pornography.
He may be someone you would be happy to marry but for how long? He clearly has a selfish streak and wont budge when its something he enjoys. That alone could cause problems later in life. Bare it in mind.
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A
female
reader, veronika  +, writes (13 March 2010):
 I disagree with anyone who says that porn is part of a person's sexual identity.
Sexual identity is very different from porn use and pornography, because sexual identity is an active part of who you are. When you watch porn, you are behaving passively not actively, and it is not your sexuality you are acting out. You are watching others act out their sexuality.
I do not believe people absolutely need porn to be sexually satisfied, men and women alike. People make excuses for porn watching like, "it's normal", "it's part of who I am", "people who hate porn are anti-sex!". All of which are not exactly true. While voyeurism may be 'natural' for some people, the mainstream pornography industry (which is increasingly including more and more 'amateur' porn) feeds us unrealistic expectations of sex and how people should behave during sex.
One can have a very sexually satisfying sex life without porn, you just have to learn not to use it.
I am not against thinking about other people sexually when you're in a relationship. Hell, we all have a pulse! But pornography has the ability to damage a relationship, because pornography doesn't just exist in the mind, like other sexual thoughts do. When someone sees pornography that their partner watches, it is only natural that they will compare what they see on the screen to what they are themselves. So when a small breasted woman, for example, finds her boyfriend's pornography stash of very large breasted women there is a chance she will feel bad about herself. Not necessarily because she has low self esteem, but because she wonders whether her partner would prefer it if she had bigger breasts.
A lot of men will defend this use of porn, and say "just because he's looking at big breasted women, it doesn't mean he doesn't find his small breasted girlfriend attractive". While this may be true (there are a lot of things people find sexually attractive, I don't deny that), it is downright insensitive to just ignore your partner's cries of not feeling worthy.
So, gentlemen, if your girlfriend is feeling slightly bad about herself because of the porn you watch, do not respond by getting defensive and telling her to snap out of it. Behave like a loving partner, and make her feel loved. You would expect that of her, no doubt.
I would never tell a boyfriend he HAD to stop watching pornography. I am very pro choice - if he chooses to watch pornography, I won't deny that. I will, however, reserve my right to leave or say something about it if it becomes a problem in the relationship.
Which brings me to this young lady's conundrum. She came here to this site because she's having issues with her boyfriend's porn watching. I resent the answers that tell her to just leave it be because "it's natural" or "normal". If someone has a problem, they have a problem. She isn't at fault.
BlissfulRhythm - If you have a problem with anything in your relationship, communication with your partner is very important. You've already told him how you feel about it, but his response wasn't satisfactory. THIS is when you need to amp it up a little. He is doing someone that is making you uncomfortable. You both either need to reach a compromise - perhaps suggest he doesn't watch porn as often as he does? If he's watching it more than once a day, he needs help as it's possible he may have porn addiction. OR you can demand he doesn't watch it at all, and it's either you or the porn. I would advise against the last one, because I am pro choice.
However, if he is choosing his porn stash over you, then I would walk if I were you.
He's not talking to you about it because he knows how much it hurts you. But yet he doesn't seem to care enough to even reach a COMPROMISE. I would say counselling can be an option. Go together for joint sessions, maybe you need a third party (like a counsellor) to help you sort it out.
Because as long as you feel uncomfortable about it, and as long as he won't talk about it - this is an issue. And it's an issue you DO NOT want to bring into a marriage.
Good luck.
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A
male
reader, anonymous, writes (13 March 2010): Read PM's answer to help understand the problem.
I don't necessarily agree with him that it's your duty to be fine with his porn watching. You don't OWE anyone that. But I agree that it would probably work better with this guy if you did. A compromise of some kind is in order.
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A
female
reader, Miamine +, writes (12 March 2010):
Wonderful story Asian Tealeaf, again, another compromise instead of fighting over the issue of pornography. This time commercial stuff goes in the bin and you make your own instead.. I call that win-win.
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A
female
reader, anonymous, writes (12 March 2010): Your man has found the pron to be his "domain", that only he can enter. He feels uncomfortable watching it with you, and uncomfortable talking to you about it. This will continue to push you away. I give you a lot of credit for wanting to participate with him in watching porn, and I really believe it will change everything if he would include you in the porn. Right now he is creating a barrier between you and him, and its on a sensitive topic too. He has an intimate part aside from you, which is something he really should snap out of. He considers his jerking off as private business. Which is fine from time to time, but you are to be his wife, and he can not be keeping his sex life a secret from you.
He needs to have something that is his own, a thing he can do as a man and not with you, which is what everyone needs. But this should be something like golfing, fishing, whatever. He has made porn into his little man-thing, and is so keeping you out of it with a firm hand. Try to explain to him that as you are getting married, he can not keep you away from the intimate parts of your relationship. If he needs to be alone, he can go hiking. When he wants to be intimate it should be with YOU and not on his own. He has gotten this into him as a habit, and its a bad habit that will push you away. Make him include you in the porn and help him find a better place where he can be manly-man and have his space.
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A
female
reader, asian tealeaf  +, writes (12 March 2010):
 here is a story that happened to me, and i will share it with you because truly speaking, it actually happened and it will explain to many male and female readers the affect of porn on women. my bf of 5 yrs in his early 30s now was all his life one of the biggest porn freaks one could imagine. but then are not most guys? no, he was unnaturally very much into porn. wed have sex when we first met like 7-8 times a day or in the night, yes, lots of mind blowing earth shattering sex. it was the best sex either one of us had ever had. and he had no probs telling all his buddies, hell, his own family that the sex he and i had was phenomenal!!! ah, the memories.....anyways, not soon after wed been done id fall asleep wake up and see him wacking his beefstick to some porn. for 1 yr i kept silent. i never said anything to him. but it traumatized me. i was shocked. id never been exposed to porn believe it or not. and he was my first live in bf. and to see him doing that, after wed had mind blowing sex, killed me inside. and of course, it was not just the porn, it what kind of porn he was watching. the anal, the dp,the gang banging young women, who looked pretty good for being so worn to the bone from sex...nice taught fresh perky boobs,the tight teeny butts, whatever. i was never ever into anal. and of course, i could never look like those gals because i have very tiny boobs, although i am extremly tiny myself, being 97 pounds, i felt compared. i felt degraded. i felt used!! hell, i felt abused. and the anger grew. then the insecurities. then it affected my sex drive. then it affected my performance. then it sparked huge fights because i lost my willingness, my drive to have sex with him. it made me feel like i waas not good enough. that those porn chics were like, the real deal for him. i got smart. i would start ;looking on the pc history, he was always on porn sites. he had porn movies downloaded and hidden in secret files he thought hed hidden. aha! but id become pc savvy. and id learned my way around the pc very fast. too fast. because one day i took all my little research and i let it come forth to him. i cried. i told him all i felt. hed say, oh i never knew it made you feel this way. so he would say he would stop. id still check the pc. found he lied. i confronted him. he got angry. why are you checking up on me? what r u? the porn police? and it was a constant ping pong game of lies and false promises. til one day, i told him eloquently just why and how porn affected me. i said to him, you have an addiction. these words stopped him in his tracks. id hit a nerve. then i told him, i said, men have their own security issues right? he said for sure. i knew a girl who watched monster dick porn. her bf wasso mortified it gave him a complex. he felt small. he felt she wanted a man with a bigger dick. he was making comparisons. he felt compared. he felt used. and all this coming from a man? who ever would of thought? i told my bf the reaons why i stopped having sex with him. i explained to him how his porn affected my sex drive, my performance, my feeling of self confidence in bed etc. he was shocked.he said wow. he had a gf once way back in the day whod told him his porn bothered her. but he was like, ah, shut up. he never knew why because shed never explained to him nhow it affected her. she just said, it hurts me. but i had put it forth in a way he as a man could totally understand. and he did. so i suggested while i had no probs if he felt the need to wack his noodle, but instead of watching porn, could we make our own porn that he could do this too? he happily agreed. while i had to compromise on some things id never been willing to do before sexually, because these were a major turn on for him, i decided we both had to make some sacrifices. and our sex life improved on a higher level then either him nor i imagined. 3 yrs later, hes still porn free. hes long since gave all his porn dvds away to buddies, he even did it in front of me. he did not care what his friends thought. he erased ALL his porn off the laptop, he has since recently told me he feels new. like he has absolutely no desire whatsoever to view porn. he said it just has no place in his life. he said he never realized just how seriously it had affected me, and our love was more important to him, then his porn. and our children. we have a couple daughters. i told him respect goes a long way. and it always comes home to roost at the end of the day. he understood what i meant. and wants for his daughters the best. as well. he and i are very very happy. and im just relieved the nightmare of his porn is over. i feel he has grown up over the lastcoupel of yrs. he never thought in his life hed ever give up porn. but he told me the way i presented the problem, etc made a huge difference to how he understood it. and i was not a bitch about it. we sat down. and i pleaded with him maturely, and passionately, that it hurt me, that i loved him. that things needed to change. that our relationship was going to end if he continued porn because it was affedcting me emotionally and was making me hate sex. it was killing me sexually. and it made me sad. he wanted me to be happy. to be full of life again. i hope you will find inspriation in my story and find a way to make your bf understand. or, have him read my response. and if he does, heres a message to him. its killing her menatlly. its killing her sexually. find another suitable outlet, e.g i made homemade porn to satisfy his needs. becuase everyone has something that makes them insecure. and guys are terrified of the small dick syndrome. well, imagine the feeling s it gives you, the way it affects your sex life, and then apply the same feelings and the same respons, to your gf. she is being affected the same way. so, good luck my dear and any other questions, or comments, and your welcome to message me anytime. sorry my response was long. but its a much needed one. some people out there just dont get it. i hope your bf will be one who does.
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A
female
reader, Miamine +, writes (12 March 2010):
Can't add anything more to PM's wonderful way of approaching this. Can you update your post in light of the questions that have been asked of you.
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A
male
reader, bharat mehta +, writes (12 March 2010):
PM's answer/analysis. through totally new light on the issue. Personally I am not in favor of porn, but the way the analysis is presented is at least thinkable. Why so many male and not female feel interest in porn? It may be true that female think porn as competitive agent. It is just last two centuries, sex became a subject of scholastic minded people. It is good, to think rationally, perhaps subject of sex need more rational views.
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A
male
reader, PM +, writes (12 March 2010):
 First and foremost, I think you need to figure out for yourself why the porn bothers you. Is it because you feel that it makes you inadequate as a lover? If this is the case, then you need to try to understand his perspective on this.
It may be that, for you, if you ever started looking at another man that that would mean your boyfriend was inadequate in some way. For a man, however, that isn't the truth. Every man needs sexual variety to some degree and that degree depends largely on the man. It's not a statement about you if he wants to watch porn, it's a statement about him and his need for variety.
Another thing that I think I'm hearing your question is that you consider sexual attraction and romantic attraction to be very similar or even the same thing. This is not the case, especially not for men. A man might be sexually attracted to all sorts of women but may only be willing to be romantically involve with a small number of those he would have sex with. For men, sexual attraction is just a response to an attractive woman.
And from the sounds of your question, it seems as though you want him to stop. In my experience, a relationship where you force someone to give up some aspect of their sexual identity usually ends badly. If you think you could spend the rest of your life with him, then you have to learn to love him for who he is. Porn tendencies and all.
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