A
female
age
51-59,
*wodayzgn
writes:For the past nearly 2 years our family has been doing battle with a highly-intelligent, scheming and sneaky cock roach named Adam. My daughter met him 7 years ago, and they had only dated 2 months when we began to see a huge change in her. They would hang out more and more in the bedroom (with the door open), she started to close me out, and her grades in school dropped substantially. Not to mention the physical changes, such as weight loss and a ton of bruises on her neck from hickies. My husband and I tried to talk with Adam, but he became belligerent and sent us harassing text messages stating that we were horrible parents and that she would be better off with him. Finally, after a 24 hour marathon argument, my daughter agreed that Adam might not be right for her and she opened her eyes to the drastic changes in her personality and appearance. Ultimately, she broke up with them. Again, that was what we call "Round 1" which happened 7 years ago. Now, fast forward to December, 2012. All is wonderful in my daughter's life. She was doing great at her job (of 2 years), she bought a brand new car on her own, had lots of money in the bank, and enjoyed hanging out with friends and shopping. Enter the Cock Roach (Adam)! AT the end of December, 2012, my daughter told us she was thinking about dating Adam again. Trying to be the understanding mom, and realizing she is an adult now, I said O.K., but asked her to keep in mind all the damage he did to her and our family 7 years ago. The minute that piece of crap came back into her and our lives, things began to quickly fall apart AGAIN! Changes in her behavior, calling off of work (which she NEVER did), closing herself off from family and friends, and hanging out with Adam in the bedroom for hours upon end. To make a long story short, my husband and I have been through Hell and Back trying to work with our daughter to get her to see what everyone else sees - He's Just Not Right For HER!!! Despite every effort, my daughter and the cock roach were breaking up every other week, they moved into an apartment for one month and then had to move out, my daughter lost her 2-year job and couldn't keep the other 5 jobs she tried to get during this horrible 2 years. She lost the brand new car and ultimately had to file Bankruptcy. My daughter had one confirmed nervous breakdown during this time period, for which my husband and I nursed her through all of the sobbing and crying and trips to the counselor and medications. There's nothing we wouldn't have done for our daughter! The cock roach just kept coming back for more of her and wouldn't leave her alone for a second despite a talk he and I had about letting Sadie rest and get some help at home. He agreed to this and said he'd back off and they would just date instead of trying to live together, BUT it was the very same day he agreed to this that he started right in on her again to have his children and move out with him, saying they would "Do it right this time".Our daughter left our house almost 10 days ago, and told us she didn't care if she ever saw us again. The confusing part about her making this statement was that none of us were arguing or in any way upset with each other. It was literally a day before that that my daughter and I had a wonderful day out together! That day, she got up, got dressed and told us she was going to hang out with her friend Teresa. She left at noon, and by 9:00 p.m., we began to worry about her so we text her repeatedly, and called her friends. At 10:30 p.m., she walked into the house and promptly began packing her things. Her parting words were "I don't care if I ever see you again." We were shocked and horrified that night, and STILL are!I am crushed, devastated and can't hardly function day to day. My husband and I walk around like zombies not knowing what to do with ourselves. While I would love your advice and hope for some way to resolve this problem, we feel like she's just lost to us at the age of 22. There really isn't anything more we could possibly do or say to her. She's totally and completely under the cock roach's spell. HELP!!!![Mod note: names were changed]
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reader, anonymous, writes (20 March 2019): Dear Grieving Mother. I am in your place. My beautiful, hardworking, well-educated, 27-year old daughter is now under the power and control of a 45-year old, unemployed, married addict with a criminal history of violence against women. He pursued her at the gym and persuaded her to believe she was an angel sent by his mother who died of cancer two years ago. During this time of tremendous grief I have listened to people say, “It’s her fault, she’s too nice.” Or “It’s your fault, you raised her in a bubble.” Meanwhile he is draining her energy and emptying her bank accounts. I’m writing to say, I’m sorry for your grief and suffering. I feel your pain and helplessness. We are suffering the tragic consequences of his families’ dysfunction and mistakes. I hope you have found some solace since the time you posted your story. And I continue to pray that love will conquer evil.
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reader, twodayzgn +, writes (5 May 2014):
twodayzgn is verified as being by the original poster of the question Its been about a week since I've submitted this post. My daughter and I still have not communicated, but somehow I've accepted this new chapter in my life. Not that I'm happy with it, but rather I don't continue to overwhelm myself with the whys and hows, I merely gave it up to my God for now. Counseling has just begun, so its too soon to notice progress. Just having an impartial ear is enough to feel that I'm moving forward. I'm not sure about the medication though. While I am on a couple of meds, I'm wondering if I should ask my doctor for something more, like Latuda? As I look back over the past 20 years, there are some experiences that have most certainly changed me, which might explain how I got off track as a parent with my daughter. At this point, I wonder just how much fight is left in me...or anyone at my age of nearly 50? I'm sure its just me, but it seems that I've have more than my share of wars and battles over the years. One incident, in particular, took all the air out of my sails and I just haven't fully recovered. Its my fault for giving someone that kind of power over me. Have you ever come into contact with someone who was pure evil? I mean the kind of person who, just standing next to them, gives you the willies? Anyway, I struggle to continue to find the strength and the will to fight for my very survival. Some days I feel victorious. Other days not so much. I am human.
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reader, agneeman  +, writes (25 April 2014):
 Wow. You have exceeded my exoectations. You are so brave. I salute you.
Cerberus, good on you!
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reader, twodayzgn +, writes (24 April 2014):
twodayzgn is verified as being by the original poster of the questionThanks again for all the advice and input on this matter. I called my daughter's counselor and told her she wouldn't be coming back, but that I needed some help. She readily agreed and my first session is this Saturday. I am in uncharted territory and find this new way of living both scary and exciting at the same time. Scary in that it'll be hard to go from being "mom" to facing her as just a "woman". Exciting in that my husband and I can maybe start to travel and check off some of those bucket list items. Its hard to really look in the mirror and see flaws in one's self where you hadn't noticed them before. But I'd like to think I am strong and resilient, and will get through this no matter how long it takes and how many tears are still to come. As for my daughter, [name removed], I do believe you are right in saying she will come back eventually. My goal, in seeking counseling, is to prepare me for her return. I will continue to post updates and look forward to any further advice/input any of you would like to offer. Its nice to know I am not alone.
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reader, agneeman +, writes (24 April 2014):
My apologies for this. I'm gonna have to show you some tough love here:
Look up the word "fledging"
In fact, watch a documentary on fledging.
It is a harsh but natural process and it had been delayed too long.
There's a lesson you and your daughter have to learn here.
If she were independant emotionally Adam would not be half the threat he is, that's why she is drawn to him.
You're gonna hate me for saying it. You're too involved. You strike me as one of those overbearing couples whose kids can't show integrity because they've never had to. By integrity I mean balls. Having your own identity.
Us independant kids? Other people can't push us around so easily. We are strong because our parents allowed us to slip, fall and get the heck up.
You're really not liking me, are you?
You said she's an adult right? So treat her like one. Why not let her make her own mistakes?
I'm not saying don't help her when she needs you... that time will come too... I'm saying she has got to be in the drivers seat of her life and she can't do that unless you get out of it.
Her behaviour is indictive of slave mentality, not freedom. But how can she be free if you have not allowed her too? (Oooh, I hit a nerve there).
I think, in this situation, love is going to mean something entirely different from what you know,inderstand or want it to mean.
Irrespective of whether or not you want it to, the time for her fledging has come. The process has been delayed far too long now.
Here's to the fully fledged woman that's gonna rise our of the ashes here.
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reader, anonymous, writes (24 April 2014): OP none of this says anything about you as a mother at all.
Don't let doubt like that creep in, that's exactly the kind of mindset she wants you in to keep you desperate and malleable. For 7 years she's been laying the "bad parent" routine on you, it's not the case. Part of standing up for yourself is to realise that loving your daughter unconditionally and sacrificing your happiness, your mental well-being, everything you had to give her what she needed in life makes you a great parent but when it comes to situations like this it can be very easy to be a sucker to sentimentality.
It's the ones we give our all to that have the greatest power over us and kids get that from the start, there is nothing in this that says you're not a great parent. It's just that now the time for being a parent is over, and the time for being a woman that won't be pushed around by her begins.
You did your best and she will be back some day, probably soon too given her track record. You need to be prepared to face her woman to woman with all the respect you demand of any other adult and even moreso because it's the duty of adult children to honour their parents. They no longer get the pass that hormonal teenagers get, they're adults now. There's no excuses for not showing respect and they get nothing from you without showing respect.
OP if she was 12 and still under your charge acting like this then it'd be your duty to fight for her like you've always done. But she's an adult now, an independent adult that has to be treated as such, fighting for her now means letting her go. She does not get to hurt you like this and you certainly will not let her keep breaking your husband's heart this way, protecting him is now your sole focus, as his is protecting you.
As a family you will get through this, and no matter how long it takes you will be there for her if or when she matures and learns some respect, but that does not mean you're just going to let your life stand still while you wait and hope, in this much pain.
I can't imagine the pain you're going through, the daughter you raised has gone and in a way it's like she died. That's a horrific thought for me to contemplate and I hope I never find myself in your situation. I can only hope that in your situation I could find my way through the grief and pain to do what was right for the family that is left behind, to be strong for them but I haven't yet spent 22 years of my life loving every moment of someone and investing everything I have in them only for them to spit in my face and crush me. My wife comes before all others, kids would be part of that too but like my wife, they do not get a pass to fuck me over just because I'll love them unconditionally.
I would seek help, this is a bereavement and the grieving process would be long and difficult but it has to be done. Like any break up the most vulnerable time is when you're grieving, it's the time you're the most desperate and it's the time you'd give anything to have things the way they were but that's the worst possible outcome too.
Unconditional love does not mean unconditional respect, that's earned and she has a hell of a long way to go to earning that back and it has to be non-negotiable. It's not something a 24 hour chat and lots of tears will solve anymore. It's a long term process of her proving herself to you and cutting the lies and bullshit.
I was serious when I said that about her room, OP, she burned that bridge, your house is no longer her home. She has to build her own nest now.
Don't let all this make you lose faith in yourself, just look around you at the husband you have the life you have built, she cannot take away from all you've achieved, she is not your failure, she's an adult who has decided she wants to be a prick to people and spit in their faces. Well she will learn how that works out for people when they don't have two suckers who wipe her arse for her.
You know as well as I do life is incredibly tough for people who treat people like that and that's the way it has to be because it's the only chance they have of learning that it's not way to be. The only chance she has of changing into a person who learns the value of respect is to have that tough life without mammy and daddy there to be her fools.
You did nothing wrong, you did the best you could and you can hold your head high because of that, any normal child would be proud to call you a parent and some day when she snaps out of this she will too. But it's time to move on now. 7 years of this shit is now over and you get to be a woman and a wife again. get your grieving done, come to terms with the reality of your life again and start living for yourself now.
It took a while for my mother to get used to the fact that me and my three sisters had flew the nest and were never coming back there to live. But she loves her freedom now, she gets to do whatever the hell she likes now and her 30+ years of being a mommy are over, she's a woman now again free to enjoy her life, job done. It's our turn to honour her in everything we do in life because you can bet your ass if we didn't then we can fuck off, because her love for us does not extend to us abusing her.
Your daughter has been emotionally abusing her own parents, and as an adult she does not get to do that ever again. You will never allow her the opportunity to treat your loving husband that way again.
It'll be okay, OP. Your life has changed now, it's time to make sure that it has done so for the better.
Best of luck.
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reader, twodayzgn +, writes (24 April 2014):
twodayzgn is verified as being by the original poster of the questionI'd like to thank you, Cerberus, for helping me but this whole situation in perspective. You are right about so many things. Its funny. I always thought I was a great mother, but now I'm not so sure. It was never my intention to be a stumbling block for my daughter. I just didn't want her to grow up being daddy's little punching bag and mommy's biggest mistake! Learning how to "grow a pair" might take some time and patience, but you are right that we have to make a stand. I have already taken steps to sell the car she was driving and canceled her phone plan. Other than telling her to "leave me alone", I haven't and don't intend to speak to her anytime soon. I feel a little bit ashamed of myself, but I guess we live and learn every single day.
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reader, anonymous, writes (24 April 2014): Whilst I previously said something along the lines of her doing what she wants until she feels like coming back, I agree with Cerberus that it's very likely that she's just using you.Maybe she did have a nervous breakdown but, by the sounds of it, she's nearly always (if not always) got her own way so, if you don't agree with her, she'll through a tantrum and say/do things she knows will be like a dagger in the heart for those who want the best for her.Now, I'm not saying Adam is blameless in all of this, but she didn't just get brainwashed - the personality changes must have already been in her and Adam either coaxed them out or she saw him as an opportunity to become like a victim enough for you and your husband to bend over backwards for her whilst she's keeping Adam on the hook.At the very least she loves bringing drama into your lives to get what she wants. That's a part of her whether Adam is around or not.So, let her go. Leave her to make her own choices/mistakes, then make her start behaving like a mature adult (for months) before you let her back into your lives frequently, let alone living in your house. Do NOT let her blackmail you; I have a feeling she'd throw something like "if you don't do ________ for me you don't love me any more" at you upon her return.You raised your daughter very well with one obvious downside: she knows how to manipulate you. Is Adam as bad as you've been led to believe? I don't think so. He could be a willing, all-knowing accomplice in all of this but, unless you've seen most of it with your own eyes - i.e him mistreating her - it's very possible she mislead you and manipulated what he's said and done to seem more vicious than it truly is/was.Stand your ground with her; she's behaving like a spoilt child and you need to demand respect from her; you're all getting jerked around into feeling sorry for her when she may be calling the shots or is, at the very least, choosing to deliberately hurt you by being nasty.
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reader, anonymous, writes (24 April 2014): OP want another way of looking at this? She's flown the nest and you need to get used to the idea that she's an adult now off living her own life, just in a rather more distressing way than you imagined it would be.
OP I'm going to be tough on you here, there's no other way I can approach this. You're just too much of a pushover.
OP all through reading your story one thing just bothered me, I know it's not really the thing to do (I'm certainly not advising it) but I would have called right on over to where he was and pummelled the little fucker until he learned what happens when you make threats to someone like me. You know, see how tough he is when he's not hiding behind his phone. But first, I'd make him tell me where he got that shit from. You see that's important and you'll see why.
The only problem with kicking his ass is it wouldn't solve the real issue here, and no offence, it's that your daughter is complete and utter, self-centred, spoiled bitch. If it wasn't Adam it would be someone else because she knows mammy and daddy will be there to wipe her arse no matter what she does.
"There's nothing we wouldn't have done for our daughter!"
Exactly my point. There have to be things you won't do for her or she'll just spit in your face any time she wants because she knows you're too soft and she can always come back. She's the boss in your family and guess who taught her that? That's right, you and her soft touch father who actually think Adam is the problem.
It didn't occur to you where he got the idea you were bad parents from? Where he got the idea it would be okay to send those messages 7 damn years ago?
Look no further than little Miss Sociopath, OP, your precious little girl.
Adam is as much of a fool as you both are. Honestly it's not rocket science to figure out the common denominator in all your problems here. you're just too emotionally attached and in denial to actually examine what's been happening.
Adam is not the one who who keeps spitting in your face, Adam didn't just decide out of nowhere that you were bad parents, he's not the one who said he doesn't care if he ever saw you again, that was all your daughter. She's an incredibly skilled sociopath and she has you and her father wrapped around her finger.
You know she'll be back right? You know she only said what she did because she knew how hurt it would make you? You know that's a ploy to keep the door open, to make you realise how painful not having her is so she can keep walking all over you?
You see that's what spoiled little shits do to pushover parents, those parents are so hurt, they won't forget how hurt they were when their princess left. They don't want to believe she truly meant it so when she comes back with her tail between her legs and the tears rolling down her face with her fake apologies, you'll remember that pain and you'll just melt for her again.
Oldest trick in the book.
OP your own daughter intentionally hurts you more than anyone in your life ever has. She did that on purpose. But that's Adam's fault right? Sure thing, he made her do that. She could cut your husband's head off right in front of you and start eating his brains and you'd just want to hug her and tell her everything is okay, then blame Adam.
OP she's so good at this she cried, poured her heart out, took medication and put on a complete act and then just spat in your face again.
24 hour marathon arguments? Oh come on, OP.
When my wife read this just now, she concluded you don't want to see what your daughter really is because it would crush you so you use Adam as the scapegoat, you deflect so as not to project the blame back on yourselves and you find that easy to do because the timing of Adam coming into your lives coincides with this happening. Somehow the idea that your daughter was only seizing on the opportunity he represented doesn't occur to you. The idea that she's behind all this all too much for you to believe because she's your precious little angel.
I have to say I admire the puppet master in all this, she's fucking good. She has a guy so hung up on her and so believing her shit he truly thinks you and her father are the devil, you too then think he's the devil.
That way Poor Little Victim Sadie gets to keep playing both of you and you blame each other.
OP I don't admire her in the sense of her as a person, I admire how well she has taken all of you in. I admire the fact that he owns you and your husband and in the next little while she'll come home with her crocodile tears and her sorry's and this whole cycle begins again.
Unless you finally actually grow a pair and decide enough is enough but you won't.
OP you need to get over this Adam thing, she's the problem. Thinking it's Adam hasn't resolved this at all. She's 22 for fuck's sake, these are her choices as an adult, a choice to hurt you badly. You need to look beyond the sentimentality of this being your daughter and treat her like any adult who treated you this way and when she comes crawling back, say no for once and see what happens. You'll see the real her for a change. But you won't, you're a soft touch that gets weepy about her. She only has to cry and she'll get her own way yet again, feed you her bullshit about how Adam is such a bad person. Then hurt Adam the same way she does you by telling him she hopes she never sees him again.
You know when that happened, I'd have packed her bags for her, except I would have taken every single thing that was bought with my money right out of those bags because they're mine, not hers, if those bags where mine guess what? I'll give her paper shopping ones.
I bet you even left her room untouched, waiting, pining for her to return. That'd be my new gym or hobby room, I'd put all her mementos into a box and give them all to charity.
It's not that my door would never be open to her again, it's that she'd have a hell of a lot to prove to me before she becomes my daughter again because the daughter I knew is obviously gone. I don't know how you and your husband don't see that. Because there have to be consequences, OP and for that you have to see who the real problem person is here.
I think you and he need professional help here but the problem is you're American, if they don't just throw pills at you as a solution they'll be just as softly softly as you and call for emotional understanding and all that shit.
It's time to get tough, it's time to move on with your lives without your daughter in it, it's time to wash your hands of her and treat her like an adult. What you don't seem to get OP is you've been feeding this all along. You've been wiping her arse and letting her play the victim. She's knows you'll do anything for her, which means she knows she can do anything to you and you'll just take it.
You need to break the cycle. She's not a little girl that needs you anymore, in fact she's decided she wants notbhing to do with you. So start packing up all her things, turn her room into something else and when she comes crawling back say "not this time, this time you earn our respect".
OP you'll never stop loving her, you'll never completely abandon her but you are ruining her by not standing up to her. You don't pander to people like that, you put your foot down.
If you can't do that, then go get professional help to learn how to. You could probably set up a mediator who would come to you next time she turns up and make sure your conditions are met before she's allowed to come back into your lives again.
Actions must have consequences and she doesn't get a free pass. She made her bed, time to put a pool table where hers used to be. You can't live a life of waiting and hoping in this much pain. Until she gives you guys the respect you deserve then she deserves nothing from you.
Get some professional advice, OP, both you and your husband.
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reader, anonymous, writes (24 April 2014): I was like your daughter when I was younger. I thought my boyfriend was everything and he was emotionally abusing me and physically. There was nothing anyone could do to try and stop me from being with him. I changed into a different person also. Im sorry to tell uou but there is nothing you can do as its like she has had a spell cast on her and you will just have to wait until that spell is broken, which means when your daughter wakes up and realizes for herself what this man is. He has probably broken her self esteem right down. Dont try to interfere as you will be wasting your time, just leave her to it and be ther when she comes to you. But apart from that there is nothing you can do . This happens to a lot of girls and eventually they wake up.
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