A
female
age
,
anonymous
writes: We have been together 5 years and I know he is in contact with his ex-he says to discuss kids. I know she wants him back. I also know they text and call each other frequently. I also know he deletes his texts from her and most likely, the record of their calls from his cell phone. I know she sends him emails. Is it wrong for me to put a keylogger on my own laptop (I know he uses it instead of his own)to monitor what the content and frequency is of their contact. He says I don't trust him and I suppose this is true but it is because he hides things from me - that I know for certain. If I keep my life an open book to him - in regards to my ex and everything else, is it wrong to expect the same? I do not lock my phone, delete texts or go into another room when I get a phone call.Am I being too controlling? Is it unethical to secretly monitor my own computer? Am I crazy for wanting to know?
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female
reader, So_Very_Confused +, writes (26 March 2015):
 OP, i would not even bother with an "ultimatum".
I mean if you live together with him now what are you going to say "stop contacting her or get out?" all that will mean is he will hide it better.
I agree that it's time to just go.
If you ask and ask and ask and he lies and lies and lies (omissions are lies too) then you already know what's going to happen. he will try to have his cake and eat it too and lie some more to you placate you and keep you hanging on.
good luck.
A
female
reader, YouWish +, writes (25 March 2015):
 I am not calling YOU names. He sees you as a meal ticket and sex holder. Surely you can see that NOW after finding out that he's still very much with her physically! Stop attacking other people and face your real problem.
You've gone way past the ultimatum stage. Just leave the guy! I called HIM a name...a parasite...and I stand by it.
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A
reader, anonymous, writes (25 March 2015): This is verified as being by the original poster of the questionHoneypie – I just want to clarify that the computer I wanted to put the keylogger on is my own. He has his own laptop – he just chooses to use mine because it is always set up. Therefore, I do not think it is illegal for me to hack my own computer. However, it is probably unethical to sneak and spy on him that way. I already know I can’t trust him so it all seems pointless at this point anyway.
YouWish – Calling me names is not helpful. If loving and trusting people is wrong, then I don’t want to live in this world. However, obviously I can’t trust him-he has proved that. The extent of their relationship is unknown, but he is doing things behind my back and will not make a complete break with her – that I cannot deal with. That I have to do something about – for me. I thought my decision was clear in my last post.
Update: I came home from work last night and he was asleep on the couch. I went to look up the number for a new pizza place on the internet – my lap top and his email was open – open and displayed an email from her about making plans to get together. I also saw that he has a folder in his email just for hers (email). I did not look at any other emails though – the temptation was HUGE – I didn’t – I found out enough to know they are getting together behind my back and that it is not the first time. I feel used, foolish and pretty much disgusted with him and with myself for putting up with this so long. So I guess it is time for the ultimatum and to get prepared to walk.
I am devestated.
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A
female
reader, YouWish +, writes (24 March 2015):
He moved into your house?? OMG.
You are being used in every possible way a guy can use someone. What do you need trust for? You're the meal ticket and the sex holder rolled into one. Of course he's carrying on with his wife. He has everything he could want.
The guy is a parasite, and you're droning on about shades of gray? As if a keylogger will change any decision you have made about him? You are in serious denial, and you'll justify anything you see from any keylogger. You have to desperately entrench mentally in order to not feel like a fool. Stop that! You are no "don't end up like me" victim. You made your choices. Now make different ones and KICK HIM OUT!
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A
female
reader, Honeypie +, writes (24 March 2015):
 I think you have answered your own question, which is a good sign (to me) because it means you are thinking past the " Oh I love him, so he must love me too". You are now paying attention to his actions and his words.
With or without snooping by using a keylogger you have to make a decision if you are OK with thing as they stand. If you are not, and he IGNORES your feelings - then you KNOW how he really sees you. (Not as important to him and he is to you).
And you are right in your advice to other women. "dating" a married man or even a separated one is RARELY a good idea. He will be busy looking out for #1 (himself) and expect YOU to look out for him too. Making you a lower priority.
YOUR feelings and doubt are valid. NEVER forget that.
My husband talk occasionally to his ex-wife (they were divorced a good 5 years before we got together, so slightly different circumstances) His "kids" with her are in their 20's. He talks to them WAY more often than he talks to her. I don't distrust him, so talking to her is NOT a huge deal for me, though I would not have a problem sending her off to Mars on a one-way mission.
You write :
**- He says he has no plans to divorce her but wants to remain with me, as a piece of paper does not define a relationship.***
Well, ISN'T that just convenient!? FOR HIM. My guess is it would COST him a LOT of money to divorce her or loss of prestige. And who knows you might get a wild hair up your bum that he will MARRY you if he comes single. So right now he stay married out of convenience. Why the wife allows it, I'm not sure, again either she cares for him or it's all about the money.
BUT where does that leave you? IT LEAVES you the mistress. The Other Woman. The woman who IS NOT introduced to family and friends, the woman who ISN'T in the Christmas pictures, who doesn't get to met the grand-kids (if/when) they have any. YOU are the "dirty secret". A position no one should be in.
The man wants to play house with you, nothing more. And because he is STILL married you can't legally or otherwise make ANY DEMANDS on him, can you?
The main reason I'm very much against a keylogger and snooping is because of what it turns YOU into. It's underhanded. And it's criminal (Invasion of privacy is a class A misdemeanor) Hacking can lead to both criminal and civil liability. And using a keylogger (even if the lap top is yours, is HACKING). So consider this, IS he worth stopping so low for?
YOU can make the decision to stay or leave without KNOWING what they talk about in their PRIVATE e-mails. It's really up to you.
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A
reader, anonymous, writes (24 March 2015): This is verified as being by the original poster of the questionWell my question was if it was wrong to put a keylogger on my computer. Apparently the consensus is that it is wrong. My true issue is trust. I don’t trust him and I cannot trust him in the situation I am in or allow myself to be in. My intention was really not to go there. I am not a black and white person – I see shades of gray. I believe people do not always fit the mold. I do not believe he is a deplorable person. I just seek the truth so that I can make decisions for my own life. Being in the dark is frustrating and stressful. And he is not hearing me. As actions speak louder than words obviously there are some that I need to take. Whether or not he is having his cake and eating it or completely true to me, he should be taking the proper steps to shut the door completely with her or I need to walk and move on. Whatever his original intentions were, he made a decision that directly affects our relationship and did not ask me or even tell me about it until I confronted him. That was unfair and I feel duped, used and cheap. I have said on many occasions that I am, for all intensive purposes a mistress. I am also a single woman, pretty attractive with options. And by the way, I supported myself prior to his moving in and I can support myself without him – so money is not the issue.Ladies – make sure they are divorced before you ever get involved with them. They will tell you anything to make you invest yourself in them. And make sure you see the copy of the divorce decree. Otherwise, you could end up like me.
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A
female
reader, YouWish +, writes (23 March 2015):
Because he wants no-strings sex, that's why! It's not that hard to figure out. There's nothing EX about his WIFE, so you shouldn't refer to her as his EX. The only RESOLUTION there is in this case is for YOU to END IT and walk. If you've been having this conversation over and over to no results, then this is the only thing to do, and the fact that you haven't means the guy can easily walk all over you. Your trust issues are irrelevant, because right now, you'd stay with him if he decides to have sex with his wife right in front of you.
There *is* no confusion. There is only masochism on your part and a complete lack of respect he has for you and lack of respect you have in yourself.
You said this: "That would be without knowing the people involved – who they are inside and their history"
Again, you're there because you have no security. The man is a cheater. His wife wants him back, and he wants to be with her and have sex with you at the same time. You judge someone by their actions, and his are deplorable. I wish his wife were on here because I'd tell her to divorce him and toss him out on the curb and cut him off. He is a dog who is using you for a penis holder and to salve his ego. When he tires of you, he will leave you. If he actually loved you, he would free himself to be with you all the way. The kids are grown, so he has zero reason to be with her or stay married. My grandparents lived like they do - married but living apart. They're just as married as if they lived together. You are a third wheel.
You need to leave. That or freak yourself into therapy, which you should be in anyways if you're swallowing the whole "My story is unique" nonsense he's feeding you and you're justifying to yourself in order to NOT feel degraded. Honestly. Trust issues????? You ask if you're too controlling? You are out of control in your own life, and you have no control over your husband. In fact, he's controlling you...he's got you putting out while he stays with his wife and keeps you afraid for your own security and under his thumb.
Get your own money. Get independent. Drop him. You'll be amazed at how the confusion magically clears up from your mind.
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reader, anonymous, writes (23 March 2015): This is verified as being by the original poster of the questionYouWish – I get it. You have said nothing I have not heard before or at one time or another thought myself. Looking from the outside, I would advise the same way. That would be without knowing the people involved – who they are inside and their history. Please don’t think I have never voiced the very things you wrote. I have – on multiple occasions. It is a constant discussion that never comes to a resolution because the only resolution is for him to divorce her. I have asked myself over and over can I live like this? I guess I can’t as I have no security and there are trust issues that seem insurmountable. I just don’t understand why he would leave her – profess love and create a life with me – only to go back to her. Why make a life with me if he really wants to be with her?
I just don’t get it. And that makes me doubt any resolve I have to leave.
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A
female
reader, YouWish +, writes (23 March 2015):
Seriously?? You're his MISTRESS and he is MARRIED. You have wasted 5 years of your life on this loser, and every day you waver is another day wasted.
YES, you're insecure for even BEING with him. Do you think that you aren't worth having a relationship with a SINGLE guy who can actually offer a real relationship? No, you are his woman on the side and his primary relationship is with her. The whole "marriage is just a piece of paper" thing...come on!? You buy that crap? I'd buy it if he actually LIVED that notion and was not married, but he has the piece of paper with HER.
If the kids are over the age of 20, then he has no business exchanging a single WORD with her in type or print or by phone unless it's through the courts to divorce her. You've been played, and he's having his cake and eating it too.
You've been excluded from his family stuff because you're the Other Woman and he is still married. You have swallowed a 5-year line of BS and this relationship will go nowhere.
Trust issues?! The guy is a cheater, disregards you, and you're even wasting time talking about keyloggers and trust? YOu know you can't trust him. The real question is whether or not you have an ounce of self-esteem enough to leave this joke of a "relationship".
Leave or be his penis holder for 5 more years. He does not love you and he never ever will. Do not be *this* desperate...buying his crap degrades and debases you and gives all women a bad name. Sorry to be so blunt, but if you haven't left him 4 1/2 years ago, then the odds are bleak that you ever will unless he kicks you out after you've been utterly used up. Take back your life.
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A
reader, anonymous, writes (23 March 2015): This is verified as being by the original poster of the questionI guess I was too cryptic. -We both have children from prior marriages, all over the age of 20. -He left her and she has wanted him back ever since.- He is still married to her but has not lived with her for 6 years.- He says he has no plans to divorce her but wants to remain with me, as a piece of paper does not define a relationship.- I have snooped before in the past and confessed to it – what I saw was her constantly stating her love for him, references to sending emails, phone calls.- I have snooped and not confessed and caught him in lies. Nothing that suggested he is cheating on me. But if he lies about small things…….??- he says I don’t trust him not just because of the snooping, because I stopped that a while ago. Any questions about his contact with her and my displeasure with his contact with her is met with – “Obviously, you don’t trust me.”- His kids can’t stand me as they blame me for their dad not returning to their mom.- Since his kids can’t stand me, I am not allowed to attend any events (team sporting events and one is a musician)they have that their father attends – he meets her there and they sit together – I stay home.- I know that I am insecure – I know that it is unattractive.- I have ASKED and ASKED and ASKED about his communications with her – I get evasive and ambiguous responses.I do not lock my phone or hide my credit card numbers. I treat him as a spouse. There is nothing to look at. Any contact I have with MY ex – I share – not because I have to but mostly because I …do.I want to just know – really know – that there is nothing for me to worry about. If he would divorce her, it would make me secure but he refuses to do so. I guess I know in my heart of hearts that I just need to trust and try and put it out of my mind. Not easy. I love him. I just wished prior to falling in love with him, I knew that he never intended to divorce her. I wouldn’t be here now.And of course, the other option is to walk away. Now I am so invested in this relationship (emotionally and lifestyle-wise)that it is not an easy thing to do. He says he loves me only and has no intention of leaving me. I guess I have to just stop obsessing. If only that little voice inside me would shut up – LOL.
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A
female
reader, YouWish +, writes (23 March 2015):
You are 51-59? Is your guy the same age? Are the kids grown is what I'm getting at? If his kids are grown, then he has no business talking to her in any capacity. If they are still minors, then he does, but only to coordinate child care issues and only child care issues.
It sounds like he's been locking his phone and deleting texts because you have had a history of reading through them, hence his "you don't trust me" comment, right?
First of all, your willingness to not lock your phone is not cool. Would you not lock your car or your house? Would you leave your pocketbook open and your credit cards and money in public view? No way, so why would you expose your personal information by NOT locking your phone? Everyone should lock up in my opinion. Second of all, just because you're willing to be open with your personal correspondence doesn't obligate someone else to be. Being in a relationship does not obligate someone to give up privacy. No one is entitled to read someone else's texts, phone records, private computer files or Facebook messages.
If you can't trust him to the point of wanting a keylogger on your computer, then you're wasting your time being with him, because you can't handle his baggage. A cheater will cheat regardless of whether or not you hover, monitor, hack, keylog, crack into phone, steal a diary, hide a tape recorder under a car seat, or any number of surveillance.
The best choice you can possibly make is to find a trustworthy guy. If he is acting inappropriately with his ex, then you don't need to "catch" him keylogging. *I* think he is acting inappropriately, to be honest. There is no reason for them to be in constant daily correspondence, especially if she is trying to get him back. If it's "just for the kids", then his involvement with her should be short and sweet. Civil and businesslike texts or emails when necessary are all that should happen, not this ongoing indepth emotional bond thing going on, and that is what I think is going on.
Especially if the kids are over 18, and then he should have NOTHING to do with her unless they are in the same building for high school or college graduation or a wedding or something like that.
I'd leave him. You don't need to go delving if you don't trust him. You have to decide whether or not his baggage you can live with or not, but if you CAN live with it, then you need to live with it, as in trust him. Cheaters will cheat no matter what, so avoid the headaches, obsession, and panic attacks. If you can't avoid them, then leave him even if he's faithful because life is too short to give yourself a stroke over trust issues.
If you have trust issues no matter who you're with, then you need to see a therapist for skills on how to deal with them, because even if you had all of his texts, keylogging, and his privacy in full view, you'll still obsess. Trust issues are a Venus flytrap - the more you indulge them, the hungrier and more obsessive you'll get.
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A
female
reader, PeanutButter +, writes (21 March 2015):
 Honestly, he might well just be in contact for the kds, my husband frequently deletes text from his ex - not to hide them, but cause he hates to see her on his phone! He doesn't even keep her in his phone under her name he dispises her so much. It might not be as nuts with your guy and his ex but it is something to consider. It is so hard dealing with exs an dhow we /THINK they feel but if you let things be and understand there are htings they need to talk about that have nothg to do with you then you will be fine, Give him some spaace and respect and try to understnd. Don't worry yourself and what will be, will be!
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A
female
reader, Honeypie +, writes (20 March 2015):
I don't think you have ANY rights to go through is e-mails in SUCH an underhanded manner. Now IF you suspected he was cheating, I can understand digging for dirt for a divorce, but because he isn't as open as YOU want him to be about HIS privacy doesn't GIVE you the right to invade his.
I think you SHOULD talk to him and YES if you do NOT trust him WHY not be honest with him?
He might "hide" things because it's a matter between him and the ex. Maybe he doesn't WANT to involve you because he doesn't WANT the communication between him and the EX to be a focal point of your relationship.
He isn't you. He likes his privacy and honestly I think it's RATHER respectful to take a call in another room. I can't not STAND the people who feel they NEED to talk about their genital herpes while waiting in the check out line. Freaking rude. I know, those are strangers, but honestly when my hubby talks to someone he leaves the room - not because he doesn't want me to hear "half" a conversation but so that THE rest of us (or just me) don't have to sit and be quiet.
I do the same (even-though my conversation can be in a language my husband do not understand) I STILL leave the room.
YOU have been with this guy for 5 years and the EX is still looming and causing you to not trust him, THAT isn't healthy.
YOU NEED to talk to him and YOU need to be honest.
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A
female
reader, MSA +, writes (20 March 2015):
 You've been together for 5 years. FIVE YEARS!! Yet you don't trust him? Why can't you simply ASK him? ASK if he's been keeping in touch with his ex. ASK what they talk/text about (if you really want to know). ASK him to let you know each time the get in contact. Why can't you just ASK?I've realized this from my own relationship that people differ in personality. I am like you - I'm an open book. Not only will I tell you anything and everything. You can easily read my facial expressions. There's no hiding. I can't pretend to be happy when Im not. I can't pretend to like something when I don't, etc. Some people, such as my boyfriend, is more secretive. He doesn't like to share any info. Not that he has things to hide, he just doesn't care to share. Since we've dated, he's learned to open up to me more and share a lot with me. Now, it's like second nature to him.Express to him what will make you happy in this relationship and work on achieving it with him!
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