A
female
age
41-50,
anonymous
writes:Are some men turned off by a woman's career path? Im in my early 30's and finishing up a cardiothoracic surgery fellowship and hoping to start my own independant pracitce next year. I have dated many guys in the past but none of them have reached the relationship level. I have met most of these guys on dating websites. Everything always went well during the initial date and we always had a nice time talking about the things we had in common and things we enjoy doing as well as our careers. However I am still single. I dont think I am doing anything wrong:*Im myself during the date*I dressed conservative for each date (ie jeans or black pants and a top that isnt very revealing)*I wear makeup butb its not too heavy*I dont act conceited and brag about my salary or career, in fact I dont mention it at all unless careers come up in the conversation and even then I just talk about my career as It is something I truly enjoy doing because its the truth.Still no man has been interested in me. I know that I shouldnt get discourged cause there is someone out there for me but I am just curious to see if there are some men out there who think a women who has a career primarly dominated bymen is a turn off. Reply to this Question
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Fancy yourself as an agony aunt? Add your answer to this question! A
female
reader, anonymous, writes (30 October 2008): Hey poster,
I must admit I have seen such a quality post after a long time on this site. I am very glad to know that there are women like you who actually exist in this world and I am very envious (lol). Generally, in your case, a man sees a strong woman and feels threatened by her postion, what he doesn't see is that position has not been achieved in a day or two, but years of hard work has gone in with sheer persistence and motivation.
It is definitely something to be admired about whether men or women. To me it shows your good traits straight away that you didn't waste time in your life and you will be someone worth spending time with as I would see you as a quality human being.
I am a woman in my late twenties with a good family life and its only since 2 years I have started to work on my career but believe me its been such a hard work, its generally the other way round. I have also worked very hard since the age of 21 but perhaps not on my career but in my married life and keeping the family and social life intact. Recently though the sense of achieving something a bit more in life has been kindled and I have started to work on it.
I think if a woman is strong enough she can achieve both things, a good career and a good family life, but it takes that special someone to understand that ( I mean the other half).
Its important to balance things out in life a little, successful in one area of life does not mean that you are successful in other areas of life as well. Its important to have variety of colours in your life that you can share with other people...that also makes you equally interesting and fulfilled in life.
People would gravitate towards you more if you have some other interests as well, and not just medicine and patients. Not just that you would have other topics to discuss and share otherwise your potential other half would lose interest very quickly.
I guess you have done a lot of hard work but it is time for you to chill out a little bit after your board exams and enjoy the company of family and friends, dont get so engrossed at work and your patients that you forget the concept of fun.
Go for holidays with some friends or family for that matter and explore the world for a month or two (like Michael Palin..lol)with your added salary, who knows you might meet someone while travelling. You will notice that outside your hospital there is a life and not everybody is dyeing, ill or serious.
Having fun and being in the company of good friends or people that you enjoy with brings normality in your life otherwise you will turn into a very dry human being.
Hope, you find contentment in whatever you do, i guess that is the essence of life anyway.
A
male
reader, anonymous, writes (30 October 2008): I really am, like someone said below women seem to suppress their femininity when they are so career driven.
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A
female
reader, anonymous, writes (30 October 2008): Hey thanks for the replies.
To the anon reader who answered my question first....I do not demand respect simply because of my career, nor do I think I should be respected any more than one who works as a retail clerk. If I knew a stripper I would not treat her like trash because of what she does. I agree with you, everyone is human and deserves to be respected. Yes I may have worked harder than strippers to get to where I am today..I am in my 12th year of education and not yet on my own until I pass the board exam next year! Im 33 years old and not done with my medical education which started back when I was 18 freshman year premed in undergrad. Still I dont think I am better than them. Becoming a surgeon was my choice and something I wanted to do. I didnt spend hundreds of thousands of dollars going to school and hours upon hours of studying and making hundreds of sacrifices just to obtain a M.D. title so I can 'demand' respect. I did it to save lives.....and I love it. By the way I show tons of respect for my patients, to me its a lot easier it show respect to an ailing person than to disrespect them.
To Bugs....so you know what its like. I get that a lot. I cant relate to anybody unless they are in the medical profession. Well sometimes. Some medical workers are not a big fan of doctors as some can be rude to those who may not have as much education as they do which is a shame. (I try to turn that stereotype around and treat every coworker and patient with utmost respect). I do have a lot of guy friends outside of medicine but they find it freaky when I talk about my stuff. Its prolly boring as well since they may not understand what I am saying either! lol. I need to try that, adding some humor into my career description to make it more interesting, thanks.
Dr. Pete, you may be right. I probably have less femininity than most women given that my career involves lots of blood, bodily fluids, lung transplants and lots of cardiac procedures. Not typical of a woman and it is shown since I am the only woman in my fellowship. And for many patients it has been a surprise for them to find out that a woman has operated on them. Honestly I do not need a man to help me get through life since I earn enough to support myself and buy the things i need plus more. To some men I can see from what you said that this may render him useless since I can easily provide for myself. I can try to work on being more feminine but the only problem that may arise is that I may be turning into something I am not. Its gets rather complicated. Thanks for your reply and compliments though. You have helped put things in perspective and I fully agree with you....I may not fulfill some men's requirements for a mate.
Irish 49...Thanks for the Kudos =) Looking my my own 'backyard' may sound really easy...especially when all of my colleagues are men. The problem that arises are work ethics issues. If I dated one of the supervising surgeons of the fellowship it would be against policy as they can show favoritism to me. It would not be a problem dating one of the other fellows but as of now they aren't looking =(. Everyone is preparing for their final board test and hoping to get out on their own next year including me. But its not stopping me from looking. lol. I could look in other hospital departments though. I could date anybody I wanted to as long as they are in a different department. I could even try networking and meeting different guys who have the same interests as me and same goals in life. For they will understand my ambitions and lifestyle. Thanks so much for your reassuring message and I will sure let my galpals know! They will be glad I am finally looking for someone! lol
Cowboy...Thanks for your admiration. Its nice to hear that you are not intimidated by my career and yes it is very fascinating. Your right I do not have much experience in the dating game as I only had one real boyfriend back in high school and havent really had anybody who respected me since then. I really didnt have much of a social life during medical school but then again who does? lol. The past 12 years of my life have been engrossed in my studies which is something I really dont regret as I love what I am doing now as well as the sense of accomplishment that comes with each successful surgery. It think it is worth getting a late start on the dating game. lol. During residency and through out the past 3 years in my fellowship I didnt see many guys except for my colleagues with whom I work with every day. My situation is probably similar to your friends situation. Widening my social circle may help a lot and networking with other men who work in medicine or even other male docs who are single and looking. I agree dating sites dont work, its like you dont know the people and its awkward so Im thinking or looking elsewhere besides the internet. Next year given that I pass my board exam I will be able to widen my social circle even more as I will be eligible to attend a national physician's conference. Thanks for your message and its good to know that there are guys out there who wont be intimidated by a woman with a ambitious career.
female anon reader... My career path is a traditional mans world as well. There were clearly more men in my medical school class than women and I was one of only 3 women in my surgical residency. I am the only woman fellow that has entered into my cardiothoracic surgery fellowship program and my last 8 years of life I have been working with men! lol. When I saw patients and explained the surgical procedure to them many of them were amazed that a woman could do such a job and I was even turned down by one patient. So I couldnt do the surgery once due to patients rights. Yeah i agree as a lot of men may think it is an insult that a woman earns more money than them, can do things they cant do and have the brains or the courage to do it. I dont know If I could outrun a guy tho. lol. =P. I would never give up my career for a guy though, and Im glad to talk to another woman who agrees with me. I just love it too much. I just took every past date with a grain of salt and figured the right guy will come sooner or later! By the way, I think its awesome that you are a firefighter. Kudos to you for having the courage to go into a burning building and save lives. I was an EMT before med school and worked with many firefighters. I always admired their hard work and dedication to saving lives despite the fact that their life was clearly at risk. Thanks for your reply and good luck to you too!! :)
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A
female
reader, anonymous, writes (28 October 2008): Nothing wrong with a STRIPPER OR SOMETHING! if that is a chosen career. Most Men love women to take their clothes off and see the feminine and sexy. We all do different walks of life and should not disrespect each other. What is respect anyway? is it look up to me? I have earned respect, so give it to me? DOES THE EGO DEMAND IT? I knew a surgeon once who had no respect for my partners life and yet the dolly trolleys (tea ladies )showed the greatest care and respect for my partner who had cancer. Hey! they may have been part time strippers or something. Respect is not about a title ! one kind WORD can save a life too. We all use different tools.
Do you RESPECT Dr Shipman just because he had a RESPECTABLE CAREER? HE KILLED MANY PEOPLE UNDER THE RESPECTABLE GUISE. Strippers are people who deserve respect
as well. You are a life saver yourself so shouldn't ALL LIFE BE RESPECTED AND VALUED EVEN STRIPPERS OR SOMTHINGS?
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A
reader, anonymous, writes (28 October 2008): I think Guys hate when a woman can judge them accurately.am a software engineer myself.I find it very difficult to relate to guys of other professional lines.I am friends with them but when it comes to dating all I was thought of was being a nerd or a geek.you are misconstrued when you talk even a sentence about one of the projects you are working on.It might be very dear to me but probably very boring to the other guy.Please don't get offended.Next time when a guy asks to talk about what do you do? just induce a pinch of humor.you can probably say things like "I can cure all the ailments of a heart",wink at him.Say something equally flirty if you have a better imagination than mine.(smiles).you can also say I would rather talk about you.Please don't lose "heart".Instead of dating sites I would definitely suggest friends of friends,brother's friends,someone at your work place if that is not banned.All the best dear.
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A
reader, anonymous, writes (28 October 2008): These are just general thoughts, not aimed at you specifically, but personally I find women who are very driven and successful in a career have tended to learn at some point that femininity is a weakness, and suppress it to achieve more in their career.
I know certainty many men are intimated by a stronger woman who has a career, can put herself first, and be in control in any situation. But these are also masculine traits, and in being in a successful relationship you need to have the right balance between a mans masculinity and a females femininity. When a man falls for a woman, and is in love with her, the females femininity becomes her biggest strength to him; this is something that many modern women seem to have got confused about over the last few decades and have again learnt that it is actually a weakness.
There is also a big misconception, I hear it on here all the time, that the only thing men think about is sex, but (well, apart from that) a mans primary need is to feel that he can provide for "his" woman. If a woman is too career orientated, or too masculine, he will never feel that he can do that, and there will eventually be a lack of sexual and physical closeness in the relationship and this in turn will cause the relationship to fail.
Strong career women, who work hard to succeed, yet still retain their femininity are a very rare kind of person. I just wonder if it is that which is the problem, as I would have thought, being in your late 30's it is probably more of an issue than that you just haven't found the right person yet?
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A
reader, anonymous, writes (28 October 2008): Amazing!! Kudos to you, girl! I love hearing about young women like yourself who work darned hard to succeed, through their own hard work and huge efforts. And I think you are meeting the wrong kind of men, dear. Lots of guys out there that would be really, really intimidated by such an educated, intelligent woman as yourself. And then there are the special guys that aren't intimidated. You just haven't met them yet. Have you ever thought of looking right in your own 'backyard'. Dating someone who has the same interests as you and is in a similar line of work. Tons of confident, great men out looking for a gal like you. So ..network yourself, talk to people you work with. Let them know you are looking to date a guy who shares the same values, and similarities as you. Let your galpals know. You never know 'who' will pop out of the woodwork! lol Best of luck and and he'll come along...and he'll think that once he has you in his life, he'll be the luckiest guy alive. Have fun!
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A
male
reader, Cowboy  +, writes (28 October 2008):
Your career isn't necessarily the problem. I for one really admire women in your position.
Is it possible that the problem is more related to lack of experience in the dating game?
I know that a lot of people spend so much time on the early stages of their careers that their social life suffers.
I know someone who runs an escort agency for businessmen who simply don't get to meet women any other way. Could your situation be similar?
The thing that made me think this is the fact that you have tried to meet people on dating websites.
Could you maybe focus on widening your social circle?
Once you have a good social circle, you'll find you meet plenty of people without even trying, and in a more 'natural' way than if you met them on a dating site, and with less pressure.
There are plenty of men (myself included) who would love to meet a woman like you. You're obviously very intelligent and well educated, with a fascinating career and a sense of ambition.
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A
female
reader, anonymous, writes (28 October 2008): Not a guy, but I think my two cents are relevant on this one. I'm a female firefighter and I know I run into that attitude from guys fairly often. Then again I think my career path is a lot more of a traditional "man's world" than medicine nowadays as there are only about 3% of us (in the US anyway) in this field, the other 97% being men. I think a lot of guys get turned off by the idea of dating a woman who acts like "one of the guys" and could physically kick their @$$, outrun them, etc, which shouldn't be a problem in your case. Then again...guys may very well be equally intimidated by a woman who can run circles around them mentally, as you probably can.
My best advice here is to keep looking...you WILL find guys who are totally fine with what you do. Whatever you do, don't let this interfere with your career goals...anyone who would let your career path (which is incredibly respectable in the first place--it's not like you are a stripper or something!) turn them off is not worth your time anyway =]
Good luck!
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