A
male
age
30-35,
anonymous
writes:hello, im very conflicted about something that most people dont really pay mind, but to me is a big deal.you see i am still a virgin at 23, and a big part of that was because when i was younger and way more innocent i made the choice of not being a sleazy bag like a lot of the guys i knew and opted for waiting until i knew another nice virgin girl so we could lose our virginities together. oh and for the record im not religious. but anyway i tried to date when i was younger too but it just didnt work, in part vecause of my inexperience and also because i found teen relationships very shallow so i decided to hold on dating until i became a little older. and now here i am in a point of my life when i think that relationships can be much deeper than stupid teenage dating. but now this has made a new kind of problem, that at my age almost no girl is a virgin anymore, i mean damn am i having a hard time finding one, one of the main reasons i held to my v-card for so long was to share it with someone else that also could share it with me. i have had to let down quite a few girls because of this, granted some of those i had problems beyond the virginity thing, but some of them were really good and interesting girls, but as soon as i knew they had some sex experience before i had to get the heck out. this is not about worrying in my sexual skills, yea i am a bit nervous about my performance when i finally do it, but not much, i mean come on how long could it take to get it down?. this little dilemma of mine has gone on for a couple of years already and im starting to lose my patience. so im considering to get a relationship already with a girl i like without considering her virginity, but first i want to throw away my v-card to some random slut. that is because, well, this is going to sound really bitter and selfish, but what i want to accomplish with this is if i cant have my girlfriends virginity then she wont have mine either. i rather waste it on a slut that i wont ever see again and wont have to face her ever after that than giving it away to a girlfriend that cant give me the same thing back.but what is troubling me about that- aside from keeping my v-card for so long for nothing- is that if my future girlfriend(or anyone for that matter) and me get to this topic and asks me about past experiences and i say to her that my only previous experience was to a slut i didnt even know that i lost my virginity just so i could be even with any girlfriend later,i dont think it would go well, hell i cant even think of a way to word it right and not sounding like a complete jerkass. so yea, thats the gyst of the problem and i dont even know what i could do if the topic is ever brought, maybe i just would have to lie about it or something. any advice?
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male
reader, J.T.1988  +, writes (25 June 2013):
 OP I don’t know if your still reading this or not, but just in case, I feel the need to tell you this. We are the same, or I should say, I was the same, I was a virgin until I was 23 I'm now 25. I had the same problem and had the same thoughts and came to the same conclusions as you have. I decided that my virginity wasn’t worth all the hurt and loneliness that I was putting myself through and for that matter neither was anyone else. Long story short during my travels in Europe I met a couple very nice girls and made up for a lot of lost time. I don’t regret a thing, If you want to talk more feel free to PM me.
A
male
reader, anonymous, writes (17 June 2013): Very very few men save their virginity into their 20s and then don't care that their wife/GF slept around a bunch before them. I know this would make a great solution to the OP's problem. But so would going back and changing his own past with a time machine. The OP needs a solution that not only solves the problem but is also realistic. OP, I suggest you don't throw away your virginity but just focus on trying to find a GF who shares your values. Find someone who does not need to be a virgin but who could have been your virgin GF if you had happened to stumble onto her a bit sooner. Someone who may have had sex but she would not do something slutty (Yes I used that word. I also use it on men sometimes.) that you don't respect. There is a wide range of women between virgin and s^^t and many of them are only slightly away from being virgins. In the long run I think you will be bothered least about this compared to any other way of dealing with the problem.
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A
female
reader, anonymous, writes (16 June 2013): As someone else said, this is a classic case of you throwing your toys out of the pram because you haven't got what you want yet. If you want to have sex with a random girl to stop any future girlfriend from getting the 'gift' of your virginity that she didn't give you - fine. But prepare to forever regret it and hate the fact you lost your virginity out of bitterness rather than love.
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A
female
reader, chigirl  +, writes (16 June 2013):
 " i meant to refer to an 'easy lay', a lot of you have the notion that i think that if you have sex, even once then you are a slut, and thats not the case, i meant to refer to girls that give sex away way too easily, i didnt mean to say it in such a mean spirited way or anything like that."
There is something here that speaks about your view on women, and in particular female sexuality. You speak in terms of old fashion, as in before the 1970's. When it was generally thought that women had no sexuality, didn't enjoy sex, and only "gave in" for the mans pleasure. Such is your notion of "women giving away sex". Women do not GIVE away sex. Women have sex, in the same sense that the man has sex. It baffles me to hear a young man think with the mindset of an old man with no education. At your age, in this time and age, you ought to know better.
This is why women care very little for a mans virginity. It means nothing to most women. Whereas a man values a womans virginity. It is completely old fashioned, and idiotic. A womans virginity means just as little (or as much) as a mans. It's just thought that while men ought to have sex to be men, women ought to NOT have sex, in order to have pride in themselves. So when a man has sex it's all "yay" for him. And when a woman has sex she becomes a "slut".
You ought to take this to heart and think about it long and hard. In what way does a woman "give away" sex, and in what way does a man "give away" sex? Would having casual sex make YOU a slut? Because, per your own definition, a slut is an easy lay and someone who "gives away" sex "too easily". Whatever "too easily" means. Would you thusly become a slut?
And then this:
"and of course that she can give me the virginity that in turn i am giving to her. unless i follow up with my idea and then i will have to take the virgin requeriment off the list."
What if you are a slut, by own definition, and have casual sex, a one night stand perhaps. Then meet a virgin... Would you be able to be in a relationship with her, or would you feel you were always below her in status, because you are a slut, and she is a virgin? Would you feel you are not equals? Would you be able to have sex with her, or would that ruin the balance of the relationship, meaning you'd always be in debt because she "gave" you something you can not give her?
", but if i waited so long for nothing then i wont give them the satisfaction os being the first either."
Yes, you are undoubtedly bitter. But you see, this bitterness will be reinforced by following this line of thought. You'd be confirming your bitterness and growing even more bitter. If you waited "this long for nothing"? You need to ask yourself what you expect from a relationship. Is a relationship with the woman of your dreams, who loves you, cares for you, makes you feel like you can fly above the sky and makes you want to shout out from the top of the mountain that you love her... Is that really "nothing"? I don't think you'd become bitter at all if you waited for the right girl to have sex with. I think you would be happy that you didn't throw sex away on some one night stand, knowing how much it means to you. I think you'd be happy to be able to have your first (and perhaps last) experience with a wonderful woman that you love.
However, I feel (and know with my intuition) that you'd be endlessly bitter should you have a one night stand, that you didn't really want in the first place, only to sort of "get back" at your future girlfriend. To "deny her" something you find special. Because then, when you DO meet the woman of your dreams, who you love and honour and adore.. you'd wish you waited for her. I feel you'd be bitter even then, even if she's a virgin or not a virgin. You'd be bitter because you didn't wait, you'd be bitter because you didn't have the first time experience with someone you loved, but instead doing something you yourself determine as "slutty" and "easy lay". You'd be bitter at the world, at women, and most of all you'd be bitter at yourself.
I have something to tell you that is quite great.. but that people who haven't loved yet don't know. Love breeds love. This means, when you're in a loving relationship, when you GIVE of yourself, you get in return. Love then GROWS. It doesn't stay stagnated at a fixed level. It grows when you nurture it. This means.. if you give, rather than take and expect in return.. but give from your heart and WANT the other person to be happy... Putting them before yourself.. If you do this, then you will become happier as a person. Because love will grow. In a loving and good relationship, love breeds love. So when you give, you always get in return. By itself. Never by expecting it, and never by demanding it. But you will get in return, you'll see. Her virginity is actually quite unimportant, as it in itself means very little. Poof, and it's gone. But unconditional love on the other hand? Not so easy to find as a virgin. And not so temporarily as virginity. How about.. her being the mother of your children? Would that not be something great to "give" to you? I'm saying "give" her, because that's the terms you think in. But in reality you don't give, you share.
If, on the other hand, you start the relationship with bitterness... Then you'll have a bitter relationship and become and even more bitter person. If you start by "denying" her something, without even knowing her, then you've already started on the wrong foot. Such a relationship has a slim chance for a happy future. Because you'd always hold that against her. You're already holding it against her. You'd blame HER for you not being able to have your first time with a wonderful woman... You'd blame her for not having been a virgin, and being there in your life before you made the mistake of sleeping around. In your heart, you'd be bitter at her. You're already bitter at her, this unknown woman, and you haven't even met her yet.
Like someone else said.. With this view that you have you wont ever know what it's like to make someone else happy, just for the sake of making them happy. Or feel how making them happy makes you happy. Making someone else happy is an end in itself. A goal. It's not a medium to reach something else, or to achieve personal goals or to feel better about yourself. Making someone else happy is an end in itself. It has value. And this particular value is overlooked by you. But to truly love someone is when you want to make them happy, no matter what happens to yourself. When people truly love each other, they can sometimes end up having to leave each other, because they want their loved one to have everything they desire.. and if that means they need to break up, then they'd rather do that, than stay and know they are the reason their loved one couldn't reach their goals. That is love. And that is way beyond silly games of tit-for-tat. That is sacrificing, so that your loved one will be happy. And without being willing to sacrifice, you will never find true and deep love. You will never find out what it's like to have some sacrifice for your sake. Because you first need to do this yourself, before you can see that others do it for you.
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A
female
reader, anonymous, writes (16 June 2013): Dude I'm sorry to be blunt but you need to get some professional help for the issues you have around this. You are basically saying you are going to have sex with a stranger in order to punish any future girl for not having the foresight to wait for you to give her virginity to. That is messed up. Your virginity should go to someone you love because you feel that the time is ready for you to give it to them, it's not a prize that only the 'worthy virgins' are entitled to. You have to stop being so bitter and stop placing so much emphasis on someone's virginity. Wait until you meet someone who you love and want to sleep with instead. I really think counselling is the only way you will achieve this though because your posts and follow ups are quite frankly worrying and inductive of much deeper issues with sex, your perception of women and your own self worth.
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A
female
reader, anonymous, writes (16 June 2013): Look OP, the problem wasn't your language It's your view of relationships as a whole.- you believe that multiple sexual partners makes a woman morally bad somehow- you believe that you have to get exactly the same as what you give in a relationship- you believe that you should get a perfect woman who ticks every one of your boxes- you believe it is ok to ration how much you give to your partner, depending on how much they deserve itThese are really unhealthy ways to approach any relationship because a) no one is perfect so you can't expect someone to be exactly what you want them to be. This mentality will stop you loving someone for their great qualities, instead you will be measuring them against your ideals.b) With your desire for an eye for an eye, you won't let yourself fall in love completely and utterly. You won't know what it feels like to want nothing for the best for someone just because making them happy makes you happy. You need to relax a bit and not be so stingy with your love because in the end both you and your partner will suffer for it. c) people complement each other in relationships. Relationships are partnerships. So It's ok for you to bring different backgrounds and experiences and strengths because you're adding to your combined knowledge and experience pool. d) there is nothing wrong with a woman enjoying sex, whether that's with one partner or whether that's with multiple partners. She is being proactive about fulfilling her needs and it is not your place to judge her for it. With your warped view of women's sexuality, you might find yourself struggling with the fact that your partner will masturbate sometimes for her own pleasure. You might struggle when you find out your future girlfriend's fantasies include dominating you and taking theead sometimes. You might find yourself suppressing her sexuality because you have this Madonna- whore complex. Try to change your mindset and accept that women enjoy sex as much as men or else your slut shaming will manifest itself in other ways in your future relationships.Good luck
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A
reader, anonymous, writes (16 June 2013): This is verified as being by the original poster of the questionOP here again. Ok look lets just forget about the ^^ut commentary, because it seems that's the only thing everyone is focusing on. If you want lets call them promiscuous or whatever. And as i said a lot of people have the mis-conception that i cant get a girl, and i can in fact, i have been close a lot of times and their experience always makes it a dealbreaker. To be fair i HAVE found virgin girls, but they are almost always taken already and the few that hadnt they had something else that was a dealbreaker. I think that the real problem is not that i cant find them, but is more like this limits my options a great deal, thats why i decided to be like ''screw this'' and just date whoever, but if i waited so long for nothing then i wont give them the satisfaction os being the first either. I know that most girls dont really care for virginity but whatever at least like this i will have no doubts that they wont get it. And in response to chigirl, yea i dont want to see the promiscuous girl that i would lose it ever again, because yea this wont be what i wanted but i also dont want to give my v-card to a girlfriend that cant do the same, and even if both options arent the best i rather just throw away my virginity. And to cindycares, your idea is not bad, i may do that if i do go through with it. And back to chigirl again i dont know if this makes me a bad person, maybe it does, maybe just a really bitter one, maybe both, i dont know.... But is how i feel.
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A
female
reader, shrodingerscat +, writes (15 June 2013):
 A person's intrinsic human worth is not lessened by how much or how little sex he or she has. Period. There is no such thing as a "slut".
Looking down on people who have sex when it's none of your business and not your place to judge? Not cool. Perhaps if you weren't so judgmental you'd find it slightly easier to find a girlfriend?
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A
female
reader, CindyCares  +, writes (15 June 2013):
 LOL, OP, do you have your heart set on winning the " Foot-in-mouth " award ? "easy lay" is not such a huge improvement on "slut"...please do me - and yourself- a favour, and follow my advice about being relatively vague in the definition of your sexual experience ( if you go ahead with the idea of having one ) when you talk about it with other women. I assure you that " casual experience " or " nothing serious " or something like that will be descriptive enough .
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A
reader, anonymous, writes (15 June 2013): This is verified as being by the original poster of the questionOP here thx for your answers everyone. wow i didnt expect such a strong reaction to the ''slut'' commentary. look i didnt think too much of it when i was writting it, maybe i should have tought it up better, but i meant to refer to an 'easy lay', a lot of you have the notion that i think that if you have sex, even once then you are a slut, and thats not the case, i meant to refer to girls that give sex away way too easily, i didnt mean to say it in such a mean spirited way or anything like that.another thing is that yea i dont go around asking EVERYONE if they are a virgin, but i do try my best to find out about girls that i like and im dating or getting to know. and anonymous writer seems to think that i cant get a girlfriend, well at least thats part of how i understood it, but i could have, a lot of times in fact, the only reason i dont have one yet is ecause of this, if i find out their sexual past then is usually over, some earlier that other depending how long does it take for them to get the hint.that brings me to another point, chigirl asked something interesting: ''I also think you need to define where your line goes. Is kissing okay, or should she be completely un-kissed and untouched? What if she's had oral sex, just not intercourse? Exactly where does the line go? You need to know what you want before you can ask for it.'' thats a good question. well pretty much i consider someone not a virgin if there has been ANY kind of penetration that involved any of the 2 parties genitals. for example kissing doesnt count for me because there are no genitals involved.oh and the other good question she made is '' And what sort of future relationship you want, and what values you want to build it on." well, i obviously want a relationship based on love and trust, i mean, doesnt everyone? and of course that she can give me the virginity that in turn i am giving to her. unless i follow up with my idea and then i will have to take the virgin requeriment off the list.
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A
male
reader, CMMP +, writes (15 June 2013):
Just because a woman has had sex doesn't mean she's a slut. You've manufactured quite the dilemma here. Think about it... Let's say that you find this virgin who waited all this time for someone like you, but after having sex the relationship doesn't work out and you break up. Does she automatically become a slut?
Your first sexual experience with someone can be just as special even without the loss of virginity, not because you're horney, but because you're falling in love.
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A
female
reader, chigirl +, writes (15 June 2013):
"but now this has made a new kind of problem, that at my age almost no girl is a virgin anymore, i mean damn am i having a hard time finding one,"
Exactly HOW do you know this? Do you ask every woman you meet? It's kind of hilarious to think about: "Hi, how are you doing? Are you a virgin?" You don't start a conversation by asking this, so how exactly is it you know that there aren't any virgins left? Do they all walk around with a sign on their foreheads, or do you have some special virgin-detector you bring with you that goes "biip biip" every time a virgin is near?
Sorry for the humour, but you see my point. You don't know, and you can't possibly know who's a virgin and who isn't, and how many there are left. However, since what you're looking for is so specific, why not opt for a dating site? There you can list up the things you want, and easily get in touch with other virgins who seek a relationship with a man who's also a virgin and wants to not have sex with someone who has experience. I am sure this is an ideal for other women too. Although, these women may be lacking in the other qualities you are looking for. But you need to define what is of most importance to you when you get to that point.
I also think you need to define where your line goes. Is kissing okay, or should she be completely un-kissed and untouched? What if she's had oral sex, just not intercourse? Exactly where does the line go? You need to know what you want before you can ask for it.
Your real problem though is this slut-notion. That's honestly disturbing. I was all on board with you until this. You're not only willing to degrade yourself, you're also willing to degrade other woman, and you do this as a sort of "revenge" on your potential new girlfriend. To "get back" at her for not having waited for you. This line of thinking is unhealthy, and I strongly recommend you seek professional help, such as therapy. It isn't healthy for you to think in this manner. You were saving your virginity because you find it special, for YOUR OWN SAKE. You didn't do it because you wanted to GIFT another woman with it... and then, the really disturbing bottom line is this: you wouldn't give anything up unless you felt you were getting anything in return. This speaks volumes of your perception of humans, and of how the world works in your head. You'd not ever do something, because the act itself had value to you? You'd only do it if you could have, in your eyes, an equal thing in return?
And then, if this can't be, you would rather screw it all than give.. because you didn't "get back" what you feel you deserved, somehow? Don't you see how this portrays your personality? As a very mean and selfish person.. and it only works to do damage on yourself. A future girlfriend who is kind and good will not care that you had sex with a prostitute, or what you call a "slut". She would love you for who you are.. but that is because she gives, without expecting in return. If she was only to love you and be good to you depending on what good she feels you deserve, then she could justify being cruel to you, based on your "throwing your virginity away" to a slut because you didn't feel she deserved it. The entire thing turns into an action of hatred and resentment. What foundation is that to build a relationship on?
The notion that you'd choose a "slut" (btw, very offensive word), because you'd not have to face her again, is more interesting. Do you feel shame attached to your virginity? Why the need to not have to face her again? Perhaps you'd feel shameful for having had sex with someone you don't care for... and perhaps that's why you'd rather not see her and be reminded of it. Because ultimately, it goes against what YOU want.
So, if having sex with a random girl you don't care for goes against what you actually want, and would result in so much shame that you wouldn't even want to see her again.. And if such an act could drive a wedge between you and a future girlfriend (trust me, this could become a problem as no woman respects a man who paid for sex), then all I see are a whole lot of reasons for why you SHOULDN'T have sex with a random girl you don't care for, paid for or not.
The last comment about maybe lying about how your lost your virginity also speaks volumes of this not being something you're comfortable with. You wouldn't even want to be honest about it. You'd rather have a relationship with lies, than give of yourself without expecting the "same" in return.
I'm not saying you should lose your ideal. But I am saying that you need to consider what this says about you as a person, your morals, and who you want to be. This is something that defines you as a person. What is of most importance is that YOU take care of yourself, and don't let yourself sink or be lowered to level where you are unhappy.. just because you felt pressured into it. You aren't okay with having sex with a random girl, and you shouldn't be okay with becoming a liar... Think about who you are, and who you want to be. And what sort of future relationship you want, and what values you want to build it on.
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A
female
reader, CindyCares +, writes (15 June 2013):
Yes you are right, don't even go there, don't try to word it because however you word it you are going to sound ignorant, naive and petty.
First, you are operating on the wrong assumptions that most girls would give any special value to a male virginity- they don't care, in fact your virginity may be a hassle. So, if the reasoning is " You did not give me your precious gift, so I won't give you my precious gift " they would go " Uh ? What gift ? This guy must be loco ".
Second, it sounds petty because ... it is ,- all this tit for tat , this rancorous " nyah nyah nyah, you bitch, you dare not to be "brand new" body that I deserve... so guess what, you don't get a brand new body either ". Petty petty petty.
Finally, I don't think they would appreciate hearing you call a slut another girl just because she was nice enough to like you and desire you. You 'd call her , and consider her ,so contemptuously a slut - yet you'd want to f... her to break your seal of warranty ? talk about spitting in the plate you eat in,- yeah it would make a wrong impression.
BUT, good news for you. The solution is simpler than you think. You don't need to lie, and you don't need to be so rudely and crudely detailed ( the slut I threw my virginity away with.. ). You can just say that you are not that experienced, you only had some casual sex which you did not pursue any further. Which, basically, would be the truth. Or at worst, a white lie. You are not obliged to explain everybody the reason WHY you choose to have sex with a particular person, being that the ultimate reason eventually always boils down to : because I wanted to.
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A
female
reader, shrodingerscat +, writes (15 June 2013):
Here are two videos by Lacy Green that you REALLY need to watch. It concerns sluts and losing your virginity.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kdYtYveJI1Y
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CCw2MzKjpoo
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A
male
reader, anonymous, writes (15 June 2013): Your feelings about virginity run against how most women usually feel. So prepare for a bashing.
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