A
female
age
41-50,
*rokenmuse
writes:There's a question here, I swear it. But, as per usual, there's a lot of back story.I'm 27 years old, not overly religious, not a femme-nazi, I don't follow fashion mags, or celebrities...I'm pierced, tattooed, experiment constantly with sex, and possibly one of the last people you'd think would have a problem with porn.However, I met a man two years ago. We had a discussion about my views on it before we agreed to be "a couple", in that I do view it as cheating. I have no problem with guys looking at porn when they're single (they're human, after all, and have needs to fulfill), but once in a relationship, I feel it gives the woman a very drastic dose of self loathing. Unless there's something very specific the partner can't give. Like a fondness for transsexuals or bestiality. Then, by all means, look away. However, in a monogamous, heterosexual relationship, I believe you should be with someone that fulfills everything else for you sexually. And if they don't, move on till you find someone that does.Upon explaining my views and reasons, he agreed whole heartedly, saying he looked it up sometimes and had a few movies, but then again, he'd been single for six months. He said he'd never understand why people would pay for it.Fine, alright, move on. A few months later, I stayed over his house, and took a shower. Opening the closet in the bathroom to grab a q-tip, I noticed the entire 4-ft top shelf full of mags, dated from a year ago to the last week. Again, I mentioned it, but let it go.I went out of town the next month, for four days, and he admitted to looking some up, but said it didn't do for him what it had before, because he had me. I'm not irrational, and simply made my opinions known, and chalked it up to an adjustment period.We moved in together, and at least once a month, he spent a good day while I was at work looking up stuff, and downloading movies. Yet he said he never masturbated over it. It started to cause major fights, because he would lie about it every time, yet give me permission to check his computer if I didn't believe him. And every time I did, there was at least 9-10 new movies, not to mention a slew of sites.I let him take some pics of me, for those times I was out of town, but the disk remained untouched in favor of looking at stuff online. Even though when he finally admitted to masturbating, he said he was only ever thinking of me.We tried talking, we fought a lot, and I gave him the choice of me or it. At the time, I was working midnights, but I got home early to find him still up, looking at porn.I went to leave, but he swore up and down that he would rather give it up than lose me. But now, a lot has changed. He's begun going over to his friends house a lot more, renting regular movies that have a lot of nudity and sex in them, even just clicking ads with mostly nude women in them. He hasn't actually looked up any more porn, though, from home. A few notes, cause I've noticed they come up a lot in answers for these. Our sex life was good (at least once a day, if not more, before he made his choice), I'm 27, but I look like I'm 22. I'm not overweight, yet I have large breasts, I'm willing to experiment with pretty much anything, I'm bisexual, and am told all the time that I'm pretty. The woman he looked up ranged in age from not much younger than me to mid forties. A lot of it was bukkake, but when I offered to go ahead with that, he said there was no way he would allow anyone else to do that to me. There was some lesbianism, so I offered a three-some, and he said the thought of sharing me with another woman would kill him. Otherwise, they were all around the same age, same hair color, and a variance in weight.Yet, I find myself unable to be completely naked now when we have sex. There has to be a shirt on, at least. I've begun preferring the lights completely off otherwise. I'm constantly comparing myself to the women he was looking up, and picking myself apart because of it. I've lost what little confidence I had in the first place, because I'm afraid he's lying, and just getting his fix somewhere else. Or that any day, he's going to go back to his old ways.My question (see? I told you there was one in here somewhere) is this: What can I do to rebuild the trust he shattered? How can I actually go about feeling I'm everything he says I am? How can I believe him when he lied about it so much? I went to a therapist, and she diagnosed me with post traumatic stress disorder, due to my avoidance of anything that reminds me of it. I want to know how to get better, not how to drug myself into thinking it's okay. How am I supposed to feel as though I'm attractive enough, when I gave him anything he could want and it still wasn't enough?
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Fancy yourself as an agony aunt? Add your answer to this question! A
reader, anonymous, writes (3 June 2008): Same old sad story. HE PROMISED TO GIVE UP PORN. He likes porn, she hates it. He makes promises that he cannot keep, she feels inadequate and betrayed, he promises never to do it again, he breaks promise, rinse, cycle, repeat.
You don't like porn, he dose. What's the problem you don't have to look at it. It makes you feel inadequate. You got body issue and issues around self esteem. You need to develop more self confidence. Women with self confidence don't compare themselves with other people, they know how unique and wonderfull they are, they don't get frightened by TV images and glossy pictures.
Women with ginger hair make me snezze, should they all cut of their hair just to please me.
A lot of men like porn, a lot of men lie about how much they use porn, because their girlfriend/wives/possessive other dosen't like it. You can't stop him looking, you can't watch him 24hours a day, even now he starting to prefer to be in the company of others rather than a woman who wants to demand his eyes, his mind, his soul for her own desires.
A
female
reader, Laura1318  +, writes (30 May 2008):
 I fully agree with male anon.
There are some people who are rigid in their thoughts and cannot accept other perspective.
They only have a single track mind .
It is like the world must follow them and not the other way round.
What can we do?
We can only leave them to their thoughts.
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A
female
reader, Laura1318 +, writes (29 May 2008):
Is there such a person who has never lied yesterday ,today and in the future?
Do you believe such a person exist in this world?
A lie big or a small is still a lie.
If you tell one lie too many and get caught ,
you cannot be trusted.
You are judged and condemned.
I guess those who don't tell lies in their life are angels
in disguise while all of us are devils because we lie about little things .
There is only one person who have never lied and he is now in Heaven.
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A
male
reader, oldfool  +, writes (29 May 2008):
 Your dilemma intrigued me to the extent that I decided to look around the Internet a bit. It seems that porn nowadays is a totally different kettle of fish from what it was in my day. All we had to look at was dirty magazines, and apart from availability there was the issue of cost. It was expensive buy lots of new porn, so you tended to look at the same stuff over and over again, or look at soft porn in the laundromat (this was in Japan). Most of the stuff I used to look at was pictures of naked women. There were also movies on occasion, but even that had to be bought or borrowed.
Nowadays, with the Internet, it seems that porn is ubiquitous. Anyone with access to a computer can download the stuff. And not only is it ubiquitous, it's become more and more extreme. Just about anything is available by doing a simple search. Perhaps the kind of porn addiction common among young people today is much more destructive than it was in my day.
I tend to sympathise with Brokenmuse here. What she's experiencing, and what many women appear to be experiencing, is a lot more extreme than us old-fashioned consumers of porn are used to. That leads me to think that perhaps I should be treating this porn addiction more seriously. When the need to see naked women engaging in all kinds of sex acts becomes so desperate that it overwhelms all inhibitions, restraints and sense of balance, and forces the consumer to become ashamed and falsely deny that he's been watching it, it may be time to regard this as truly a pathological addiction.
So rather than seeing this as a matter of "trust" as Brokenmuse treats it, it might be better to treat this as pathological destructive behaviour. The guy can't help himself. The problem is not that he's innately dishonest; it's the fact that this addiction is so overwhelming that it's pushing him to lie to Brokenmuse. I would be curious to know exactly how many people have become enslaved by this kind of addiction to pornographic material.
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A
male
reader, oldfool +, writes (29 May 2008):
"You are the one who has pushed him into this corner". That was inaccurate.
Both of you are responsible, although the responsibility on his side is greater. Your attitude to pornography has pushed him into this corner. But he should not have made promises he couldn't keep when he started the relationship. He is the one who started the relationship under false pretences.
As I said, it's an irresistible force (your views on porn) meeting an immovable object (his compulsion to watch it). I honestly don't think there is any way out of this. There are guys out there who are not addicted to porn. I think you should find one of them. You sound so hot, it's a pity that he can't appreciate you and you only. But I don't think it would matter if you were Marilyn Monroe (or a modern version of her), he would still look at porn.
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A
female
reader, anonymous, writes (29 May 2008): I have pretty much the same problem with my boyfriend. I was VERY upset, discussed it with him, and decided we should talk about our personal boundaries. What is cheating? What isnt cheating? He said sex, etc was cheating but porn wasnt. Anyhow, the point is - he promised, adding that he wouldnt want to do it because it would hurt me - then he broke it BIG time. He actually was watching it on his computer while we were watching a war movie on TV. He lied. I mean, LIED until his head exploded as soon as I saw it. He still denies it some days, others he denies the last movies I found on his computer. I still have issues with feeling at ease that he isnt lying to me about other things.
I gave him photos and movies of myself having sex with him for our two year anniversary and told him "If you ever get the desire to watch porn - just watch us..". I thought it would work - he looked at one picture of me EVER on the computer before watching a movie of blond cheerleaders doing many nasty things - to partners and eachother. Esentially, it didnt work.
Ultimately, his laptop crashed that night for whatever reason - and he no longer has his own laptop (nor will I allow him on mine). The fact that he would look at pornography the MOMENT I left the house was upsetting. Im still struggling with the comment "No offense, but no man would want to see someone like you on porn. There are certain body types, and you dont have it." So - at first I didnt even want to take a shirt off during sex. Ive become a bit obsessive on my weight - and cant turn on lights during sex - but its getting easier. (Did I mention that I'd put on weight since we first met, but Im still rather thin/plentiful in the bust/etc?)
I have to say that time does allow you to mend wounds - but it also doesnt make things go away. If he's given it up, he's done it for you. Its just going to be difficult to wrap your head around why he would do it (some say its just the act itself - but if thats so whats wrong with watching just your partner in your movies?). Essentially, I think doing things together, being open and honest..etc with help.
On a side note, I completely understand where you're coming from on your potin of view on porn. Just for alittle support since I know you're not saying porn is evil - just that you dont particularly think its normal in a relationship.
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A
male
reader, oldfool +, writes (29 May 2008):
I can't speak for other people, but my point was quite simple.
I don't think he's going to stop looking at porn. I think he has a compulsion, and he can't stop it. It will come back again sometime, and he's going to lie about it. Simple as that.
As for whether he will lie about other things, it's hard to say. I think his lying is going to be focussed on this one big issue. On other things I think you can probably trust him.
The thing is, you've pushed him into a corner. An irresistible force meeting an immovable object. Either you turn a blind eye, or he lies. If he now starts lying about other things, then it could quite possibly be because it's become a habit to lie to you about this particular issue. You are the one who has pushed him into this corner.
I would forget about rebuilding trust. I would break up with him and find someone who doesn't love what you hate. Simple as that.
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A
male
reader, anonymous, writes (29 May 2008): Unfortunately I don't think most women will ever really understand porn the way men are about it. It's biological. Men are more visual and we're also more programmed to prefer variety in our mates.
Some things about the gender are just brain chemistry and no amount of reasoning will make the other person really see & understand their view.
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A
female
reader, Laura1318 +, writes (29 May 2008):
The first step to rebuild the trust is to forgive him for all his transgressions.
Wipe the slate clean and start all over again.
Have you done that?
If you cannot forgive him totally and move on,
then it is pointless to talk about trust.
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A
female
reader, Laura1318 +, writes (29 May 2008):
If you want to rebuild the trust,
then you need to throw away all your bias and prejudices
and all your opinionated ideas and start all over again.
Either that or dump him.
Come down from your high horse and feel what it is like
walking with your feet on the same level as him.
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A
female
reader, anonymous, writes (29 May 2008): Methinks a problem here has been missed. I don't want to know how to cope with porn in general. My question was how to go about rebuilding the trust that was severed.I'm sick and effing tired of people jumping all over the "guys look at porn, there's nothing you can do" angle.That's not the point.People have their own views on things. I, for one, view porn as the same thing as cheating. Having sexual thoughts, and beating off, over another person while you have someone you say you love and find sexually attractive sounds like cheating to me. It would be like me going out and having completely meaningless sex (read: no emotional connection) with some other guy and saying it's okay because I'm a physical creature. I didn't want them to be with, I just wanted a quick lay with something different.How is it so very different? Viewing porn involves the visual stimulation of the women themselves, the physical stimulation of masturbating over it, and the mental stimulation arousal causes. If it's a movie, there's the audio aspect as well. So, what, does the inability to smell the sex in the air exclude it from being cheating?I digress. There are lots of people in the world, and I am one who views porn as cheating.But he gave it up. Of his own free will. He could have said "This isn't worth the hassle" and had me leave. But no. My question is how to rebuild the trust he slaughtered. A lot is about the porn, but when it boils down to it, it's about his lying about it.If someone is going to lie about something so petty, what else will he lie about? My question was how to rebuild that trust. How to overcome it, so I'm not the one tearing our relationship apart.
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female
reader, Laura1318 +, writes (27 May 2008):
In the society where I live, we just leave them alone unless
they are addicted to it or neglect their responsibilities or duties to their wife.
We treat it just a male thing.
We do not report them to the police and have them thrown
into jail for watching porn like in some society, even if
they are their fathers, husbands ,brothers or son's.
It will be unthinkable to commit such an act here.
We also don't simply brand them as paedophiles or sex perverts just because they watch porn.
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A
female
reader, Laura1318 +, writes (27 May 2008):
Man are visual creatures.
They are affected by sight than by feelings.
Sometimes when they have sexual urges and when they want to masturbate, they need visual stimulations.
If there is porn , they will watch it and if there is no porn , they will recall those sexy images in their memory .
Porn is just a visual stimulation to get them turned on and it has got nothing to do with you.
Women don't feel the same way by looking at naked pictures of men.
If you know it is just for his stimulations and he is not
comparing those porn stars with you, then you ought to
accept his viewing and be more open with him.
If he knows that it is acceptable to you ,
he would not lie to you.
Some men can give up porn while some cannot.
No man is perfect.
If you love him , you should accept him all and not just
pick only some parts because he comes in a package.
Just as a man has to accept you, warts and all.
In time , through your love, he may hived off those activities or he may not.
But forcing your will on him will only make him lie or leave you or damage your relationship.
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A
female
reader, anonymous, writes (26 May 2008): I am so relieved, yet hurt after reading your question. I am 19 years old and I would honestly say, i'm an attractive young woman.
However, here is the problem. I met my now boyfriend around a year ago. He is lovely guy who I have found more and more out about his past.
He is 24 and before he met me was a virgin. He had major issues with this and is always extremely sensitive about the forbidden "V" word.
I am a very sexually active person, who loves to please and in return be pleased back. My boyfriend loves to experiment now and is not at all shy anymore.
I found out that while he was a virgin, he constantly looked at porn and I found a lot of porn movies while at his house. He did tell me about this and I told him there was nothing wrong with using it while he was single, but I certainly would never expect it to happen whilst in a relationship with me, as I also view it as the step down from cheating. He was happy with this and said he didnt need porn now that he had me.
However, after me being upset about it and him promising never to look at porn again whilst with me, I found more porn films. This caused more arguments and I started to lose trust in him.He promised to throw them all out and I believed him. After a second time of me being upset and him saying he cant believe how stupid he was as to hurt me yet again, I caught him red handed (so to speak). I still didnt trust him. I noticed a video in his video player and asked to see what it was. He started to become extremely agitated and I knew straight away he had deceived me again.
I felt heartbroken after how much it had upset the other times. I felt like I wasnt enough for him, and started to lose my confidence.
I love this man, but I dont know if I can trust him again. Every time I am in his house, I feel myself dying to snoop through his stuff.
I dont want to feel this way but I cant help this niggling feeling inside me.
I want to be able to trust again, however, I dont know if I should.
I would appreciate some help as I dont want to lose this guy but talking to him doesnt help. He knows my position on this, yet still abuses my trust.
How can I trust again?
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A
female
reader, Laura1318 +, writes (25 May 2008):
Here are some more insights about men.
If she gives her number too fast she’s probably a slut.
If she doesn’t give her phone number she’s a stuck up bitch,
If she doesn’t want to have sex she’s faking.
If she doesn’t want to go out after the first date she’s a gold digger.
If she enjoys hanging around the house on most nights she’s a goodie-two-shoes.
If she’s busy she’s a liar.
If she tries to speak, she’s talking too much.
When she tries to express her feelings, she’s blowing it out of proportion.
If she doesn’t want to talk about it she’s holding out.
When she says she needs some space, she’s seeing another man.
This is a very good article for women to understand men and why they are like that.
From;-
http://www.associatedcontent.com/article/48311/why_women_hate_men.html?cat=41
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A
female
reader, Laura1318 +, writes (25 May 2008):
Whatever you do will never be enough for him.
He is just a man and it is better you become who you are
rather than whom you want to be.
Men Are Hard To Please
The problems with GUYS:
If u TREAT him nicely, he says u are IN LOVE with him;
If u Don’t, he says u are PROUD.
If u DRESS Nicely, he says u are trying to LURE him;
If u Don’t, he says u are from the Hillbillies
If u ARGUE with him, he says u are STUBBORN;
If u keep QUIET, he says u have no BRAINS.
If u are SMARTER than him, he’ll lose FACE;
If he’s Smarter than u, he is GREAT.
If u don’t Love him, he tries to POSSESS u;
If u Love him, he will try to LEAVE u.
If u don’t make love with him., he says u don’t Love him;
If u do!! he says u are CHEAP.
If u tell him your PROBLEM, he says u are TROUBLESOME;
If u don’t, he says that u don’t TRUST him.
If u SCOLD him, u are like a NANNY to him;
If he SCOLDS u, it is because he CARES for u.
If u BREAK your PROMISE, u Cannot be TRUSTED;
If he BREAKS his, he is FORCED to do so.
If u SMOKE, u are BAD girl;
If he SMOKES, he is a GENTLEMEN.
If u do WELL in your exams, he says it’s LUCK;
If he does WELL, it’s BRAINS.
If u HURT him, u are CRUEL;
If he HURTS u, u are too SENSITIVE!!
& sooo hard to please!!!!!
If u send this to guys, they will swear that it’s not true…….
but if u don’t, they say u are selfish…..
Anonymous..
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A
female
reader, Laura1318 +, writes (25 May 2008):
"To be happy with a man you must understand him a lot and love him a little.
To be happy with a woman you must love her a lot and try not to understand her at all."
A wise saying.
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A
male
reader, oldfool +, writes (24 May 2008):
Oh yes, by the way, you've got to stop comparing yourself to porn actresses. You're just going to have to take my word for it that they are two separate worlds. Treat the porn as "fantasy" as Waz says.
If you're having it once a day that's pretty damn good. It doesn't seem to be taking away from your sex life. So ease up a bit; take off the T-shirt and let him see what he's getting. (From what you describe it's pretty good!)
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A
male
reader, oldfool +, writes (24 May 2008):
I've never been addicted to porn, especially if I've got the real thing right there waiting for me!
But some men are, and it seems to be a major issue between the sexes. I can't see it being resolved.
The issue is very simple:
* You are not able to accept your man watching porn.
* Your man is unable to stop himself from watching porn, and is willing to lie to cover up for it.
Whatever the agreement in place when you started this relationship, he's obviously unable to keep his end of the bargain and you're unable to change your views. End of story. End of relationship.
It's a pity that an irresistible force has run into an immovable object in this case. The problem is his false commitment at the beginning. I guess you're going to have to write it off to bad luck. Hopefully the next guy is either (1) not a porn addict or (2) is telling the truth when he says he can give it up.
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A
female
reader, Laura1318 +, writes (24 May 2008):
If you want to rebuild the trust,
you will need to be more open and accept him as he is.
You need to see from his perspective and not your female perspective.
Men see things differently.
They know what is real and what is fantasy.
It is their nature , for they are wired that way.
If you are going to have a relationship with them ,
you will need to learn and understand them more.
You will not have a successful relationship with men if you only use your feminine logic.
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A
male
reader, anonymous, writes (23 May 2008): I think the real problem here is that you feel less attractive around him. You feel like you can't measure up to those whores in the computer that he is watching. Lol is that what is causing u to be angry? Let me tell you he probably thinks you are gorgous but he might just be addicted to porn and can't help himself. There is also the possibility that he has some moral issues of doing those nasty things that he watches to you, maybe he feels like he would have "depurified" you or something, im not sure but this is actually fairly common. At least be happy he is not cheating on you. I mean porn is NOT cheating, and it doesn't make sense for you to hate it because it is preventing your b/f from cheating believe it or not. Many men just get a women on the side to do nasty and perverted things with, and then come back to their beautiful "clean" wife at home. Its weird I know, but you might want to see if you can really talk about his true feelings on this issue.
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female
reader, anonymous, writes (21 May 2008): I think it is incredibly unfair to suggest she is mentally bullying him - regardless of what anyone else thinks of porn they established boundaries before the relationship got to a serious level. He crossed those boundaries.If he wanted to continue watching porn, if he didn't agree with her morals he should have said his piece then, maybe they could have negotiated, or maybe they would have parted ways. Either way at least it would be honest and fair to both parties.I know this is much easier said than done, but you shouldn't allow your self worth to rest solely in him. It is HIS inadequacies that drive his behaviour, not yours.
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male
reader, Replacement  +, writes (17 May 2008):
 Ok. I have a different view from the others. See... I have been in a lot of relationships... and for most of them I looked at porn all the time on the side. It's just a natural curiosity, and there is some pleasure to be had at looking at naked women, of course. But. I have also had three long term relationships (a couple years each). And for both of those women, once I had assessed our bond, I stopped looking at porn. In all of my less serious relationships (women I wasn't in love with), porn was a major issue for the women, they told me it made them hate their bodies and wonder why they weren't good enough. I figured, hey, I have no intentions of marrying these chicks, and we've only been together a few months, why should I change my habits? For the serious relationships, after... say, 8 or 9 months with them, I could tell that it was more serious, that I had serious feelings for them and I could really see a future (none of these relationships worked out, obviously, but at the time I thought they could be "the one"). Once I realized that, I decided that there was no point looking at porn just to satisfy my needs. If you truly love the woman you're with, you won't do something that makes her hate her body and question your commitment to her. Even if you feel like you have a "right" to look at porn (sure, you do), you are willing to sacrifice the pleasure you get from it in order to make your woman as happy as possible. So I gave it up (easily, i was never addicted or anything), and committed myself fully to those relationships and (since I never bought DVDs or anything, just downloads) I would clear my harddrive of all of my porn without a second thought. If a man cannot do that for you then eitherA. He has an addiction to pornorB. He is not willing to make simple sacrifices to make you happy... maybe this means he's not as serious about the relationship as you are.As for the private, personal fantasies that the others have mentioned- that' what an imagination is for! Jesus, that's where most fantasies take place, in your mind. You shouldn't have to look at it right in front of you in order to create a fantasy. That's just a sad lack of imagination... As for your lack of confidence, let me assure you that when a man is looking at people having sex, or whatever, he's not thinking about their bodies and how amazing their bodies are, he's just focussing on the act, their facial expressions, etc. It's the sex we're interested in, not the bodies. I've seen porn with chubby women with small breasts and I've still been aroused because of the acts they were doing. It's not all about their bodies. Don't worry about looking like a porn star- they are NOT the be all and end all of female beauty or sexuality. As for rebuilding your trust... I dunno, sounds like this guy has an addiction to porn to me, he is so unwilling to bend his ways to keep you sane. He's given you PTSD... does he really deserve forgiveness? Does he really deserve a second chance? Does he deserve you? I don't know if he does. .. guys like him might just be too selfish to adjust their ways.
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A
female
reader, anonymous, writes (17 May 2008): Hi. I agree with Waz, but tempered. I think you are making it too important (but I know, I'm not there). Personal fantasy should be sacred, and allowed to exist as long as no one is getting hurt by it (which is open to much debate, I understand). Your sex life and the lengths you go to/would go to to be whatever he needs is staggering, and even gets me hot, and I'm not even bi. You sound attractive, and he sounds interested. Is there really a problem here? Let me ask you, don't you have a fantasy life in any way? The lieing is not good, but I guess I'd want to keep it from you too, based on your reaction. Only you can decide, if he's too into this, and not enough into you. Something to make him hot is not all bad, if it helps your relationship it can be ok.
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A
female
reader, Brokenmuse +, writes (17 May 2008):
Brokenmuse is verified as being by the original poster of the questionUm, hey there Wizard. Are you daft? I'm not going to lie, I'm appalled by your answer. I'm not trying to control him, or what he thinks about. I'm trying to get him to hold to his own word. The one he and I discussed before we hooked up. He knew about it, as a problem, and glossed over it. It was his choice to give it up. I just want to know how to mend the damage on my end. If he really needs to look at it, fine. But he can do it with someone else besides me. I don't really care if you think it's his own little fantasy world. It may well be. But it doesn't excuse lying to someone you say you love.Pretty sure it's this weird thing called mutual respect. I don't screw around with other guys, even though they would just be an object to me, with no emotional attachment. Why? Because I know it would bother him. All I expect is the same. Why, tell me, is that wrong?
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