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age
36-40,
anonymous
writes: My boyfriend and I will have been together three years as of this coming February. We have talked about getting married and have even gone to look at rings on multiple occasions. To my knowledge, he has not gone back by himself to look again or make a purchase. I am confident when I say he hasn't, actually.We are both nearly 25; I have a master's degree, and he finishes his in May. We are both employed, live together, the whole shebang.But I'm starting to get the feeling that he just isn't going to propose ever. He gets uncomfortable when I bring up marriage or a wedding (squirms in his seat, covers his face with his hands, immediately tries to change the topic, voice gets shaky) and says "I haven't even asked you yet!" -- even if I'm speaking in generalities (i.e. "When we get married, it would probably save us a lot of money to skip out on a catered dinner and get married later in the evening.")Considering that we started ring shopping a year ago, and I still don't have a ring, his discomfort with it all -- I'm just doubting he will ever actually propose.I love him very much and can't imagine life with anyone else -- in fact, the thought makes me sick. I've also heard that the peak time to get engaged is at the two year mark -- each month after that, likelihood of engagement decreases. A licensed social worker/counselor mentioned this statistic.How long is too long to wait for him to propose? Am I being totally silly in thinking there's a time limit?
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reader, anonymous, writes (4 November 2011): This is verified as being by the original poster of the questionHe is a research assistant, which means his tuition is 100% paid for, and he gets a monthly stipend which more than covers his monthly expenses (he doesn't have a car, nor does he want one, so he only pays rent, food and cell phone).
I don't expect him to spend much on a ring. In fact, I told him I much preferred the look of a white sapphire to a diamond, and that I'd want no more than a half carat stone. I think that's very, very reasonable.
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female
reader, PerhapsNot  +, writes (3 November 2011):
 You mention that he is employed, but what does that really mean since he is in grad school? Is it a crappy part-time or full-time job, or does he actually earn a good income? The reason I am asking falls down to this: can he actually afford to buy you a ring? How much do you want him to spend on the bling and can he realistically do so being in grad school? If he is financially strapped, it's outside his control and you need to accept that. Yes, it sucks when outside circumstances prevent us from living the way we want to, but sometimes you have to wait. If he has a good job while going to school and is financially stable, THEN there is a problem.
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reader, anonymous, writes (3 November 2011): This is verified as being by the original poster of the questionThanks, doublejack.
And I'd really like to read some other opinions with this new information, so if anyone could offer more advice, that would be great.
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reader, doublejack +, writes (1 November 2011):
OP, that new bit of information changes my opinion. Your boyfriend now sounds like a couple of guys I know, and they're the type who will string a woman along and really never intend to commit to her.
One guy, the 40 year old coworker I previously mentioned, told his girlfriend that he wouldn't think of proposing before three years of dating. Well, three years came and went... and he was no closer to asking the question. I and others are work would tease him about ring shopping, and he'd blow us off with jokes about buying a cubic zirconium ring. Long story short, his girlfriend came to realize that he was never going to pop the question, so she broke it off with him. You'd think that after 3+ years he would be upset, right? Nope. He doesn't miss her, and he's looking for the next woman to steal some time from.
This guy is a pretty extreme case, but the fact that your boyfriend is throwing time frames out there which then go by the wayside is definitely a red flag. I think it is time for you to have a talk with him - let him know that you are seriously thinking of breaking up with him if he won't commit. If he's like my coworker, which I'm afraid might be the case, then be prepared to move on.
Best of luck!
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reader, anonymous, writes (31 October 2011): This is verified as being by the original poster of the questionThank you for your advice.
Something I didn't mention is that much earlier this year, he said he'd propose by June. Now that June came and went without a proposal, he's changed his story to December. I don't know what's prompted this, but this change has made me believe he isn't going to propose ever, like he can't keep his word.
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reader, anonymous, writes (29 October 2011): From my perspective, it sounds like you're putting more emphasis on being married than on having a happy and healthy relationship. I know this doesn't seem fair, because of course that's not how you feel, but it's the direction that you're taking.Perhaps you're worried that you'll spend your life with him, unmarried. Would that be such a bad thing? I'm guessing that somewhere along the way you've learned that marriage equals stability, and without that you're just waiting and hoping.It used to be that way. Women weren't given equal pay, and marriage was the ultimate promotion. A man who wouldn't propose was just looking for a good time, nothing serious.The idea was that a woman had to stand her ground, while she was still in "the best years of her life". If you're familiar, think Adelaide's Lament, from Guys and Dolls.Times have changed, yet still the idea that women need to push for marriage has persisted. By no means am I trying to say that you shouldn't marry the man that you love. But you need to put the emphasis on the love and not the marriage.From what you've described, you're well-educated, and you two have a stable life together. You are happy and in love, and have a very promising future as a couple. Yet you may well be jeopardizing that, by focusing on marriage as the most important thing.The man that you describe intends to spend his life with you. He hasn't proposed /yet/. As some others have responded though, you may be sending him the mistaken message that you're interested in marriage more than being with him.Don't let striving for something more ruin what you already have.My advice is this: examine what it is about marriage that makes out do important to you. Is marriage the only way to have that? Are you looking for more security, or a sense that he's serious about spending his life with you?Talk to him, but not about marriage,rather about what you /both/ want in your lives. Let him know that you love him, and talk about the things you'd like to do together.Don't say, "we should spend our honeymoon in _", but instead say, "would you like to go to _ one day?"Don't plan your life around marriage. Life continues after marriage, and a happy life should be your goal.And most importantly, make sure be understand that it's him you love, and him you want to be with. Don't make him feel like you just want a wedding.Build a life, don't force the pace. Be understanding if he's a little nervous right now. Get back to where he's more comfortable talking about the future, and then talk about what you two will do with your lives together, making sure that he's an equal part of it.As for a timeline, there are many couples who marry after being together a long time. In my acquaintance I can think of one couple that married after twelve years, and another after twenty.Be happy together, and the rest of life just falls into place.
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reader, Honeypie +, writes (26 October 2011):
 I can not improve on CaringGuy's post. I think he nailed it.
What is the hurry?
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reader, doublejack +, writes (26 October 2011):
As someone who rushed into a marriage, which ended in a painful divorce, I tend to side with caution. While you may feel ready for a proposal, I advise you do not pressure your boyfriend. When he's ready, he'll buy the ring and ask the question.
I also don't buy into that two year statistic. Age is a big variable. When a couple is in their early 30's or older, then perhaps two years is a sufficient amount of time to date and feel comfortable getting hitched. You and your boyfriend are still very young, though. I got married at 23, and now at 35 I view things very differently. I date women that are very different from my ex-wife, not because I think I need to change it up but rather because I value things differently than I did back then.
Finally, I also do not buy that there is an expiration date in this type of situation. My sister dated her now husband for about 8 years before he proposed. She even moved half way across the country to be with him, as just his live-in girlfriend. She had no formal commitment at that time. She waited patiently while her boyfriend came around, and I do not know of a happier couple. For reference, He is 32 and she is 30, and they started dating a decade ago.
That said, at some point if your boyfriend doesn't commit you'll have to make a decision - continue waiting, or move on / give him the ultimatum. There are guys out there who are just so commitment-phobic that they will just never get married. I have a 40 year old coworker like that, and my 33 year old brother is the same. But that's something only you can determine, as nobody knows your boyfriend like you do.
Best of luck!
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reader, CaringGuy  +, writes (26 October 2011):
Aarrrrrggghhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh!
That's probably how he's feeling about this. There are a few of reasons for this:
1 - He's still doing his Masters degree, which realistically is going to take all his time for this year. To top that off, he'll then have to go out into the real world and establish himself in a job that reflects his masters degree. Yes, he is employed, but he's at the start of his career. That will take even more time.
2 - The statistic that you got from that counsellor is more or less true. I'd say that at three years, it's more likely. However, I notice you don't mention another statistic that's come out - if you get married in your 20's, you're now more likely to divorce than at nearly any other age. The reason for that is young people are getting married without thinking of any of the implications. And the more interesting thing is that it appears women are the ones who regret getting married at a young age more than men, hence why more women ask for divorces. So in fact, your boyfriend is in a way doing you a favour, because it's slowing things down so you can be sure you want to be with him.
3 - To be honest, just from what you're written here, I'm not surprised that he's scared about the whole marriage thing. His reaction is screaming that you're on his back far too much. You've been looking at rings, talking about it often etc. But then you say that you've been speaking in general about it, and what you say is "When we get married, it would probably save us money to skip out on catering and get married in the evening." - That's not you discussing marriage, that's you TELLING him that you EXPECT marriage and you WILL HAVE IT YOUR WAY. I put it in capitals because this is exactly how he is feeling. You're not discussing this as a couple - it's you telling and him squirming.
I think that he's terrified because you appear like you care more about the ring on the finger than him. You've totally taken this to a whole new level. You're quoting statistics on marriage, you're talking about rings, you're telling us that you love him and feel sick that he might more be there - but you've spoken to a licensed counsellor about the fact he hasn't proposed, and you're talking about time limits, and you're telling him how his wedding will be.
You just look like you care about the ring on your finger and nothing else (I do know you don't, but that's how it really does look). And that's how he sees it. Add that to the fact that he needs to establish himself in a job that reflects his degree, add that to the fact that people in their twenties are still evolving and may change, and add that to the fact that you're in the age range that is virtually most likely to divorce (except those in their 40's, I think - though those got married in their 20's too!), and you're really writing a recipe for disaster.
You need to back off and allow this man more time. Say to him that you know he's under pressure with work, and you understand that he might be worried about marriage so you're going to back off for a while. And mean in. Let him sort out this year at university, let him try to get a job together. That'll take another year. Then it might be another year before he's sort of established. That's 2 years living with the man you're saying you love, and that'll take you to nearly 26. Then I think it would be fair to bring it up again, and if you don't like the response you'll be able to walk away.
But stop with the marriage thing for the moment, please.
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reader, Odds +, writes (26 October 2011):
 Given that he's about to get his degree, this is a particularly stressful time for him. It's alright to be concerned about whether he will propose or not (though long term, I think you will both be much happier without the ring or the piece of paper), but maybe wait until things have calmed down and settled in for a bit. Most responsible men (that is, good future husbands) want to be established and settled a bit before they propose, so they can provide to the best of their abilities.
As for why he gets nervous when you bring it up, it's because he thinks there is a "correct" answer to any of your questions and concerns, but he doesn't know what it is, or even if it exists. From his point of view, the entire conversation is a trap designed to create a fight, so he avoids the subject. Guys will do this even when they *want* to marry you. The subject is a minefield with chicks.
Taking you ring shopping was probably meant to placate you, but I'm willing to bet he still intends to marry you; he just wanted to take some pressure off for a while first. Again, men who will make good future husbands feel a strong need for personal stability before they propose, and he probably feels that doing it before he's established himself in the real world would hurt the marriage.
Don't talk to social workers about your relationship. They only deal with failed ones; successful relationships rarely have the need for government intervention. She will have a strongly biased belief in things going wrong.
Wait until you've both settled into your new life after he gets his degree. Give it a few months once you've been established, and he will probably propose by then.
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reader, PerhapsNot +, writes (26 October 2011):
You should be having this discussion with your boyfriend.
Have you ever asked him why he gets uncomfortable when you bring up marriage? There is no point in speculating when you can simply ask him directly. If you want to know how long you should wait, ask him " Hey, ideally, at what age do you see yourself getting married?" When he gives you an answer, you will have all your mysteries solved.
When he took you ring shopping, did he talk about marriage with you, or did he simply go along because you wanted to look at rings? Was he the one who suggested the ring trips, or was it you? If you went ring shopping a year ago, it means you were still in graduate school. Does he have the money to buy you a ring now, as he only recently graduated?
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reader, anonymous, writes (26 October 2011): This is verified as being by the original poster of the questionI understand there's no actual "time limit," but since we've been talking about it and taking action (like the ring shopping), I feel like those things were only just to placate me because he knew I did want to get married. At what point do I give up and say, "OK, it's been ____ long, I give up"?
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