A
male
age
36-40,
*ey
writes:I'm positive my ex-girlfriend has a Narcissistic Personality disorder. I once told her of my suspicions that she may have a mild bi-polar disorder called hypomania on the phone after we broke up and she flipped out. So, then I sent her a letter with relevant info on the disorder after she got it she called me and cussed me out. I only brought it up because she has all of the symptoms, but refused to see it. She basically told me I was psycho, and that she didn't give a damn what I thought and that she didn't want to talk to me again. Fast Forward to now and she still calls me being friendly almost everyday, even says she "Loves" me sometimes. TWO NIGHTS AGO...She told me that she feels we're going to get married down the line, but "Between now and then" she's going to enjoy being 23 and have fun within boundaries or something. (by the tone in her voice, I took that to imply she's going to fuck whoever she wants and that she doesn't have to answer to me about it) Then she went on to say that there's tons of stuff that she's done that I don't know about and that she didn't care if I was out there banging a whole bunch of chicks or whatever. She also said that it makes her mad when I ask her questions about her personal life. For example when she told me she slept with some random dude recently (May), which now I totally believe she did even after she told me she "Made it up" in a moment of frustration/annoyance only to placate me. However, I ask you why bring it up if you don't want me to ask you question about it? She says she didn't bring it up it and that stuff just "Slips out". Whatever. She then went on to say that I cross boundaries by asking her details about it. I asked her simple follow up questions like "Who was this dude? Where did you meet him?" stuff like that and she totally gets defensive and says she doesn't want to talk about it.I'm feeling that she banged some dude on the 16th of May because she erased ALL the headlines from May on her facebook that said "She regrets what happened last night!" then later on she writes "I'm going to enjoy my life to the fullest!" I guess that means I'm going to fuck random people now even though that completely goes against everything I told my ex-boyfriend that I would EVER do. She even refused to have sex with me once after we broke...why? "Because I don't have sex with random people" Sounds like BS right now.Where the oxymoron stuff comes in, in my mind is this..."IF you supposedly want to marry me down the line what sense does it make for neither of us, ESPECIALLY her to not care what the other person is doing? For example fucking random people?"Call me crazy but that seems like the sort of thing you should absolutely CARE about! What makes her think I'd want to marry someone with that sort of mentality or behavior? Secondly, After yelling and being extremely non-empathetic to my feelings she asks me if I would like to elope with her! Seriously! I kept talking to her to try and see how far she would go with this and she's "Down" But only if I paid. That's that manipulative narcissistic thing coming out again. She totally thinks we're eloping. It's crazy. Since Recently, I've come to realize that she may have a Narcissistic personality disorder caused by her mother and family as a result of her upbringing and not Hypomania which has much in common with NPD. It's extraordinarily saddening for me because I see her Personality problems so clearly, but her oblivious and unsympathetic mother and drug abusing friends provide a buffer between my hurtful truth and her fantasy land and she'd rather accept that she's perfect (As many with NPD do) than believe that anything is wrong with her. It's horrible because the more I talk to her the more clearly I see how far gone she is. It's like I am a lone soldier fighting the entire Army by myself. It hurts because deep down I know that she is never going to get the help she needs to manage this disorder because her family status (sister of Famous actor/comedian brothers) and her over indulgent and unempathetic mother only serve to worsen the problem. I wish there was more I could do, but I've exhausted my options...she's already convinced her self centered mother that I'm a psycho loser who is just upset that we broke up and her substance abusing friends are content to just mindlessly agree with her. I try to forget her situation, but whenever we talk it just brings up all these feelings of powerlessness. I have NO means of helping her at all. She's already rejected my letter with vital information and turned her "Inner circle" against me. One lone man can't make an intervention and I'm positive her self centered mother, drunk on the glamor and praise of being a well known celebrity mother will NEVER help me help her daughter because in her eyes "Everything is Fine" Does anyone have any advice for me? I need help. Maybe if we eloped and she was my wife I'd have the power to forcefully make her undergo treatment? Anyway, please, leave your responses. Their greatly appreciated.
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male
reader, crnogora  +, writes (7 September 2008):
Ah yeah, it is probably best to just completely end the relationship. Also, I don't think the women is the only one that needs help here. You should really look at yourself.
A
female
reader, Raechel +, writes (27 June 2008):
 Wow..
I seriously had to read that a couple of times because I thought it was my ex, Brandon, referring to me..
I'll give you advice from my point of view, since this is creepy-identical to his/my situation:
1.) He continually checks my MySpace headlines. He also thinks like you do, and assumes that I "screw every guy" based on some flirty looking messages I put up. He also assumes I "screw every guy" bc I cheated on him when drunk once.. However, I'm not justifying the cheating;I'm just saying that that in no way means I screw every guy now..That's ridiculous.
2.) He also claims all my friends are "druggies".
That REALLY pisses me off, seeing as I am NOT easily influenced and just because they smoke pot [no hardcore drugs, although he'd beg to differ] doesn't mean that *I* will be doing drugs too. They are still good people, and regardless what he says they DO care about me. Besides, some of his friends do way worse drugs than mine.
3.) My mother is a narcissist. Even though she'd NEVER admit it and hasn't been "diagnosed" she is clearly one. She really ticked Brandon off on multiple occasions when she'd always degrade me, expect numerous gifts, manipulate me, etc. so I can see your resentment towards your ex's mother. I love my mother because she is my mother, but that's about it. She is just too selfish and mean to LIKE though.
4.) If you want things to work between you two, I suggest you let your ex know that you DO NOT think she is screwing every guy, and that you only say those things when you're angry and you'll stop saying them. I also suggest you tell her that you don't just think it's HER fault y'all didn't work~Tell her that you feel y'all are just so much alike and therefore clash or something, and that's why y'all argue so much and need counseling. I highly doubt she'll take counseling though..
Anyway, my suggestions were what someone needed to tell my ex back when I gave 2 sh*ts about our potential relationship.
I love him still and always, but I cannot be with him.. [even though he is the only person who really cares about me... :-( ..]
Just me KNOWING that he cares about me so much is not something I'm familiar with [ex. my cold, unloving mother raising me] so I ran from Brandon when I felt like I was his entire LIFE.
We were together about 4 years until I finally left for good.
My most recent ex following Brandon was the complete opposite. He was a druggy sociopath. I was conned and manipulated into dating him. He assaulted me around New Years and was sent to prison and gets released in August. Brandon was right..I did end up with a druggy..like he'd always tell me I would..But I didn't intentionally do so..
He was a con-man! I didn't even know he smoked CIGARETTES!I left the relationship with Brandon extremely vulnerable and naive. I don't know why, but the fact that my ex sociopath gave me that cold, artificial love, yet showered me with that fake, charming attention they all do....that all made me want him more than I wanted Brandon bc even though Brandon actually DID care ab me, he was always getting after me like a parent unlike the "charming" sociopath.
As I said before though, I still love Brandon, and when I think of him I feel complete and LOVED 100%, but ..just the thought of getting back with him fills my mind with so many limits and restraints that I don't want to live by..?
Not to mention, the fact that he always says, "Go fuck every guy, slut!!" When I KNOW and everyone ELSE knows I am NO SLUT-that alone lets me know that he doesn't and won't ever trust me.
I hope that helped!!
:~)
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A
reader, anonymous, writes (10 June 2008): Ray, Ray, Ray,
When you gonna move on and leave this girl alone? She dosen't want your help, you cannot save her, you have no right to tell her what to do, she is your ex not your girlfriend.
If you feel the need to help, then I'm sure the church and voluntary organisations near where you live could provide you with more worthy souls to save. If you like playing doctor, then sign on with a college and get a psycology degree. As I said, I do not believe you are helping this girl, I think you are making things worse, so stay away and find something more usefull to occupy yourself with.
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female
reader, Star_07 +, writes (8 June 2008):
 Check your sources-did you read this in the introduction?
This material is offered for comfort and solace to people who've had bad (or merely weird) experiences with narcissists. If you're looking for ammunition to attack someone, please look elsewhere. If you're looking for a diagnosis, you'll need to consult a psychiatrist. If you're looking for help with your term paper, go here.I've written entirely from my own experience and personal interest; I'm not a therapist or counselor, have no relevant credentials, and can't refer you to lawyers.
-- Joanna Ashmun
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female
reader, pashanoodle  +, writes (8 June 2008):
 Rey, I wonder if it might be helpful for you to go see a psyh yourself - and look at why you are so focused on this destructive/warped relationship - even when it has ended. I supsect you need to look at your own strengths and weaknesses...and gain some insight into yourself/your current motivations in realtionships/your r;ship with your own mother &or the woman who brought you up... so that you don;t end up dating someone like this again, someone you want to "save"...it's just not healthy!
If you invested the energy you have used to research all about your ex and her 'posible' problems - into your own mental and emotional well-being you would be a lot better off!!
Let this go now....move on.
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A
male
reader, Rey +, writes (8 June 2008):
Rey is verified as being by the original poster of the question "Star07 is right about the NPD too, now this is one that is probably the most damaging to others- this type of person almost always leaves you feeling financially and psychologically raped."
That's for sure. She's always trying to "Get over on someone" manipulating them to her whims. This can manifest itself from anything as small as a free meal to buying her clothing and in return she never ever gives anything back. She also takes enormous pleasure in her abilities to manipulate. She just feels entitled to take whatever she can get sucking you dry like a vampire. Then when you're drained she'll curse you for running dry and discard you like you're trash.
http://www.halcyon.com/jmashmun/npd/traits.html#traits
I've been reading some things from the above website in an effort to more completely someone with NPD. I feel understanding more completely the thought processes of a person with NPD will help me in my journey of detaching her more completely from my life. Leaving no lingering doubts as to "Maybe we can fix her". Upon reading this informative site the "traits" listed are 100% my ex, right down to the unusual eating habits. As the site says she does invent ridiculous diets. For example "I don't have to exercise like you because I only eat once in a while" That kinda scares me because she's rapidly losing weight because of her poor eating habits. She once told me "I haven't eaten since monday morning" it was Wednesday when she said this! Even the disappointing gift givers part is like her. (for example, Even though she knows exactly what I want she insists on getting me what she THINKS I should want instead) There's more traits they talk about such as lack sense of humor, self-contradictory, stingy, weird sense of time, don't recognize own feelings, etc. All of these things ARE her completely. It's just so weird to see her behavior spelled out so completely in words before my eyes. She didn't comprehend the kind parts of my letter because, lacking empathy, she didn't get the context and affect of words. I was just being "Mean" or "Spiteful" in her eyes.
For a long while I didn't understand what could make a person act like that or why my sincere words of concern or love never seemed to penetrate, but reading from the above site has helped to enlighten me greatly. There's a great deal there about how they lack empathy.
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A
female
reader, Star_07 +, writes (6 June 2008):
I agree with Ask oldersister. This is exactly what I have been taught in my courses in psychology! This is what brought me off the deep end in the first place-throwing NPD and Hypomania around which are very serious, not to be taken lightly.
I hope you have learned something from all of this!
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A
female
reader, Star_07 +, writes (6 June 2008):
I see that you are very concerned about her and have thought long and hard what to do.
I apologize if I went off the deep end but I have very strong opinions about people tossing around names of disorders.
Anyways, it seems like there is nothing you can do. Her friends probably don't see anything wrong with what she is doing b/c they are busy drinking and getting high as well. Personally, I would be more worried about her drinking heavey as she could overdose. I just hope that who ever is around her is making sure she is still breathing! Do you two have any mutual friends? That would be a great way to tell someone to make sure she is alright.
I see your points and you have used every measure you can to get through to her. There is no reaching someone who is too far to grasp. She is still young, too. She will most likely find herself alone when everyone else is done drinking/drugging and ready to start their lives.
Save yourself from becoming mad! I don't know what else you can do other than tell her good-bye.
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male
reader, Rey +, writes (6 June 2008):
Rey is verified as being by the original poster of the questionHey, Star, don't you think I tried that first? I tried to talk to her about this and she cussed me out. She become very scary. Yelling and screaming like you've never heard. All the while I was very calm and nice, but she just kept getting louder and more and more erratic.
my mother listened as she screamed like that and told me to apologize so I did. After that horrible conversation I decided to just send her the most beautiful letter I could along with some information I highlighted and found relevant to her situation.
Her inner circle of Yes-Men who also indulge frequently in Alcohol/Weed told there was nothing wrong with her and to "pass the blunt" I'm not lying she called me LAST NIGHT and they were high! I come to you because I've run out of options. You can't help someone who surrounds themselves with enablers.
Perhaps if I told her mother just how much bad shit she does she may change her tune, but my aunt told me not to go to her mother with the stuff I know because she'd only resent me and become angry. So here I am....back here, asking you All for help, but none of you seem to have the answers.
So we're at a dead end. She'll continue doing what she does, putting herself at risk for all sorts of negative things and her family will continue indulging her with everything she wants, but none of what she needs.
I tried to be the guy who stands up and does the right thing when it's hard and no one else will, but I'm really out of options.
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male
reader, Rey +, writes (6 June 2008):
Rey is verified as being by the original poster of the questionThanks 4 that, Star. I understand completely how easily it is to misdiagnose people. However, like I've said I didn't just come to this conclusion overnight or by myself. It took a very long time for me to see all the pieces of the puzzle put together. What really hit home for me was that while researching all these symptoms (And I did read a few books and checked more websites than I can remember) was that during the course of our relationship we'd joke about her "Eccentricities" but not until I actually started looking stuff up did I make a correlation between her odd behavior which I thought were her "quirks" and warning signs of an actual problem.
The more I learned about the subtleties of these disorders the more correlations I made to her behavior. Too many parallels to be ignored and the idea that these disorders could become worse and harder to control as time went by put a sense of urgency to it. So, I wrote a heartfelt and informative letter. I let several professors and teaches read it before hand and they all said it was very touching. I even consulted a friend who is a doctor. I didn't want to hurt her feelings, just let her know I was concerned. She denied everything and went berserk. Had any of you read my letter you would take note of the painstaking attention I put into every syllable as to not upset her but express my deepest concern and love for her. She completely glossed over all that good stuff and focused primary on the part where "I thought she was Crazy" She has a bi-polar friend and she uses her as an example, ya know "I'm not like her!"
Anyway, yeah, letters don't get much more kind or sensitive than the one I wrote. I asked her to see someone and that I'd even go with her if she wanted and she repeatedly says she doesn't need help.
We both happen to love the singer Amy Winehouse. I wonder how many times her friends and family asked her to see a professional and how many times she told them to "Fuck off" We see all the time how well Amy is doing in the tabloids. I just don't want my friend to unhappy like that. Especially if one little doctor visit could possibly make the rest of her life happier in all aspects.
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A
female
reader, Star_07 +, writes (6 June 2008):
Well, if someone came to you with this, wouldn't you be upset? I can understand her reaction as most people would react this way. I think you were wrong in your approach. Instead of handing her a checklist of things, you could have said the following:
I am really worried about you. Would you ever consider talking to a counselor? We all have problems and sometimes we need help in getting through them. I am saying this because I care about you and have been concerned about you for a while.
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female
reader, Star_07 +, writes (6 June 2008):
Here is a short exercise to show everyone (who has time) how scary diagnosing people can be:
Here are symptoms for ADHD. And just try to think hard enough (and I mean really think about it) how many of the people you know, including yourself, could qualify for these symptoms at some point in your life.
*Often forgetful in daily activities
*Is often easily distracted.
*Often avoids, dislikes, or doesn't want to do things that take a lot of mental effort for a long period of time
*Often has trouble organizing activities
*Often does not give close attention to details or makes careless mistakes
*Often has trouble keeping attention on tasks or play activities
Most people have experienced the symptoms for ADHD. When something major happens to you in you life-problems at work, problems at home, it easy to see how one could experience ADHD.
But go through 8 hours of rigorous testing and an extensive interview to see how well you fit the mold.
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male
reader, Rey +, writes (6 June 2008):
Rey is verified as being by the original poster of the questionObviously, Star, you completely glossed over the part where I said I formed a hypothesis. As in my best guess based on the information available to me. Not that I verified a diagnosis using these methods. I noted the majority of the symptoms correlated them to the best of my abilities. I don't know what she has for sure which is why I wrote her a letter asking her to verify my suspicions by visiting an actual doctor. At that time she hit all the classic beats of denial which I also researched.
So yeah, I can't diagnose her cause I'm not a psychiatrist, but they won't be able to either cause she thinks what she does is cool as in "I can stop whenever I want" type of thing.
So the matter is out of my hands.
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A
reader, anonymous, writes (6 June 2008): whoa.
i just read your post/question over 3 times to make sure i properly understood everything you're banging on about.
and do you know what conclusion i came to??
YOU are NUTS.
the girl in your story sounds very strange, unstable, whatever. but the thing that interests me is fact that you clearly recognize her faults, yet continue to involve yourself in the jerry springer-esque behavior.
a normal person would cut their losses and move on to somebody they could have a happy fulfilling relationship with. but you stick around, telling her she has psychological disorders, enjoying the drama and just generally stirring the pot.
you're as hooked on her as she is on you.
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A
female
reader, Star_07 +, writes (6 June 2008):
I have a suggestion. Are you in college? Why dont you contact the psychology department and talk to them. I am sure they have licensed psychologists who would be willing to explain this to you.
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A
female
reader, Star_07 +, writes (6 June 2008):
No, Rey. You can not look up "symptoms" in the DSM and diagnose someone as if it were a rash!
Thats just crazy. I am not saying that you are wrong to think something is wrong with her or she is abusing alcohol/drugs. What I am saying is that you are not a professional. I don't know how CLEAR I can be.
I have a BS in PSYCHOLOGY.. I have studied these disorders. I OWN the book! AND I could not diagnose someone or even come close to figuring someone out. I had an aunt with bipolar disorder, professionally diagnosed, and yes, I can see how she fit the symptoms. But if I didn't know what she had, there is NO way I could say she had it. And neither can you!
Say what you want. IF you are so arragont to believe that your intelligence alone can look over some symptoms and come up with this disorder, then you might have the problem.
I didn't want to be rude to you but you have definately gone too far in my book!
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A
male
reader, Rey +, writes (6 June 2008):
Rey is verified as being by the original poster of the questionsorry, I didn't know the size of the bottle just that it was their biggest. And I'm pretty sure drinking that until you're sick is a no-no. She drunk it little by little pouring it into a red plastic cup. Half the bottle one night, the rest the next night.
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male
reader, Collaroy +, writes (6 June 2008):
 I'm sorry but a 3 litre bottle of Jack Daniels? I just looked on their site, they dont produce them - the largest is 1.75 litre , maybe she drank two of these.
And I would think that inducing a gallon (in your terms) of whiskey would probably kill even a movie star.
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male
reader, Rey +, writes (6 June 2008):
Rey is verified as being by the original poster of the questionYou're absolutely right in stating that no I am not a doctor and cannot formally diagnose her. However, I am an intelligent person who is capable of recognizing specific destructive patterns in a persons personality and cross referencing those to existing disorders. It's no different than if you had a rash on your face and you researched your symptoms. "People's behavior can be attributed to a multiple of factors, it doesnt have to be a disorder. For example, if someone close to you dies, you may become depressed but MOST people will not continue to be depressed and have major depressive disorder. Same thing here. Like I said before, you are not a professional!" (star_07)This is true star, however what has lead me to these conclusions is not our break up but longstanding issues which have culminated over time into this hypothesis. This isn't some adolescent phase, but her longstanding personality. The things that I've mentioned to you all here is really only the tip of the ice burg. I already wrote that super long post. If I took the time to actually validate why I felt so strongly about sending her a letter in the first place it might give you all a moments pause. even while we were dating my mother said "I don't think she's happy" in response to her substance abuse and alcoholism. I've never been in a situation where someone you're close to does things like this. Honestly I'm just an ordinary guy trying to help a person who meant a lot to him. So I'm going to tell you guys some things she's done so you can judge for yourselves if these are the actions of a well adjusted person...She doesn't just get drunk and smoke weed occasionally. She does it EVERY SINGLE DAY. Probably doing it right now. I've seen her drink an entire 3 litter bottle of Jack daniel's by herself like it was water! She's even DRIVEN herself to my house after drinking the largest bottle of bicardi 151 that they make! And this was a huge bottle. Even before we were in a relationship together when we just went to school together a lot of people had animosity towards her, but since I didn't know her personally very well I didn't pay very much attention to it. Many years after high school we met up again and started dating. Only after spending significant amounts of time with her was I made privy to the aspects of her personality that caused so many people to dislike her in school. All of that stuff aside, more than a few times she has said things to me personally that lead me down this road of thinking she may be going through something greater than just a "Party girl phase" for example during her what I like to call "Moments of Sincerity" she's said "Sometimes I just feel things I can't explain." or "You should come be with me because you can stop me from doing bad things" Even more recently she's specifically said if we were married I would be "responsible" for her. Translated this means in her mind I'd be in a position to stop her destructive behavior. I've even seen her cry after sex a few times and get this sad look in her eyes and not know why. I asked her if she was ever abused or anything and she said no. And as I've said before her best friend told me some stuff about her mother condoning socially unacceptable behavior (Such as not admonishing her when she makes rude or hurtful comments in public about people) I don't know about all of your mothers, but if I said something rude she'd make me apologize fast, not laugh and condone it. I ask you all this...If your mother doesn't teach you right from wrong what sort of person does that make you? SO, it's like this. No I'm not a psychiatrist. I can't formally diagnose her. I'm just an ordinary person who has seen first hand (Through various family members) what addiction and substance abuse can do to you. Hypomania or NPD have very similar symptoms which makes diagnosis tricky. Anyway to quote Mark Twain (one of my fav writers) "The proper office of a friend is to side with you when you are in the wrong. Nearly anybody will side with you when you are in the right."My Ex though she may be she has a tendency to surround herself with people who will only condone her behavior and not criticize it. Hence why she pushes away the only two people she has who would question her, me and her ex-best friend. I don't know, maybe a few of you are right and I'd mad for trying to much. I just have this feeling that one day the law of averages is not going to be in her favor and she'll behind the wheel under the influence and she'll either really hurt herself or someone else accidentally. How many times can you drive your car high and drunk and not expect there to be consequences? She lives in a world where normal rules of right and wrong don't apply. "I'm ***** I do what I want" that's a direct quote by the way. Her mantra if you will. I'm sorry for the length of this post but hey if I'm going to fill you in I might as well do it all the way. She was my FRIEND before she was my GIRLFRIEND. You all say I don't have any obligation to her and I don't, except a moral one.She's not going to change and I can't help her. So, I should just F*off and let her self destruct. Or another popular theory seems to be that I'm looney and all of this transpired in my head because of a bad break up. Whatever you choose to believe understand that I'm just an nice guy predominately raised by kind women who taught me to do the right thing more often than not. I concede that in this situation I DON'T know what that is. So I asked all of you. Generally you all said I should leave her be. So, I will at that. Thanks for your input. I pray that she finds some inner peace and doesn't slip deeper and deeper into a more difficult problem, like mania or something worse. Once again. Thanks.
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reader, anonymous, writes (5 June 2008): Why would she have to answer to you about what she i doing or who she is with, she is your EX!
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female
reader, Star_07 +, writes (5 June 2008):
Absolutely not. Hypomania and NPD are completely different! For one Hypomania is an episode of the MOOD disorder, bipolar. NPD is just that-a personality disorder. When there is a diagnosis of either Biplolar or NPD, there has to be years of tracking the behaviors. Personality disorders are not to be taken so lightly because they do NOT go away.
Unless she has ever been to a clinician, there is NO way of telling if she has either of these as personality disorders and Bipolar are the more extreme.
I hope in the future you NEVER try to play doctor!
On to self injury- many americans each weekend (especially during holidays) will drink and drive under the influence of alcohol or other drugs-how is this any different?
People's behavior can be attributed to a multiple of factors, it doesnt have to be a disorder. For example, if someone close to you dies, you may become depressed but MOST people will not continue to be depressed and have major depressive disorder. Same thing here. Like I said before, you are not a professional!
It seems the easiest thing here is to NOt contact her anymore and stay away from her. You can not fix her, especially if she doesnt think she has a problem!
Good Day!
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A
female
reader, Susan Strict  +, writes (5 June 2008):
 Rey, I've looked at the info you sent me in some detail and researched some of it thoroughly. You know the bit I mean.
I have to say that I think you really do need to step back and take a long, hard look at yourself as well as at this situation generally.
Some of the things you are saying really don't quite stack up. Whilst I know that it's easy to mislead the general public and the press, it's simply not believable that the truth you seem to see could be SO far from the public image here.
If that makes no sense to anyone else, then I apologise. It would be inappropriate to give the details here.
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A
female
reader, pashanoodle +, writes (5 June 2008):
I agree with Diovanlestat...you are sounding pretty unbalanced yourself in this post. The answer to your problem is simple - move on, stop engaging in chit chat (you are playing mental and emotional games by the sound of it - your conversations sound downright ridiculous) and stop thinking you have been placed on this planet to "fix" this woman.YOU are obviously not coping with the break-up - you are just playing the matyr!!
It is no surprise to me that your relationship broke down...you need to have a long hard look at what you are bringing to a relationship, I am guessing your "diagnosis" didn;t start after the break up....you are the one who sounds narcissistic if you ask me!!
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male
reader, Rey +, writes (5 June 2008):
Rey is verified as being by the original poster of the questionP.S.
I'm not the only person in her life who has noticed this. A mutual acquaintance of ours told me once how she suddenly extremely angry with her over something very trivial and it shocked her. That and Her Best Friend of 6 years who was like a sister to her also noticed the signs but eventually she drove her away nonchalant and spiteful nature. She even divulged stuff to me about how her mother condones her rude behavior so there's no incentive to stop. The only difference between me and her best friend is that eventually she just gave up and stopped talking to her completely. She said I should do the same, but I wanted to help. I feel that perhaps I should follow her example. I've tried to help for so long because I've read that people like this have trouble keeping relationships romantic or otherwise so I didn't want to abandon her completely until I had exhausted all other possibilities which seems to be the case now.
Thanks, DiovanLestat, for your input. I'm not a "headcase" as you say, I'm just really compassionate and sympathetic about people I care about want to help if I can.
Thanks again, everyone.
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male
reader, Rey +, writes (5 June 2008):
Rey is verified as being by the original poster of the questionShe may be a danger to herself. Because I know for a fact that she drives while under the influence of alcohol and weed frequently. Largely in part to her grandiose personality. She's even said "I've driven way worse off than this" Which is a little disturbing for me. When I said maybe I should elope with her it was in jest, but I guess you can't pick up on that with only text.
Thanks 4 all of ur answers and I think that I'm just going to have to do my best to distance myself from her. I just hope the drugs, alcohol, etc don't put her in danger down the road. Because regardless of what's transpired between us you never want anything bad to happen to people care about.
Thanks.
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reader, anonymous, writes (5 June 2008): Aunties, Uncles, are you so sure this man is so nice. Remember this is his ex girlfriend. He walked out of the relationship because he couldn't cope.
"I asked her simple follow up questions like "Who was this dude? Where did you meet him?" stuff like that and she totally gets defensive and says she doesn't want to talk about it.......... She then went on to say that I cross boundaries by asking her details about it" (Rey)
"She even refused to have sex with me once after we broke...why? "Because I don't have sex with random people" Sounds like BS right now." (Rey)
"What makes her think I'd want to marry someone with that sort of mentality or behavior?......... "Maybe if we eloped and she was my wife I'd have the power to forcefully make her undergo treatment?" (Rey)
Check the signs, this guy sounds like a headcase to me. He's playing mind games and you all keep validating him and his abuse.
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female
reader, Susan Strict +, writes (5 June 2008):
If I understand NPD and hypomania correctly, both are relatively mild personality disorders - although it may not seem mild if you are on the receiving end of it. Certainly proper diagnosis by an expert would be ideal, but if she is resisting that then you only have the options of trying to deal with it yourself or walking away and forgetting her. Assigning a label to her personality doesn't come close to solving it, even if you have found the right label and know everything about the way to deal with it.
From the depth of your question and your previous question here, I would guess that you aren't ready to just walk away. As I said before, the sensible move for your own welfare would be to get as far from her as you can and get on with your own life. Her family will deal with her problems.
But, assuming that's not what you intend to do and assuming her problems don't deteriorate into a full bipolar disorder that definitely needs treatment by a specialist (if she becomes a danger to herself or to others - and from what you say that's not the case yet), you want some guidance on what you can do.
The best you can do is to react appropriately to the behaviour she displays. There are dozens of Internet sites giving advice on how to deal with abnormal or aggressive behaviour. You can't change her personality and you can't cure a disorder - that's for the medical experts. But you may be able to break the habit of her behaviour if you are patient enough and dedicated enough.
Do you really want that sort of stress? Are you strong enough for it? Will the end result be worth it - even assuming you can achieve it?
These are questions that only you can answer.
Good luck.
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reader, anonymous, writes (5 June 2008): "Maybe if we eloped and she was my wife I'd have the power to forcefully make her undergo treatment?" (Rey)
"I'm concerned about this need of yours to be in control of her life. She is not in your life anymore so a normal person would continue their life and forget." (female reader, anonymous)
Rey, I remember your other post. You broke off the relationship because you couldn't stand her strange behaviour. How come you now want to marry her and lock her away. To tell the truth, you got the problem, your the mental nutcase here. Leave the girl alone, it's obvious your driving her mad. Leave her alone and get on with your life.
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female
reader, Indigo616 +, writes (5 June 2008):
Hi there,
I agree with some of the other posts, that perhaps it wasn't the best move to try to diagnose her... But its definately good that you've noticed some behavior things that you yourself have trouble dealing with. Its just as good to know, if not better, to know what you don't want than what you do want from a relationship.
Honestly, from someone that's been there, get out of it. I was dating someone that sounds extremely similar to what you described, except I hung in there and we did the therapy thing. Bottom line, as much as you love someone and they can be sweet and wonderful (on occasion), you can't help someone that doesn't want to be helped. Don't waste your time. I was in a relationship with that jerk for 3 years based on promises that he'll change and stop acting that way. But when we were in the moment with one of his narcissistic tirades, it was always my fault and he'd say I was the one with the problem. We broke up finally 2 weeks ago and I finally feel better about everything. I didn't realize he was bringing me down so much. I didn't feel like he really supported me, that I was just his punching bag.
What I'm trying to say is, its not worth the effort if she's not going to acknowledge she's got a problem and is willing to make significant changes. All couples have problems, but in the end, you need to recognize what you can and can't live with - like what your deal breakers are, and it sounds like you can't deal with her behavior any more.
Just to give you some insight on our sessions, in therapy, all that our doctor told me to do is be supportive and tell him when he's acting that way and he agreed to try to take a step back and acknowledge what he's doing. But in the end it was just lip service and I hurt myself, my family and my friends in the process. He'd take jabs at all of us and would always tell me its my fault.
Think of down the line too. Do you really want your kids growing up with a mother like that? That's going to act that way? They're going to have problems too just by being exposed to that. Its not cool how she's acting especially with how hard you're trying to help her.
You sound like a really nice guy. Please don't limit yourself and book it. Its not worth the angst. Just be strong. You'll find other people out there that are just as cool and won't be a b*#$% like your girl is acting. As they say, there's tons of other fish in the sea!
Best wishes ; )
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female
reader, Star_07 +, writes (5 June 2008):
I agree PeterPan. Sometimes its better to cut people off completely when you are involved with someone that has problems in which you can not help them.
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female
reader, anonymous, writes (5 June 2008): I hope your informal diagnostics came from at least a trustful source like the DSM IV-TR.
I think there's no use or sense in your desperation to help this ex of yours. Are u still inetrested in her? I doubt it because you have criticized her in many ways and I don't judge you.
First of all, you know those kind of diagnostics should be made only by qualified psychologists and/or psychiatrists. One of the first and most important 'rules' in pyschology is that you should not diagnose or treat a relative, friend or family because you could never be objective enough to be professional. Yes, we see clues here and there but who knows?
If she were to have NPD is something she'll be in denial of and something that's not dangerous to her life or others. So there's no need to be desperated.
And Dear I'm just an organizational psychologist who took her license test on saturday but I'm concerned about this need of yours to be in control of her life. She is not in your life anymore so a normal person would continue their life and forget.
You seem to me like a codependent type of person. Trying to be in control and caring too much about other's problem's. OMG you are even thinking about getting together with the woman whom you have criticized so much? The one who has been with who knows how many guys by now just to get her to undesrtand you were right about her NPD? Listen to yourself.
I say read about codependency and stop taking this girl's calls and go on with your life. This is a toxic ex-relationship to me. Totally toxic. Let her go or you'll only end up more and more frustrated.
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male
reader, PeterPan +, writes (5 June 2008):
 I agree with my friend Tisha here... But I might be a little more brutal than she's suggesting. I would just drop off the grid completely. Change your cell number, home numbers if possible... put a filter on your email messages... drop out of sight. This woman is dragging you down and you're feeding to her by being her sounding board for her over-inflated personality and narcissistic behavior (NPD or not). It's not worth your time nor energy any more. Seems like you've got a life to lead in this dimension... stop letting her invade yours space with her issues. She's obviously looking for somebody to brag/gloat to and you're playing into it.
So, that's what I would suggest publicly. I have more to say privately. If you're interested, please contact me via email.
Best of luck... move on -- run, don't walk!
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female
reader, Star_07 +, writes (5 June 2008):
First of all, you are NOT a psychologist! So please, do not get the DSM-IV-TR and start diagnosing people yourself. Sorry, but that is meant as a guideline for psychologists who have extensive training. Last thing, when I say guideline, it is purely a GUIDELINE. For most of these disorders, you can fit just about EVERYONE into a diagnosis, that is why it is left to the professionals!
That being said, I can see why you are concerned. You know her behavior is strange and she definately appears to have problems. There is no way to force her to get help at this point. What you can do is talk to her parents about what has been going on and tell them you think she needs to talk to someone about her issues. Another thing you could do is suggest that you go to couples counseling together and sort of "set her up" so that the psychologist will try to investigate her situation further. Maybe you can talk to some psychologists yourself and see what can be legally done to help her.
I hope this helps and remember to be VERY careful when picking up that book I was talking about. Just because you think you could "figure" her out doesnt mean you can!
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female
reader, Tisha-1 +, writes (5 June 2008):
 Rey, wow, that was very long post to read. You've obviously put a lot of time and effort into the relationship and it must be very frustrating not to be able to help.
I just don't see that you can do anything more than you've done. She's read your letter, and has now drawn the wagons into a circle round her camp.
I think it's time to stop worrying about her and focus on ways to help you move forward in life without her.
She might well have mental health issues but she is not in imminent danger of harming herself in any way, from what you've reported. Sleeping around, while not exactly the best idea from an STD standpoint, isn't a crime.
You're right, why would you marry someone with that kind of mentality or behavior?
I'd stop answering her calls and let her get on with her own life, messed up though you think it might be. And don't go on her webpage either, as this will make it more difficult for you to end this connection. You're only going to worry more and I don't think this will help anyone.
I see from this post that you're a man who feels things deeply and would like to help her, but, I think that maybe this needs some distance and time and no contact from you.
Take one more phone call from her, and tell her that you wish her the very best in life, but that you need to move on. You've done what you can, you can hold your head high and not regret anything.
With my best wishes for you.
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