A
male
age
36-40,
*ottenhamhotspur
writes:About 4 year ago, I went to a bar. I was 21 at the time, and pretty inexperienced when it came to any sort of physical interaction. I felt as though I needed to get out and see what I was 'missing'. I was sitting outside of a local bar on a patio, and, with the bad judgement of alcohol and foolishness, french kissed a woman- she did NOT kiss me or kiss me back, and a few moment later, for only a moment, put my hand down her pant and touched her butt (we were sitting beside one another on chairs and I don't think I got all that far). It all happened pretty quickly, and akwardly, as I have always been akward around women physically. Anyhow, I have felt GUTTED about it, and obsessive about it for the last 4 years. I've never done anything like it before or after, and I didn't mean to cause any harm or offense by it, I just got carried away. She did not protest, hit me, run away, etc. or I surely would have stopped. I'd imagine she was a least surprised by it. I'm afraid I may have embarrassed or insulted her and should have been arrested or something. I am not a bad person, but made a mistake.Any advice for me to stop obsessing and forgive myself?Unfortunately I have no way to find her to ask her how she's doing, and more importantly, to apologize, explain myself and ask for forgivenessI find day to day life difficult with my guilt, and I have struggled with other OCD issues
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male
reader, tottenhamhotspur +, writes (26 May 2011):
tottenhamhotspur is verified as being by the original poster of the questionThanks all for your wonderful answers and suggestions.
I am going to seek out some therapy to help me out with my underlying issues.
I have a way of asking the 'what if' questions to a ridiculous extent. When I feel there is a bit of hope of giving up the obsession I have to ask 'what if I did something offensive or horrible between the time it happened and she left" because I don't remember too much more of the night (clearly I would remember anything that would bother me that much) I have to wonder again and again if there was anything more- which I honestly don't beleive there is.
I'll be going back into therapy and STAYING in therapy for the next year at least. I need to get some help and get all my issues out in the open.
I am also planning to visit a psychologist and psychiatrist once I move to a bigger city.
THANKS AGAIN FOR ALL YOUR HELP
A
female
reader, anonymous, writes (26 May 2011): I think if you are obsessing about it four years later you may find a little bit of counselling helpful. Ask your doctor.
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A
male
reader, idoneitagain  +, writes (26 May 2011):
Lets start with what happened 4 years ago, but I want to say from the start that this is not the main issue here, for you.
The way you describe it, 4 years ago you were in a bar and you kissed a girl. You feel terribly guilty about it because you did it without her permission, you were just being quite forward and took her by surprise. It sounds like you took yourself by surprise too, because you are not normally that kind of guy.
You are concerned that you behaved badly, and that you would have caused an innocent bystander some level of distress because you acted inappropriately. It is true that you behaved inappropriately, so I don't want to diminish that. It is important for the record to acknowledge that it is not acceptable behaviour to just kiss someone, or touch them sexually, without some form of consent by them. I know that you already know this, and that you are generally very well behaved. However, just because you did this doesn't mean that you should assume that what you did was terribly distressing for them. On a scale of 0-10, with 10 being terribly distressing and 0 being not at all distressing, this would probably have rated as a 0 or 1 in most people's experience, in my opinion. Some people might have enjoyed the experience, this kind of thing has happened to me when I was younger, and I enjoyed it, even though at the same time I might have been annoyed that it was done without my permission. You are not being fair on yourself to assume that it was so terrible for her.
This experience was most likely not a big deal to her. If she was upset about it, most likely she would have just thought you were being a drunken idiot, and forgotten about it by the next day. You are concerned that she was embarrased or insulted by it, she might have been, but as you said she didn't run or complain about it, most likely she was surprised, but not really that concerned about it. She might have spent a few days telling here friends "I was out and this dude just kissed me and grabbed my ass, can you believe that? He was drunk and didn't have any idea who I was..." etc.
You are concerned that your behaviour has left a lasting impression on her, and you want to be able to see how she is doing and if she is ok. You need to realise that it is highly unlikely that it has had such a big impact on her, she might hardly remember the incident. She might have even have fond memories of it, it might be a crazy story that she tells from when she was younger, you have no idea how it impacted on her, but most likely, she won't be dwelling on it to this day, as you do.
The reason you are dwelling on it, and the reason that she probably doesn't, is that she does not have to take responsibility for the incident, she can easily let it go because it is your behaviour in question, not hers, so she can not be concerned about it and get on with her life.
This brings us to the real issue, which is not about what happened 4 years ago. It is that today, there is something that happened 4 years ago that you dwell on, that you keep obsessing over, that still bothers you. In other words, there is something that you did a long time ago that bothers you to this day, that you are having a hard time getting over. You are having a hard time for having made a mistake many years ago. For having possibly wronged someone slightly, and never having the opportunity to make it right.
It is important to realise that we all make mistakes, and that not all mistakes can be made right. That is a fact of life. Sometimes we don't get to say sorry to people that we accidentaly do harm to. I wish it were different, but that is the reality of life. Importantly, it is ok that this is the reality of life. It is ok that we don't always get to behave 100%, that we make mistakes, that we sometimes hurt people or let them down. It means a lot that you don't want to make mistakes or let people down, that it is so important to you that you are still thinking about it many years later, it is very touching that you care that much. However, your care is only serving everyone if it doesn't impact on your functioning in the world. The world wants you to care, but no one wants you to care so much that it stops you from being free to be yourself, that you have to obsess over things.
Know that it is ok for you to forgive yourself, for making mistakes, for not being perfect, for doing harm to others when we don't mean to. It is part of life. You might not be perfect, but you can still be a great human being whist still being flawed.
You say that you struggle with this as well as other OCD issues. It is your struggle with obsessing that is the issue, not the incident that happened many years ago that you are using as the focus of your obsessions. Find a way to deal with your obsessions, and you will realise that this event is something that you can get over, and that you can focus on what is happening in your life today, rather than focussing obsessively on the past, and on other things. There are many things you can try till you find something that works for you, that helps you to diminish your OCD, maybe read up on some of your options and try a few.
Good luck.
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A
female
reader, anonymous, writes (26 May 2011): I remember this scenario too and was thinking the same thing as Cerberus.While your actions may have been a bit forward they were far from predatory. Nothing you did would have traumatized anyone save someone craving the attention of being a victim.Put this incident in persepective. Do you think the woman is still thinking about it? Do you really think she's afraid to leave her house because of it? Do you think she now walks about with a can of mace or a tazer? What impact do you really think you had on this woman? None. That's what.The way to get over the past is to talk about the future. The only person thinking about this is you.
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A
male
reader, anonymous, writes (26 May 2011): Maybe the girl was just as drunk and didn't even really notice. Just don't ever do that again!
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A
male
reader, anonymous, writes (26 May 2011): OMG! I know how you feel. Late last year I tore one of those tags off my mattress that says do not remove under penalty of law. I have been paranoid and scared half to death since. There is no telling when they will come down on me for prosecution but it has made my life a living hell.
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A
female
reader, Jen1689  +, writes (25 May 2011):
 I wouldn't beat yourself up over this at all. If the girl had been even mildly offended by your actions, she would have yelled, or screamed, or punched you. At the very least she would have found someone to come escort you out of the bar. It sounds like she might have been enjoying the move you put on her. Or she might have been drunk herself. Either way, you didn't harrass her, by any means. By the sounds of it, she went along with it. Don't let it get to you. I would have found it to be, at the very least, a funny story to tell my friends down the road. No need to be harsh on yourself.
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A
female
reader, BettyBoup  +, writes (25 May 2011):
 Honestly, I do not think this was assault. It sounds like you liked the girl and tried to make a move on her, that didn't go to plan. End of story. Ok,so you wouldn't normally be so direct, but you were drunk, and this took away your inhibitions. It's just a shame that the girl obviously wasn't feeling the same way, and it's a shame that she didn't at least say something to you, or stop you from trying to kiss her. It was an awkward situation, that's all, and it wasn't all your fault. It would have been a LOT less awkward if the girl had moved her head away, when you leaned in to kiss her, and just politely said she wasn't interested. Instead, she didn't react, for whatever reason, and allowed you to continue with your attempt to kiss her and have a grope. This was not sexual assault, it was at worse, a badly misjudged sexual advance. You were not malicious, and you didn't continue to persue this girl, once you realised she wasn't returning your affection. Ok so it was a really mortifying experience, made worse by her friend's tactless accusation that you stuck your tongue down her throat.
But at the end of the day, you are not the bad, evil person that you have believed you were. You are much, much more decent than other guys out there. There are guys who don't take no for an answer and will push themselves onto a girl. There are guys who take advantage of vulnerable women who go along with things they aren't really wanting to do. But they don't consider it assualt because the girl wasn't in the postition to think straight or put up a fight. I've had guys try, and try again to kiss me and touch me, who just didn't seem to be put off by the fact I kept pushing them away and protesting. I realise they were drunk and I have learnt to be more assertive in such situations, but I don't think they were bad people, just drunk, foolish guys, trying to get lucky and going about it the wrong way.
You on the other hand realised the woman wasn't interested and backed off. So you behaved better than those guys who kept persisting, and even I don't think they were bad, just a nuiscence. So that makes you a good guy! It's just a shame that the girl wasn't interested or didn't at least tell you that, because it's clearly knocked your confidence. You need to realise, in the world of romance, there are going to be awkward, embarrasing moments, and times when you will be rejected. But you have to not let that upset you. Learn from it. Next time talk to the girl and flirt before going in for a kiss. You will learn to recognise when a women is attracted to you. It may take a couple more mistakes and awkward attempts, before you pick the right girl to kiss. But it will be worth it when you do get to kiss that right girl :)
Stop beating yourself up, if I were that girl, I would understand and forgive you, without you having to appologise. Forgive yourself and move forward, you deserve to find a girlfriend, you sound like a really decent guy, and I meant that.
Good luck.
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A
female
reader, Missy00 +, writes (25 May 2011):
 I agree with Dear Mandy. We all make mistakes, we are only human. It was 4 years ago. Live and learn.
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A
female
reader, angelDlite +, writes (25 May 2011):
 hey don't worry about this, honestly (in my opinion) this is nothing. we've all been young and drank too much sometimes, i've met loads of blokes who have been really too frisky with their hands but i don't hold a grudge! some of us women pretty much EXPECT stuff like this, i bet the lady in question doesn't ever think about you or what you did anymore.
i know it is not an easy thing for you to stop obsessing about this though because of your OCD, are you getting therapy already for that?
you seem a nice and considerate person, some lads do this sort of thing again and again routinely, its just a usual Saturday night for them and it doesn't bother them a bit coz they are shameless, so don't change ok? the world needs more men like you! :)
x
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A
female
reader, anonymous, writes (25 May 2011): I think that the only thing that you should feel " GUTTED" about is that you didn't take her home and finish the deal....stop doing that to your self...you did nothing, trust me..
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A
reader, anonymous, writes (25 May 2011): Wow tottenhamhotspur, this is still bothering you?
http://www.dearcupid.org/question/is-this-forgivable-and-would-you-forgive.html
http://www.dearcupid.org/question/did-i-sexually-assault-someone.html
4 years is a long time buddy, sorry to say man but you're just going to get the same answers you did in your questions last year.
You did nothing wrong my friend. Nothing at all. That's what we guys do, we make moves, we kiss girls, we sometimes go over the top and when that happens the girl stops us and we apologize and get on with things.
I have absolutely no doubt in my mind that she hasn't given it a second thought man. In fact like most women she'll be used to a kind of unwanted advance that far exceeds what you did, which was minor. We all make drunken mistakes dude, all of us on yours was on the low end of the scale.
Did you finish your counseling? Are you getting more therapy now for your issues? Because if not then you need to go. Counseling doesn't seem enough for you, your OCD must be very severe if you're still beating yourself up about this. You need long term therapy of some sort, it's not just this issue that is messing with you, there has to be some kind of underlying cause. It's very rare to be this upset for this long about one thing, when everyone has told you it was very minor.
The only other thing i can think of is try and get in contact with this woman to apologize. Try and talk to her about that night, see how she feels about it and apologize.
But keep searching for a treatment man, perhaps you have an undiagnosed disorder, you were in counseling last year and it didn't really work. Time to go to your doctor and see what options are available to you. Good luck man, life is too short to stress the little things and now that spurs are out of the champions league you don't even have that look forward to hehe.
Come on the Gunners!
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A
male
reader, Drew21 +, writes (25 May 2011):
 If that is the worst thing you ever do while drunk, then buddy let me tell you you are doing pretty good and have nothing to be embarassed about. Let it go and move on.
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A
male
reader, tottenhamhotspur +, writes (25 May 2011):
tottenhamhotspur is verified as being by the original poster of the questionThanks for all the response already.
I think that for me, one of my biggest issues is that normally I treat everyone with a lot of respect and consideration. Normally when I hate people -or even want to date people- it takes me a long time to do anything as I don't like to be pushy. I was going through a phase where I thought I needed to learn to be more outgoing and open to new experiences.
Now I just feel frozen. I cannot connect with new people and have a hard time being with the friends and family I love. I feel like a total failure and let down.
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A
reader, anonymous, writes (25 May 2011): Well if this woman did not protest, yell, scream, push you away, then you have nothing to feel guilty about. You were just acting on male impulse, which is perfectly normal, dont beat yourself up about it.
Because she did not kiss you back, just means she was not interested in you that way, But just because you dropped the hand does not make you some kind of creep, believe me guys do that all the time lol. However if she shouted for you to stop and you refused to then, yep you would be a creep, but she didnt protest, and from what you say you're actions are just that of a normal red blooded male :)
Put the experience behind you and move on im sure the girl did. When we are inexperienced and drunk, we behave oddly so stop thinking about it, interact with other girls whilst sober and maybe get help for the OCD issues.
Hope this helped.x
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A
female
reader, YouWish +, writes (25 May 2011):
 Relax. You didn't cause any harm to her. Let it go. You were drunk and in a bar. She let you know she didn't like it, and that's the end of it. Chances are, she's forgotten all about it. Forgive yourself, learn from it, and make your next contacts with women better.You can't better yourself by obsessing over it, wanting to track her down, and freaking out. You can fix this by not making the same mistake. Be caring and kind...and sober! You really didn't do anything wrong. You didn't sexually assault her. It was an awkward encounter. You must believe in your ability to improve, and you must FORGIVE YOURSELF!
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A
female
reader, Dear Mandy +, writes (25 May 2011):
 STOP obssessing RIGHT NOW!!!! This was 4 yrs ago, and as you said you were foolishly drunk. We all do stupid things from time to time, no one got hurt, and the important thing is you realised what you had done, and never done anything like that since. Just steer clear from drinking like that ever again. Forgive yourself and learn from this. I doubt this girl would ever want to see you again, even if it was just to apologise. But you learned a valuable lesson, dont drink what you cant handle!!!
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A
male
reader, anonymous, writes (25 May 2011): Can you find the girl and apologize? If not, you must at least be willing to apologize to her, even if it isn't possible. A written apology is actually best. No need to go into details. Just apologize for your boorish behavior and explain that it has bothered you ever since then.If cannot locate the woman today, donate $250 to a local abused woman's shelter. Then commit to yourself not to do it again. Then move on.
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