A
female
age
51-59,
anonymous
writes:Hi, I am feeling really down about an issue to do with a guy who 'came on' to me about a year or so ago. When I first got to know him he was a friend of my (now ex) partner, who I was with for 17 years. My gut instinct when I met this person was "phoney" - I really have never had such a strong reaction to someone in this way. However, my ex kept saying what a nice person he is and so on, so I just tried to override my feeling and get on with him.I am 45 and this guy is 35 and married. I do look 10 years younger and people consistently think this about me - I'm mentioning this only to try to give a bigger picture re. what happened. I also have very high qualifications and contacts that have come through sheer hard work and genuine love of my field -but I had low self esteem when we met and I was quite vulnerable. I realise now that he wanted to know me because he wanted to be associated with someone like me and to be considered a good friend, and that because I was very vulnerable at that point, I overrode my instincts and befriended him.Anyway, this guy is very, very ambitious and a 'manouevrer'. His work is actually only just mediocre by anyone's standards, but he manages to get loads of guidance, benefits, promotions etc because he is known as a 'networker'. Because he is 35 and has worked in the same company for years, the older people there very much think of him as young and up and coming and they parent him and guide him.We work in the same field and both teach as part of what we do. I had a child when I was 19, a year after marrying at 18, but my husband abandoned us shortly after and I've had no help whatsoever from him. This has meant that my career is, in some ways and on paper, 10 years behind most people my age. However, I am known for being an extremely original thinker and very intelligent - although I don't have so much work experience as some I do have great qualifications and I am excellent at my job. But I definitely do not have the manipulation skills necessary for making it big in my field - I've often been taken advantage of by people 'milking' my ideas and thoughts and then using them strategically in ways that I can't because I don't have the contacts to be able to 'roll out' ideas. I do have Asperger's as well, and this makes it almost impossible for me to know when people are using me - I simply can't be manipulative because I get too confused.What happened was that this person helped me to get a little bit of work at a time when I was really low. But I know he also wanted to be associated with me because of my reputation for being 'brilliant' (I'm not boasting, it's just that this is what people tend to think) and I now know he had another agenda. To my horror, one night when we were supposed to be discussing a work issue, he told me that he was deeply unhappy in his marriage, wanted a relationship with me and wanted to leave his wife because she was pressuring him to have a baby. I find this person repulsive - it's not that I go for stereotypical looks at all, but I just have this instinctive reaction to him - and I was very shocked by how little he seemed to feel for his wife. He really was sick of her and seemed almost to hate her.I told him I was not interested, which he was very upset about. But I had to remain friends because of the work I'd been given - we were both working in the same place. After that period, the company decided to keep me on, only for a very limited amount of work, and not permanent, but well paid. During that time he asked me AGAIN if I would consider a relationship with him. I have to say I have never flirted with this person, not one bit. I told him again that I wasn't interested. Recently a senior job came up that this person is in not really qualified for or experienced enough to do - there will be hundreds of external candidates who are far and away miles better for the job. However, this person is being nurtured, as I said, and especially by an older man who has been in the company for a long time and who is making sure that he paves the way for this guy to have a great career. At the same time, I applied for a less senior job that I am way overqualified for and could do standing on my head - and this elderly guy was on my interview panel. I cannot tell you how many people said to me that this job was just 'made' for me. I gave an excellent interview and was so hopeful because I really need more work and a permanent job. I was so hopeful. What was weird was that, before I heard the outcome of the interview, this guy who came onto me texted me and said that he had been given the senior role and that, because it is still part time (though extremely well paid) he would be keeping his other job (also part time) with the same company but that there is part of his old job that he couldn't now do and he could recommend me for it. Now, the part of his old job that he doesn't want is the WORST job in this field - honestly, you would have to be absolutely desperate and beyond to do this part of the job, it's incredibly hard work, you get treated like dirt and the working conditions are horrible - I know this because I did it once before to help him out and we both agreed it is vile. Also, he has no power to actually give me this work, only to recommend me for it. I found this very insensitive, given how hopeful I was of getting the job I wanted. This guy is very, very insensitive when it comes down to it - he can seem sensitive but then he will say and do things that are quite shockingly oblivious to the other person.So, I was upset and a little suspicious that, after my interview, this guy offers to recommend me for this horrible job even before I found out my result.After I did find out, I mentioned to a friend what had happened. She was so shocked that I did not get this job and said that, if this guy was such good friends with the elderly guy then he could have EASILY put in a good word for me - not that it should even have been needed really. She suggested that this guy, because he didn't get what he wanted from me and now has no use for me because he has gotten a senior role, was trying to 'downgrade' me and it's possible that, rather than putting in a good word for me, he did the opposite with this older guy, who has a huge amount of say in the company.What makes this worse - what is really upsetting me - is that in all this time I have watched this guy realise that I don't want him and that he has had to come to terms with staying with a wife who he doesn't love and finally agreed with her to have a baby - he is absolutely terrified of being alone and I know this as he told me - so he got her pregnant because he couldn't face being alone. I know for a fact that he mentioned this pregnancy to this older man about a week before his interview and that he did this along the lines of being very worried now that he would have another mouth to feed. Another male friend immediately said to me that this guy was using his forthcoming father hood to make sure he 'tipped the balance' to get the job, because this older man has had a lot of difficulty as a father and he would empathise with him.What's upsetting me is that men can do this - use forthcoming parenthood to gain sympathy from older men, esteem and respect - and a job! Whilst on the other hand women who have had children, or a woman who is pregnant, would be treated in the opposite way, as a liability.I am really upset by what this person seems to have done. Jobs like the one I was after come up so rarely and, at my age, I now doubt I will ever get one and feel like just giving up, despite that I love this field. What do people think and what would you do? I have backed off a lot from this 'friend' because I have other contacts that I feel he has been trying to get 'insider information' on so that he can use them - in fact I am sure that in one case at least he is doing this.
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ambition, flirt, my ex, older man, older men, period, self esteem, text Reply to this Question
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female
reader, anonymous, writes (2 August 2014): I really appreciate everyone's responses on this one. The behaviour of the guy in question, in terms of me feeling manipulated, goes far beyond what I wrote about here - I actually googled 'manipulative behaviour' after writing this post and one thing is says is that if you feel that the person's primary criteria is to 'get what they can' from you over and above just being a friend, and also if they make themselves seem very vulnerable and, hence 'un-blameable' - then these are signs of a manipulator.
The reason I did not refuse the horrible work straight away was because, by that time, I was already very suspicious of him...I didn't just point blank say "no" because I realised, as I'm such a dope about things like this, that there may be other consequences if I just said "no", especially prior to getting my interview result. As it is I've just really backed off. Only one thing remaining bothers me is that in the past I've spoken in great terms to this guy of an amazingly intelligent colleague of mine (not exactly a friend) and I know for sure that this guy has his sights set on using him. I don't know whether to warn the colleague and risk seeming paranoid or just to let him make his own decision about whether to trust the guy involved.
Anyway, the other reason that I dislike this kind of behaviour is that I started off in this field of the arts years ago because it was, at that time, free from all this cut throat manipulation and that's why me and others loved it - as it is, friendships and relationships are now being increasingly used and exploited in a corporate manner and it is changing the face of the arts scene into something that a lot of us find repulsive because it's emptying out everything that once felt relatively innocent. Okay, call us naive, but some of us really do want a world like that and it really, really goes against the grain when people behave like this guy - soon there'll be nothing nice left to exploit and that's why I feel it has to stop somewhere.
Thanks again.
A
male
reader, Sageoldguy1465  +, writes (2 August 2014):
 I measured your submittal on my monitor screen. It takes up 24 inches!!!!!! Throughout it all.... I couldn't help thinking, "this girls sounds like she's pretty smart..... why can she not see that she is dealing with a cad who has no interest in her... EXCEPT if/as she puts out for him?????
So... is that so? If not, then you should separate yourself from him.... now and forever.... and never look back....
Good luck..
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A
female
reader, Honeypie +, writes (1 August 2014):
 I wouldn't just "back off" from this ... "friend" I'd totally cut him out of my life, he is not going to HELP you in your life OR your career. He will GLADLY screw you over on both occasions and not a good way....
And I agree, why not just tell him, NO thanks to the job?
If you are as qualified and hardworking I have NO doubt you can do WAY better without this guy's ... "help".
If you HAVE to be around him for work, be polite but don't offer any help. Other then that, cut him off.
Focus on YOUR life and your career.
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A
female
reader, Dionee'  +, writes (1 August 2014):
 He is married. That's all anyone needs to know. Just stay away from this guy. That's something that even all of your analyzing and realizing can't change. So nothing should be enter into with this man relationship wise but I think you already know that. He is scum that is trying to ruin your professional life because you wouldn't agree to be the other woman. It's good that you can at least see through him in that regard. If you don't want the job he wants you to take then don't take it. He seems like he has quite a bit of power when it comes to the older guys so he will do whatever he can to possibly prevent you from getting what you want. I think you should just accept that he is horrible in so many ways as well as manipulative. Perhaps all you can do is move on with your life while trying your best to stay away from him. Good Luck.
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A
female
reader, CindyCares  +, writes (1 August 2014):
 What would we do about what exactly ?...
About him as a " suitor " ? NOTHING, obviously . He is married, he is having a child !, and regardless you don't like him, you find him repulsive . If he got upset about being rejected, his problem, at 35 he was old ebough to know that you do not hit on older women with the usual lame spiel " my wife does not understand me ", they know better and it won't work.
On a professional level ? Follow your guts , ( and your experience ) and since you judge him manipulative, disloyal, fawning and power hungry, and, I suppose you don't need to be friends with a colleague like that , keep backing off till he is a far little point in the distance.
Although, I must say, thngs may have gone exactly as you report , or perhaps not ( it's all hearsay, guesses and surmises. You don't KNOW for a fact that he used his upcoming fatherhood as leverage, etc. ) but even so personally I'd find it rather incidental, or accidental. After so many years in your field, you know it is a competitive , cut throat field. Who knows , maybe he got his new job because of his qualifications and because he IS the best person for the position, ... but suppose he has been helped by his networking, social skills, personal contacts , so what. Are you surprised ? In competitive fields, people use all the tools at their disposal to succeed , it's not a secret, and personally I would not even see it as particularly underhanded, after all the ability to get yourself useful contacts, establishing solid work relationships, networking efficiently, finding good mentors, IS a very valuable skill , which implies social savvy, ambition, strategical thinking, good communication skills , a personable demeanour etc. etc.
It IS a plus, and btw otherwise why do you think people would bother to network at all, if they did not mean to use their contacts at their advantage ?
He would have been disloyal and underhanded if he had put in a BAD word for you, like defaming your name, or just hinting that you are not good enough etc.- but if all he has done , in such a competitive environment, is playing the best cards he had at his disposal- why, what he was supposed to do in your opinion ? trying to fail ? Tryng to NOT get what he wanted ( and , was also qualifed to do )?
So, I am not very clear about your issue on this subject.
Also, I don't understand why, if you did not want the bad horrible job, you did not just tell him " gee, thank you, Bob, it's nice of you thinking of me for this job, but to tell you the truth I do not want that kind of job, it's totally not for me, not what enjoy doing, and not what I want to focus my energies on. So, thanks but definitely no thanks ".
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