A
female
age
36-40,
*odelCitizen
writes:Hi everyone. Ok so I've been with my boyfriend for 4 years and recently he asked me to move in with him. I told him I wasn't sure because he spends most of his time with his friends and I don't want to move in to basically live myself (I've posted about this before).When I explained this to him, he told me he would make much more of an effort to see me more often and build a closer connection which I feel has been lacking recently. So far he has been doing this, but he's also started acting really distant. It's as if he's mad at me although he denies it.I know he was really hurt about me saying no to moving in, but he has really made an effort to take what I said on board. But now when I'm with him I feel he's really distracted and less affectionate.I don't know if maybe he's still upset I turned him down or if he maybe thinks this is the beginning of the end? He says there is nothing wrong and I've not pushed the matter, but I can really feel his distance.Can anyone think why this may be? Thanks! Reply to this Question
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reader, anonymous, writes (10 September 2013): I think the two of you will work it out as I said before.
I do believe you, when you say you're willing to wait about marriage.
I think you want to see signs that the commitment will evolve into something you consider heading to the next level. Moving-in together, is a major step for a guy.
It means he is ready to forsake all other women. He is willing to experiment and see how it feels to share life
with his partner. It doesn't mean he will not adjust a few other things to make it a success.
Trust is the issue here.
There is no such thing as a Peter Pan mode. Men do cling dearly to their freedom and they also weight the pros and cons, as they should; before heading into a commitment which is basically a threshold to marriage.
I read posts over two or three times prior to responding. I try not to miss the true tone or nature of the message.
" I wouldn't move in because I don't think we are both on the same page in terms of our level of commitment at the moment. I'm happy to carry on living apart right now and for the foreseeable future until he wants a more committed relationship, but he's not happy with that."
Not being able to foresee the future, you "presumed" he wouldn't commit enough; because by your opinion he spends too much time with friends and not enough with you. This is dismissing the fact that people tend to adapt to their environment, and changes in circumstances. You prejudged the situation based on things as they stand while living apart.
I am not arguing anyone's point on this issue. You asked why he is being distant. You know in your heart why.
I maintain the position that men are capable of commitment to any degree women are. They are more logical than emotional when it comes to the decisions of changing the dynamic of a relationship. I do take offense to the presumption that men are "childish" and can't commit; because I know that isn't true.
We don't rush to the alter, or force relationships faster than they can naturally evolve, to ease "insecurities."
If you feel we're childish, you're prone to believe we can't make adult decisions. Not true.
We don't need ultimatums, or prejudices, to control or manipulate us to please a partner.
No more than a partner should be manipulated or forced to move in, when she isn't ready.
A
female
reader, Tisha-1  +, writes (10 September 2013):
 I can see your frustration and your confusion over his reaction. I would have the same concerns. He does seem to want to spend more time with the guys than with you. And the really frustrating part is that he doesn't WANT to set aside special time for you as well.
At some point in the future (assuming they aren't all trapped in Peter Pan mode) his friends will start to make their own domestic arrangements, they'll get married, move in with girlfriends, and start to have children. They're not going to be spending their spare time drinking beer with their buddies, they're going to be changing nappies or doing DIY makeovers of their new flats.
I expect on some level he is aware of that and is holding on to those single male friendships for dear life because it's not going to last forever. Maybe one or two might not wind up in happy family households but the group dynamics are going to change.
He's hanging on to that with both hands.
On the other hand, he has you, and he loves you too. He wouldn't have suggested you move in with him if he didn't care about you and feel that you could live together. That's a big move.
So maybe he is feeling very rejected by your 'no, not right now' response to what he thought was the logical solution to your disillusionment with the status quo.
You wanted prime time with him. He offered cohabitation in response.
So, a friend of mine was with a woman for a couple of years, they were actually roommates who started dating, and she just simply expected him to be ready for the next move, which of course was marriage. He did propose but it was obvious he was just going through the motions. They got to the point that they wound up in couples counseling, where the therapist made them read a book which I post on my profile, A Fine Romance by Judith Sills, PhD.
They split up, he calls that book the book that saved his life, she understandably called it the book from hell that ruined hers.
You are at one of those turning points in your relationship. Maybe his distance from you is his way of percolating the new 'normal.' Maybe he's just hoping that you will eventually just move in and 'fix' the 'problem.'
If I were you, I'd go buy that book and read it cover to cover. Then I'd apply what I learned from that book to the relationship.
I did just that, when it was time for my LDR to either become local or over. It helped me immeasurably.
I would continue to talk to him but not every day about the situation. I would try to understand his point of view while doing my very best to convey my valid concerns about the relationship.
You're in the UK, I believe there's an organization called Relate that offers couples counseling (not for free alas). Have you ever considered trying couples counseling? It may not save the relationship but it will clarify and crystallize the situation to the extent that you can make decisions based on good communication and mutual understanding.
For what it's worth, I think your concerns are valid. He has become distant and maybe he just needs some time to process the new information he now has about you. To wit, you will need more convincing to move in and he's just not sure he's really ready to put in that time commitment.
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reader, ModelCitizen +, writes (10 September 2013):
ModelCitizen is verified as being by the original poster of the questionOk this is my last post on this because I don't think we will ever agree on this. However before I go I'd just like to ask you what you think I should have done differently? HE asked ME to move in with him. I said no due to the fact I don't think our relationship is at that stage yet. He asked what I needed to feel we were 'there' and I told him my concerns - to sum up, we lead very separate lives at the moment. He said he is ready now, he wants us to move in and be closer and all that stuff, yet he starts acting distant which confuses me. I don't want marriage right now. In fact, if he asked I'd say no because these issues would still be there. HE is the one who wanted to move things along. I do too eventually, but I feel we have a way to go before we reach that stage. At no point have I tried to scam him, or trick him, or pressure him into doing anything.So what should I have done in your opinion? Move in without raising my concerns? Dump him because we're not compatible? I'm genuinely confused as to why you think he can 'see through my plan' when I didn't instigate any of this! Yes, him asking me to move in was as a result of me asking him to spend more time with me, but I had no idea he would do that. I was hoping he'd agree to spend every second Sunday together or something, you know - compromise. It certainly wasn't part of some master plan to get a proposal!
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reader, anonymous, writes (10 September 2013): I think I summed it up in my posts. You say commitment. If you call him your boyfriend, you have commitment. You want a marriage proposal. How about just being straightforward and maybe you'll see where it's going.
I don't believe he prioritizes his male friends. I think that is being said for the sake of argument. I think he's dragging his feet about marriage. I don't think being a man "he's clueless." He's not going to marry you until he's ready. No veiled approach is going to push him into it.
Men are not stupid or foolish creatures with a neurotic aversion to commitment.
Most carefully decide "when" they want to make a "life-long" commitment; and with whom they'll take that step.
So live apart until you come apart.
Marriage should be a commitment both people want at the same time. This is the deal behind it all. Just be honest about it. Hidden agendas won't get you to the alter any faster.
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reader, ModelCitizen +, writes (10 September 2013):
ModelCitizen is verified as being by the original poster of the questionI am leaving him with a choice! I told him I wouldn't move in because I don't think we are both on the same page in terms of our level of commitment at the moment. I'm happy to carry on living apart right now and for the foreseeable future until he wants a more committed relationship, but he's not happy with that. He wants me to move in right now. He is the one who promised to give me everything I want right away, but now he's acting mad at me because of it! I'm not forcing him to do anything, I'm saying I'm not happy enough with the level of commitment I have with him now to take that step with him yet.
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reader, anonymous, writes (10 September 2013): Well, I guess he is beginning to see it your way; because he knows you leave him no choice.
That explains why he has been distant. I know when I see evidence of one party trying to domesticate the other. He can see through your plan. He knows you better than I.
I wish you both good luck.
I always hope for a happy-ending.
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reader, ModelCitizen +, writes (10 September 2013):
ModelCitizen is verified as being by the original poster of the questionHi again and thanks for your reply. While I do understand that it's all about give and take, I really disagree with you when you say it will be better when we share a living space. In fact this is the crux of my argument. At the moment we see each other one or two nights during the week, and recently I'd average every second Saturday night. The time we spend together during the week isn't quality time in my opinion. It's an hour per night max, and is the time when he's making his dinner and I'm winding down before bed. The most we ever do is sit on the couch watching tv or talk about our days for half an hour. He's known I feel like this for a while, so he thinks the solution is for us to live together because we will see each other every weeknight. But nothing much will change because that's how it is now, only multiplied by a few more days. It's still the same poor quality time to me.I might be being selfish, but I want some of the quality time that, at the moment, he saves almost exclusively for his friends. I don't want to stop him having a social life, but I feel I should at least be a big part of it. You say it's 'natural' that he wants to spend his free time with the guys, but I think he should want to spend half of that time with me too. Or else what's the point in being in a relationship? To watch him eat dinner during the week and then meet him at bedtime on Thursday, Friday and Sunday night when he gets back from the pub a bit drunk? That is not enough for me, I see my roommates more than that and we're not that close.Maybe you disagree and think I'm being selfish or demanding, but the fact is I'm lonely in this relationship and if I feel like that now then it will be worse if we move in together won't it? I do love him but I don't feel important to him, and I think it will actually get worse if we do move in.
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reader, anonymous, writes (10 September 2013): It can be fixed and you both will come up with a solution.
When people care about each other and want something to work, they'll find a way.
I mentioned in my first post that it's give and take. When you have full lives, schedules will not match. I'm glad you do have a full life of your own; so many young women rely on their relationships to fill in all the gaps, and they don't really find themselves. It's all about him.
Now that I have a few facts about you both, I can offer you better advice. I think he took on the extra gigs to make the extra money. As for seeing his friends on weekends; that is the only time he gets out. So naturally he'll spend it with the guys. When and if you do move in, you'll have more time together; because there is less going back and forth. You'll share the same living space.
No one likes being rejected; but you should move at your pace and you had your reasons. However; you used a little emotional black-mail.
He had plans and might have been really psyched about having you move in. It was a let-down when you didn't seem as excited about it as he was.
He also felt you pulled the card about not spending enough time with you, and he should spend less time with his friends. I still say that wasn't fair. You assumed he couldn't think to change on his own; you had to place a stipulation on his time, and put his back to the wall.
So, your "no" wasn't as clean as you're trying to make it sound in your post below. It was a slap in the face. You can't see it; because you don't want to. I do. So does he.
It will work out; because you both love each other. He doesn't feel you should call all the shots. You regulate your schedule according to your needs. You have to be flexible about him doing the same. I mentioned you're trying to tip the scale. He is intelligent enough to see where things are going. So he will pull back, and that will level the scale once more.
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reader, ModelCitizen +, writes (10 September 2013):
ModelCitizen is verified as being by the original poster of the questionHi it's the OP. Thanks very much for taking the time to reply, your answers have given me a lot to think about.Just to answer some of Wise's questions, I'm not a loner or a homebody at all. I have a good group of girlfriends who I see regularly, during the week and for nights out, plus I have a close relationship with my 2 sisters who I also see a lot. I also participate in ladies krav maga classes, ballet classes (one of each per week) and I'm studying for a post graduate degree via distance learning in addition to working full time. So I have a very full life myself.I'd never want him to stop seeing his friends, just as I wouldn't do with mine, but at the moment I feel the balance is all off. He works late every weeknight (up to 10pm - he teaches guitar from home so the hours have to suit the clients), so if I see him during the week it's for an hour or two before I go to bed. He also works a Saturday during the day every week, and usually spends Sunday in the pub with his mates. He also goes out drinking with them on a Thursday and either a Friday or Saturday night, meaning I get one weekend night with him max.Even then, we sometimes go for dinner and he wants to go to the pub after and meet his friends again. I can either tag along or he will go himself (not exactly how date night should work in my opinion). I do go out with my own friends too, maybe every couple of weeks, but he is still at the drinking three nights at the weekend stage. Maybe it's a case of different life stages with us?I guess I feel his friends get all the quality time just now, and I don't want to move in with the idea that seeing each other for 2 hours every weeknight is enough. I feel it will be more like sex, tv then sleep because it's too late to do anything else (I'm up at 6.30am every day for work).I don't know, maybe it's just that our schedules don't fit? Deep down I feel its more than that though - since I told him how I feel he's made a lot more effort in some ways, but in others got worse (ie he's joined a wedding band who play gigs at the weekend??) I feel he is trying to punish me in some way for hurting him by saying I won't move in? I mean I said 'not right now' as opposed to an outright 'no' but I do know he felt rejected (he told me).I just don't know how to fix it, or even if it can be fixed?
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reader, anonymous, writes (10 September 2013): It's important that when you make decisions like moving in with someone it's done with no reservations. Everyone has to be on the same page. You should both be content under the same roof.
First of all, if he was being mature; he would respect your reasoning; without pouting like a spoiled little boy. It's give and take, if he insists you move in. It shouldn't be entirely on his terms; nor should the scale have to tip in your favor. He invited you. Not the other way around.
You explained why you had reservations. He compromised; but his compromise came with strings attached, apparently. He may have only agreed to your terms to bribe you into moving in. You obviously could see through that.
I'd like to know what type of activities do he and his friends participate? How much time does he get to spend with his friends, in return for spending more time at home with you?
Are you a socially-active person, or a homebody? Do you have your own circle of friends; and get out of the house to keep an active social-life, and a good network of your own friends?
FAIR WARNING:
Isolation will smother your relationship to-death.
What will you both be doing at home? Do you keep in shape, and get plenty of exercise? Do you get along with his friends? Does he get along with yours? Do you like to entertain at home? How much of his time is enough time for you? A third, half, three quarters? All of it?
I asked a lot of questions; because maybe I didn't participate the last time you posted. I know that there are a lot of relationships where one partner likes to sit home and be cozy, and snuggle; the other may like getting out with friends and doing things. Usually on weekends.
It is my experience that the more active partner will eventually give in to appease the less socially active partner. The result is, the homebody becomes clingy and reclusive. The other becomes distant and bored. Some people are naturally extroverted. They're affinity to nightlife and an outgoing personality, is perceived as excessive partying and adolescent behavior.
The truth is, they need activity for stimulation. They have to be out and about to burn off nervous energy, and to relieve stress. Homebodies tend to center all their attention on the relationship. They want to be romantic and lovey-dovey. That translates to entrapment and isolation to an extrovert, like your boyfriend.
I hope your exchange is balanced and well-compromised. I've seen couples breakup when one tries too hard to tame the other to their life-style. What you may see as childish and irresponsible behavior, may be his way of staying sane. He needs to share fun and camaraderie in his life. He needs an escape from reality, in order to fully function. That's his psychological makeup as a person. You're different.
You're easy-going, practical, possibly a loner, and settled. You focus on being a couple; and feel friends are distractions and intrude on your time together. You don't seem to care much for sharing your time with groups of people. You only like to focus your time and energy on him.
You like peace and quiet. You're more domesticated.
This all translates to:
You want to be married, settle down, and have kids. You'll pretend you want to wait. That's your tactic of not scaring him. You want it yesterday; but trying be a little sneaky about it. He can see through that.
He will yield to your negotiated terms; but it will take him time to dial down his hyperactivity. He will not be happy, and you will be miserable watching him agonizing in the peace and quiet. You are trying to rewrite his genetic code by refusing to move in. It's going to backfire. He'll
squirm and dither like a hyperactive kid on time-out.
You are both going to be incompatible as housemates. You made a good decision to not to move in yet. You want signs of marriage in the horizon; before you waste your time getting used to living together. You want a ring on it.
He may be considering all the same things; but as males go, he's dragging his feet in fear of giving up all that he loves. That includes time with his friends. You consider that boyish. That isn't a fair analysis. He loves his friends too.
Your relationship worked for four years; because you both have the freedom to live according to your personality types, and came together as a couple for those things you do share in common. You are ushering the relationship into quiet domestic solitude. He doesn't want to give up his carefree bachelor life-style; but wants his lady at his side.
He wants a live-in girlfriend, and you want a husband.
Don't move in until he wants what you want. He may be having second thoughts. Did I neglect to say you are highly intuitive? So am I.
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reader, janniepeg  +, writes (10 September 2013):
 Well, that's the exact reason you shouldn't move in with him. Although maybe he is feeling manipulated into changing, and men don't like women changing them. You don't love who he is now. I don't blame you, who loves a man who prioritizes his male friends?
I will interpret his distance as him not wanting to put effort. Connection should be natural. He feels that it is too much effort and is weighing the pros and cons.
On the other hand, he could be thinking that living with you is the solution to the lack of time together. When you hesitated about the idea he was at a loss. Like whatever he does can't make you happy. Sleeping together and quickie sex can not count as quality time.
Maybe being a man he is clueless, thinking "I am willing live with a woman, what more can she ask for? Can't she just at least appreciate this offer? Why can't she see that I love her? Why does she have to be so demanding?"
Your refusal to live with him could be just as painful as a rejection to a marriage proposal. After all, he is a man and thinks like a man. He could not understand the importance of emotional connection. You are asking him to do something unnatural to him. As boys growing up they were never taught to bond and nurture others. He's 26? Yes, this is something that an older man would understand and the reason why many young women love older guys.
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