A
male
age
30-35,
*much4u
writes:What is it with me and helicopter girlfriends? Why do I seem to attract them most? Why can't I let them go gently without it always ending with me making a new enemy and coming off as a douche at the end?Whenever I meet/date a girl who gives me 10% of her attention I get uninterested, on the other hand if a girl gives me 110% and they expect the same in return then I feel creeped out and caged. I never seem to meet a woman who falls in the middle of the spectrum its either one extreme or the other.In my time I have had quite a bit of helicopter gfs. I don't know if it's because I keep missing or semi-consciously ignoring or dismissing the early red flags and warning signs or they just appear late. I am the type of guy who has a life outside of my intimate relationships. I am involved in sports in my local community. I am a board member of my church community. And I have a decent amount of social lads I've built up whether through gaming or fantasy sports etc. That being said I don't allow these activities to dominate my life. However these girls I end up with usually lack anything outside of their intimate relationship. A regular day for them would be wake up in bed, exchange pleasantries with them and they expect us to carry on in CONSTANT COMMUNICATION round the clock. Don't hear from me in an hour and I get somewhere between 5-23 missed calls (not making this up). If I don't reply quickly enough they question 'what were you doing?'. SO yes I have to tell them that I was in the shitter or taking a shower etc. If I go to the court to shoot hoops 3 days a week I get the 'hmmmph, yeah that's what important in your life'. On a phone call and they hear me typing on my laptop they question who I am messaging and if I say a friend or coworker they request names and subtly suggest that I have something going on. I think you guys get the picture by now.So: 1) How do I communicate how I feel to a woman without coming off as a jerk? 2) How do I avoid these types of women in future? Is it something about my personality? (I am a cool, easy to talk to, humorous/jovial, polite kind of guy btw) 3) What early warning signs are there?
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male
reader, Serpico +, writes (8 July 2016):
Chi -
I appreciate the response and if I could follow/clarify a bit.
First, IMO a very common mistake that is made regarding male/female relationships is to make the very erroneous assumption that men and women are exactly alike in their sexual preferences, attractions, and mating strategies. We are not, and IMO we are more different than we are alike. Taking this to your point on you have never asked a man about his sexual past, I propose that if instead you found that the man you are getting serious with was married say seven times in six years - would that be a red flag for you? I bring this up specifically because women care less about N because they are the gatekeepers of sex. Men are the gatekeepers of commitment. Again, we are different, and more different than we are alike.
Regarding data collection itself - who you marry is by far the most important decision you will ever make regarding your own happiness by a country mile. When you get a mortgage here in the US, they want to know EVERYTHING financially about you. Tax returns, bank accounts, spending history, credit scores, check stubs, debt ratios, etc, etc, etc. There is a reason for this - they dont want to get burned by a bad investment. I see no reason this shouldnt be extrapolated to dating, and especially marriage. Marriage by definition is an exclusive sexual relationship - why someone wouldnt want to have full due diligence of sexual past before making such an important decision/investment is absolutely completely beyond me. But Im not just singling out sexual past here - if you are thinking about marrying someone, IMO you have every right to every piece of information about them. You are buying their whole past with them - you have every right to know about it. IMO, if more people did this level of due diligence, divorce rates would be MUCH lower.
Last, I dont want to seem like Im picking on you here, but since you kindly offered up the info, your daddy issues coupled with your high N is of no surprise to me, in fact its exactly what I expect given my empirical data. Im no psychologist, but my guess is when a girl doesnt learn to form a stable relationship with a strong male figure early in her life, it often presents problems forming them later. JMHO.
A
reader, anonymous, writes (8 July 2016): Alright, I'll take a different approach. I read your post and paused awhile before writing. I was able to construe something about your personality; and the reason why you "attract" a certain type, and why things usually end they way they do.
I think a lot of who you date hinges on her looks and how easy she is to ask out. If she's cute, you feel you can deal with her quirks. Most young straight-guys think this way. That means you're thinking with your penis, and not using your brain. You don't want to attach emotion and fear intimacy. Keep it casual with lots of gratuitous sex.
You have to understand that women in your age-group are trying to find their first established and lasting relationship. You have a lot going for you. You're active, ambitious, young, and full of potential. So remember the ladies in your age-group haven't completely outgrown bride fantasies from their schoolgirl years. They mainly have fantasy to go on, and very little experience. They may be very astute and well-educated; but they don't know how to deal with the let-downs of the foolish choices they've made among the guys they've dated over time. They rarely learn, because they become overcome with frustration and insecurity. Paralyzed from disappointment when reality sets in. They also have all sorts of twisted perceptions and warped notions about guys and how we think. They envy our male-prowess and resent our cockiness towards commitment. They call themselves laying down the law, and not taking the shit they took before. They can't see their own faults for being victims.
So they're all practicing on you. In turn, all you see is their cuteness. Overlooking the incompatibilities. Your view of women is condescending. You don't notice women more serious, because you are afraid of them. You avoid them, because they'll outsmart you. You can't easily bullshit them. You need an edge over them; so a pretty ditsy girl is more appealing than a serious ambitious goal-oriented chick, with a mind of her own. You've been avoiding them. You prefer less threatening types. But there's a price.
Eye-candy is superficial and you can't overlook what lies beneath the surface.
You figure ladies with something on the ball might trap and control you; so you go for the girlie-girl types. They look good in tight short skirts and heels; but as time wears on, you can't deal with the ditsiness that attracted you to them in the first place. So you've coined them "helicopter girlfriends." You're not attracting them to you. They're the type you look for. They're easier to find than the more structured put together types; who are independent and take less crap from males. They'll steal your heart, and punt it like a football when you screw-up too many times. They don't forgive stupidity and bullshit as easily as the ditsy types.
So, now it's time to become more mature; and look for ladies with her own self-awareness. Females who don't need your validation and reassurance, and can hustle her own game without having time to hover over your life. Date for fun and recreation, but don't be afraid of girls who discuss their professional goals; or like to play sports. They're not competing with you, they just don't fit girlie stereotypes; but they are feminine all the same. They are supportive; yet they will move on, if they don't see things going in the right direction. You won't always get to decide who goes, or who stays.
Can you handle a real woman?
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A
female
reader, chigirl  +, writes (7 July 2016):
 I want to reply to what Serpico wrote. I think his advice surely is a bit on the edge, but this is also a valid personal experience, and if it's worked for him then sure, give it a try. However, I do not think point number 2 is valid. I've had 5 LTR so far in my life, and I never specifically asked a guy his number (I find that tacky), but I have a fair idea of whether it was high or low. My crazy bf's had no correlation with who had the highest number. And the one who did in fact kiss someone else while we were in a relationship, well he inly had one girl prior to me. So cheating is not equal to number. It's a personality thing, I think. Also, my number is high, and I never cheated.
I do have daddy issues though. I would hate to blame THAT for being the cause of my failed relationships, but I think there's a point to asking anyway. Although, I would put much more emphasis on the way the girl has handled the relationship with her dad, rather than just ditch her if the answer is anything but "splendid". I actually have the experience with men about their mothers. It's the same thing as girls and their fathers. And a "splendid" relationship meant an overbearing and obsessive mother who wouldn't stop babying her son and interfering with the relationship. Ultimately causing it to end. So I'd be cautious of "splendid".
A history of mental illness IS something to be vary of, but that's not something deemed acceptable to ask about on a date. I actually DID ask my last bf about his history with depression/mental illness, and he played it down and said he didn't have it. I was cautious because of another ex who tried to kill himself. SO, I ASK ABOUT IT, even if it's deemed inappropriate. Turns out, my new bf told me a white lie about not having mental problems, he's got both history with depression and severe anxiety. Which Im not equipped to handle, and caused a problem in the relationship. People just don't come clean about this in the early stages of dating, so do be cautious. Asking about family history could be a smooth way to hear if there's any disturbances.
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A
female
reader, Andie's Thoughts  +, writes (7 July 2016):
 I have problems with my dad because he was emotionally abusive. That was his decision, not mine, so don't automatically judge a woman on how she gets on with her father. Some parents are crappy ones - it happens.
Make sure you're *daying* for a few weeks before becoming official. Get to know them and their lifestyles, talk about your personal goals and theirs, what they want out of a relationship, etc. By doing that, you'll know if they have too much time available and if they want a clingy relationship or a balanced one.
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A
male
reader, Xearo  +, writes (7 July 2016):
It is really not that difficult to find out what a girl is about in her life in the first 1 or 2 days of talking to her. You should be trying to date a lady who is also active in her life. There are many ladies like this but they don't have the time to make themselves as available as females with too much time on their hands which would be a valid issue but this is not the case. It is also very possible you are focusing on ladies who only offer "good looks" to the table.
Those girls are just doing what they think should be the norm. And truth be told, many guys do drop their lives for these girls. This stems from insecurity and jealously on their part (considering their lives are just as empty as their minds). But you can also set the pace of your own relationship.. you don't need to wait for them.
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A
female
reader, chigirl +, writes (7 July 2016):
I don't know what a helicopter girlfriend is, but I do know what a controlling and insecure girl is. Seems to me like you are picking the wrong women for you, because you let your ego decide. You go for these strange women who behave oddly and have no life and who live to call you and control you and know what you are doing every 5 minutes. Instead, perhaps you need to stop being to scared of having a relationship with a different type of girl. You say you lose interest if they are only 10% into you, and scared if they are 100% into you (there is no 110%, 100% = everything/completely). But who then are these women who you are dating who are controlling and calling you constantly? Are they the 10% interested ones, or the 100% interested ones? Or are they the few ones you've met in the middle?
You need to clarify this.
And then you need to stop repeating the same mistake over and over, thinking you will have a different outcome each time. You've developed a type, that's what's happened, and so YOU are the reason why you only end up with these nutjobs. They are the ones you pursue, they are the ones who pleases your ego the most. Stop going for your typical type, and try to develop a relationship with a different type of girl next. So what if she's giving you 10%, if you barely know each other, you need to give it more time to develop. And if she's giving you 100%, maybe that's just you not being mature enough to handle such openness and confusing attraction/interest with obsession, because you're not used to it. But just because someone appears to be really interested in you, doesn't mean they actually are 100% into you. It could be that they are just polite right then and there, and that you are reading the signals wrong.
I think, at your age, you aren't mature enough to know whether or not someone is genuine about you. This comes with experience. So try not to assume anything when meeting a new person, and take your time in getting to know them. If a girl starts to behave the way you describe, just tell her that while you liked her, this is not the form of relationship you are looking for. Her not wanting to talk to you after wards doesn't mean you are a dick or that you did anything wrong. But exes tend to not want to be friends, and that's just part of life.
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A
male
reader, Denizen +, writes (7 July 2016):
 To my mind you are over thinking this. You can't change who you are, and only experience will make you wiser about your choices. That's why people go on dates - to see if they like each other and are compatible.
When letting go of someone be as gentle as possible. Explain as unemotionally as possible why it isn't working for you. Don't draw it out. but be kind.
As you are a church goer perhaps someone in that community could be most suited to you. Just a thought.
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A
male
reader, Serpico +, writes (7 July 2016):
As with many of my responses, this is not going to be popular here, but it will be honest.My guess is your screening process is faulty. I am 48 now, and whenever I give advice about these matters to younger guys, its as follows.1 - First question to ask, no exceptions. Just slip it in during idle conversation on your first date. "How do you get along with your father?" If the answer is anything but spectacular, get out of there, FAST. Do not pass Go, do not collect $200. Get out of there. Do not contact her again in any way, and do not take her correspondence. This is by far the best predictor I have ever found in determining the LTR potential of a woman.2 - This is very often related to 1 above, but as early as you can, find out her N count. I know this going to be wildly unpopular here, but again, I have to report the truth. Looking at my own experience I have had six LTRs in my life, and Im 48 now. I did heavy due diligence on all of them and these are what I believe their numbers to be and their ages at the time -18 yrs. n=235 yrs. n=526 yrs n=424 yrs n=1022 yrs n=131 yrs n=2Can any of you guess which one of these turned out to be BY FAR the biggest mistake of the lot?Eg - of the lot, there was only one single one who I was certain:Cheated on meLied to me consistentlyTried to cover up a pre-existing STDHad daddy issues (my fault for not recognizing earlier)I know this is only a small sample size, but by the same token the chances of this happening by pure randomness is very small. All of the others? No problems with any of them, and the last one is my current wife. Save the one outlier, I would still take any of their calls if they buzzed.
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