A
male
age
51-59,
*eedpeaceofmind
writes:Once again, my retroactive jealousy/OCD has overtaken me and I am on the brink of separation from my wife of 14 years(i can't blame her she has had enough abuse! She is fed up and repulsed by me talking about the past- Over n over n over etc..which ironically was not bad even by todays standards). I have been dealing with this behavior for 20 years (even before her) and over the last 6 months I researched, studied,read and devoured everything "out there" pertaining to retroactive jealousy and it's etiology in biological sexual obsession to the point of exhaustion. I have read DC extensively and focused on the tremendous insights YOS has admirably contributed to this topic...and I followed his and others advice....I even began seeing a psychologist weekly and began taking an SSRI med....and for a few months it seemed to get better ....but it only seemed that way. I need more help / insight because I can only minimally be able to stop the triggers which seem to be every little thing . I think I am losing my mind because of the dichotomy of this affliction- on the one side of my brain- I know- I mean I know without a doubt that the relationship my wife had before me 15 years ago!!! ( I feel like an idiot even writing that but "knowing" that is not enough) was just a part of her life and of course sex was a natural part of that- but on the other"darker side" of my brain I can't stand the thought of her pleasuring another man on her on free will and actually truelly enjoying it. It is a cancer that invades my every thought...for example if she is tired and wants to just sleep my mind goes to that crazy place that says" well I bet you never said that to him, I bet you did whatever he wanted, whenever he wanted and enjoyed it ....he more than you enjoy it with me and on and on the sickness rolls but it doesn't stop ....I will think about it for day's on end!! Until I am mentally, physically and spiritually drained ..meanwhile I have to work n function in society during this time..very difficult. I don't know what to do anymore.....my wife is a good person in everyway - she works hard, is totally faithful, a good mom but my insanity is making her hate me which leads to no emotional connection with me ( how can she when i bring up how much she enjoyed giving him BJ's etc to her old boyfriend) which leads to no intimacy( of course...my behavior is totally revolting.. Even to me) which fuels my retroactive jealousy into a fiery inferno where I become this comatose psychopath. She is so tired of this and "told me that she can't live in fear of when I will bring it up for no reason". I can't blame her for feeling this way b/c it's 100% the truth..i am actually leaning towards seperation so she can move on with her life and find a normal guy who isn't torturing her with this shit - she deserves such a man. Even If we separate and divorce - I will still have the problem because it is my sickness- not hers - and I know it will be transferred to the next poor victim if I happen to fall in love again.. I have come to the realization that in my own past when I was single and involved in causal sex/ open relationships- I honestly never suffered from this.?..( only in committed relationships do I 100% of time behave this way)...in fact I fancied the idea of casual sex for both partners...in retrospect i see that it enabled me to act like the stud I so happily wanted others to see me as (stroking my own male ego) and in fact this behavior actually attracted many woman to me.( I was a bartender at a night club for 7 years)..another very strange dichotomy in my mind( sexually rewarding the scumbag male that I was..lying, deceiving, manipulating! Not giving a shit..Except for getting laid. etc) I have tried medication, therapy, meditation, weightlifting ( which helps b/c I don't think about it during this) running, cooking, just trying to be busy every waking minute......please if there is someone out there who can relate to this rather long post and provide insight I would be grateful ( and yes I know I need to be grateful for all that I still have but it is quickly slipping away). I will listen to all comments..even the moral judgements against me because I may learn something helpful from them too! Thank you in advance
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male
reader, cubehead01  +, writes (16 October 2015):
This is an amazing post that helped me greatly. The most insightful information I've found about the topic.
https://www.reddit.com/r/OCD/comments/3oyh06/beat_retroactive_jealousy_top_tips_and_resources/
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reader, anonymous, writes (17 August 2014): Thank you for your entry and thank you for the responses. I thought I was the only one who deals with retroactive jealousy, never heard of it before reading this post. This describes me and knowing I'm not the only one makes me feel a lot better. For me I have a very limited past, 1st base with one girl. My wife of 15 years has a limited past as well, 2nd base with a couple of guys. Yet before we married I quizzed her constantly, it hurt her yet this OCD is hard because my mind doesn't stop. I find engaging my mind with other things is helpful and I forget about my past and her past. Yet it comes up and I have to rethink all her past answers to "calm me down", I'm not mad, just jealous. This is not the only thing I'm jealous about. Much of my thinking has to do with my past and how I'm "missing out" Reassurance is something I need, another sign of OCD. I'm a functioning adult yet this struggle is very difficult for me. I'm not sure if this helps who started this post but knowing you are not alone means a lot.
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reader, Serpico +, writes (28 March 2012):
I can sympathize with your problem - I have suffered many of the same thoughts you have. What I can tell you -1) You are not alone. Before the internet, I thought I was the only psycho in the world with this crap. There are many who experience it to one degree or another.2) In itself, it is not a "defect" or a "disease." RJ is nothing more than an evolutionary relic of the statement "Mamas baby, daddys maybe." However, like the constant fight/flight response being triggered under work stress, many evolutionary relics are quite inconvenient in the modern world.3) If its any consolation, I fully understand the torture you are putting yourself through. Its almost masochistic in a sense that you are actually seeking more pain by bringing it up over and over again. You know it going to be painful (for both of you), you know you arent going to fell better, yet your mind seeks to do it over and over. It sucks big time, Ive been there, and you have my sympathy.4) This thing is so powerful in some men (it was in me) that depending upon the situation, my recommendation is to bug out and find someone with a past that you can handle. Honestly, I have found in many cases its a fight not worth fighting. Given you have a wife of many year, in this case I would not suggest this as a course of action.5) I have a gf (now fiancee) that I went through this with. As pathetic as it sounds, her deal was just a one time thing. That in itself helped me get passed it. (I often hear stories from guys about their gf/wives with like 30 guys before them. I would not even try to deal with something like that.) 6) What made me get over it? One was my gf being very supportive during it. Another was my mind was actually getting tired of going there. I wonder if from going there so often the "thrill" for lack of a better word started to wear off, like how a drug loses its effectiveness the more its taken. Is it ever totally gone? No. Can I push it out pretty easily now compared to two years ago? Most definitelly. The girl I have now was most definitely worth the effort. IMO some are not. Its up to you to choose.Best of luck to you.
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reader, anonymous, writes (11 February 2012): I've had some of the same issues. There were times I got so tired of trying to fight it, I just gave in and basically walked around like a zombie for days thinking about my wife having fun with an ex.I don't think there really is a complete "solution" for this, but I do know it's possible to let it go to a large degree.For me, I started to realize that I was trying make the past not be reality by thinking about it. I wanted to somehow make the past go away. I wanted someone to tell me it hadn't really happened. I've come to realize that a lot of my obsessive thinking is based on an unstated belief that thinking about something will change it. But, of course it doesn't. We don't have control over past events. Thinking about it changes nothing. It's just as effective as curling up on the floor and sucking your thumb. Try to figure out a way to step outside yourself and look at your thoughts and feelings from another person's perspective. It seems to come down to acceptance of things in life I don't like. I have not personally been able to get to a point where I'm perfectly OK with images in my mind about my wife's past. But, I just try to accept it and move on. To a certain extent, I just got tired of thinking about it after awhile. It becomes tedious once you realize there is no answer or solution. Another aspect of this that seems to be difficult is that even though the images in your mind are not themselves reality, it does trigger intense emotions. This emotional response seems to make the thought seem more real.One thing that made a difference for me was that I had brought up my retroactive jealousy in counseling. My wife started to talking about how much it hurt her, and she started crying. For some reason she had apprently not been completely comfortable telling me how much it hurt her, but she was able to express this in counseling. It really bothered me to see how much it hurt her. It helped me see my own behavior more objectively, and I just decided "this is really bad, I just can't do this. This is just unacceptable behavior". I realized that what I was doing to my wife violated some of my own core beliefs about how I need to treat others. I do also know that for me it is in some way related to my view of my own value as a person. I really do not know why, but there is something about the thought that I might not measure up sexually that is very threatening or scary to me in terms of my self image. It's almost as if it's an exposed nerve at the core of my being. The slightest touch causes extreme pain.I wish I had something more to offer. I guess the best I can say is that you are not necessarily doomed to be this way forever. It can get better.
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reader, Miamine  +, writes (5 February 2012):
 Hi needpeaceofmind,First of all congratulations for understanding the link between Retroactive Jealousy and OCD.. It's an obsession and in my time here at DC I too have learned you can't just forget about it and let the past go.You have done everything that we would normally suggest. You've investigated Retroactive Jealousy, you've understand it's a mental obsession, you've got medical help, your on medication and you've identified your triggers and your working at changing your thoughts.Sigh.. that leaves, very little for us to recommend.Again your spot on for saying your own promiscuity and how you acted with women fuels the imagination about how men acted with her. She cannot change her past and neither can you.First, you haven't been dealing with this in a positive way for very long. It's only been 6months, and you said it was helping, but not fast enough for you. You must be more patient, you've been suffering like this for years. The therapy, the medication, the changing thoughts and behaviour, well that takes time, maybe years instead of months.You must ensure that your wife is aware of all the ways your trying to deal and cope with this. You must also make her aware that this is illness, that with time will get better. She needs hope to know that it's not more of the same abuse, but you are really trying to fix things, and again this will take her years to trust in you.Have you thought about cognitive therapy behaviour... very good at controlling unwanted thoughts. It doesn't bother to look back at the past or your history, it just tries to get you to think differently right now. It uses the "stop" method.. or gets you to challenge if your thoughts are really true... "she wouldn't sleep, she'd be having sex if I was someone else".... how could this be true, if she was always having sex and never slept, she would have been dead long before she met you. This obsessional behaviour likes to fool you by talking about "always, never, all, bigger, better" absolute statements.. which can't be true. As you can see they is easy to spot and challenge.Yoga and Buddhism will do the same.... Any religious guidance or spirituality will help.. no matter what she did you need to learn to accept her without judgement.... That's why I'm throwing in the religious thing. Meditating (that's why I mentioned Buddhism and yoga) allows you to learn to accept your thoughts without doing anything about it. (and no I'm not religious, I'm an atheist)Sorry this is long.... Buddhism says the brain is a monkey mind... always wanting something new to distract it. At the moment, your mind focuses on jealousy, and then you follow the jealous thoughts, then you react and do jealous things. But if you learn to wait, you will see, eventually the mind starts thinking about hotdogs, or the fact your itching or what you need to do tomorrow. The mind thinks many things, but without control we take things out of context, blow them up to more importance than they deserve and then follow our emotions and go out of control.If you catch the thoughts, and see the triggers, you can try to walk away.. go for a run or something, go bake a cake. Use distracting techniques for the thoughts and also to protect your wife from your abusive behaviour. Get a diary or a blank book and write down all the nasty words in there.This will take time.... your impatience to be cured is also an example of how you continue to let your emotions and unhelpful thoughts control you. Exercise and spirituality or religion is good for getting you to slow down and accept your limitations and accept others without judgement.Maybe separation for a while would be good. Maybe if you show your brain what life without her would be like, the shock and the grief would force it to behave better.Sorry it's so long... hope this helps a littleNearly forgot.. if your doing psychotherapy, it will look at your past and help you to understand it and shed light on why you do what you do. It will also help to heal any pain that may be hidden inside.CBT, Meditation, they work differently. They concentrate only on the present and what's happening now. I'm not sure the two approaches are compatible.Psychotherapy can help, but it can also keep you stuck in the past. CBT can help, but it may ignore deep wounds that your trying to avoid.Meditation is not suitable for everyone.. unfortunately can't remember if the depressed should avoid it, or the extremely agitated.
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reader, chigirl  +, writes (5 February 2012):
 "No disrespect meant to chigirl, but diabetes, anemia and multiple sclerosis are medical conditions. Obsessing and arguing about your wife’s sexual past is not. If it were medication would have cured it."
Mental illnesses ARE medical conditions. There is no cure for tons of conditions in the world, a medical condition isn't diagnosed by the ability to CURE it. A mental illness is an illness as much as cancer or diabetes. It just doesn't show on the outside, or has a physical response. There IS medicine for depression, and for bipolar personality disorder. But for many other things there is no cure, no "fix". When studying personality disorders and dealing with mental illnesses you learn this. It is very hard for others to accept it, because an illness you can not see is hard to believe in. And for many years now it's been taboo to have a mental illness. You're supposed to just "get a grip" and control yourself. But you can't.
It's one thing to obsess and argue and be a dickhead. It's another to be diagnosed with a mental illness. A diagnosis is something you put on medical conditions. You do not diagnose anyone with "being a dickhead". You diagnose them with OCD if they have OCD, and that diagnosis is for life, much like diabetes. While a dickhead can improve himself, a person with OCD will always have OCD, and will need to cope with that. Being diagnosed has become like being stamped because of the taboo of mental illnesses, but really I think being diagnosed helps you if you think about it the right way. With a diagnosis you are not excused, but you have an explanatory factor. And understanding yourself is key to knowing your limits, and what you should and should not do.
I would like to compare this to alcoholism, to underline my point. Alcoholism is also not about "getting a grip and stop it". It's an addiction, and it i stronger than the addiction to smoking. It controls the persons behaviour. If you have been an alcoholic you are one for life, even if you stopped drinking. A mental illness (some anyway) can work the same way. You are predisposed to react different to certain things. An alcoholic reacts differently to alcohol than a non-alcoholic. A person with OCD will react differently to things than a person without OCD. A recovering alcoholic can choose what conditions to live under. They can choose to go to a party where they know temptation will be, or they can choose to stay clear of anyone who drinks and any social setting where there is alcohol.
Same with you poster. You are recovering, and you can choose whether you will continue to put yourself in the place where your OCD and obsessiveness is triggered, or if you should remove yourself from that situation. You do not HAVE to "get over it". That's be like asking an alcoholic to "get over" being addicted and start to enjoy alcohol like other people do. They can't. You need to start thinking and doing the things you actually can do, and act within your limits. First hand I think you need to remove yourself from the situation that triggers your OCD and retroactive jealousy. Alcoholics do not "recover" by learning to be satisfied with one drink. They remove themselves from alcohol COMPLETELY. I think you need to do the same, poster. In order to heal you need to remove yourself completely from the things that you fixate on.
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reader, Ciar  +, writes (5 February 2012):
 Having been on both sides of the retroactive jealousy coin I appreciate the difficult position you AND your wife are in.I’ve responded to many, many posts from men and women about this but since women’s contributions to this topic seldom carry the same weight as men’s I’m not going to get into all again.I will say this. There is a big difference between owning your problem and berating yourself for it. The former empowers you while the latter feeds the negative self image that causes the jealousy in the first place. So stop doing it. Treat yourself with the same compassion and patience you would show someone else. No disrespect meant to chigirl, but diabetes, anemia and multiple sclerosis are medical conditions. Obsessing and arguing about your wife’s sexual past is not. If it were medication would have cured it.It may be that the root cause of your sexual envy/jealousy isn’t sexual at all, but that you are focussed on the sexual triggers because they are far more intense. The reason you enjoyed casual sex before is the same reason you suffer from retroactive jealousy now. You aren’t truly comfortable with non sexual intimacy so you shared a little of yourself with several people instead of a lot of yourself with very few. If your wife doesn't REALLY know you, you may fear she can't REALLY love you.Food for thought anyway.
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reader, chigirl +, writes (4 February 2012):
I think you need to seek more professional help as this is beyond your control. This is too much for you to deal with on your own, if you were able to get the behaviour and impulses under control by yourself then you'd have kept it under control for the last 20 years. But you weren't able to, which brings me back to getting professional help. Work with a psychologist. Continue going to treatment. It's a thing you need to do for life if necessary. Professional help isn't a "fixer" is a support system that will help you cope with things. "Help" you being the key. It wont fix anything, and it wont make you better. But it'll help you. And perhaps your goal shouldn't be to be free from your OCD and obsession, but rather get to a point where you aren't losing your mind over it.
If one psychologist doesn't work so well with you, see someone else. When you find the right psychologist you'll get further. The first one I went to at 17 was crap, and not someone I could communicate with at all. The next one I had at 19 was amazing to talk to and we got through a lot of things. I saw a third therapist at 24 which was also of great help. But the personality and character of your psychiatrist plays a huge part in how well your sessions go.
I think you need to at least separate from your wife if not divorce. For your sake as well as hers. She suffers by your behaviour, and at the same time there will NEVER be anything she can do to help you. You feel this way not because of her, but she has become the object of your obsession, and as such your mental health is dependent on what role she plays in your life. I think you will be able to work with your OCD and obsessive behaviour if you remove the problem you are facing. Over the years you've accumulated your obsession in her. Isn't that right? That tends to be the way obsessions work. They start of small, and then take over more and more and more. What used to be a small bump is now a mountain so tall you can't begin to hope getting over it.
Which is why you should divorce your wife. That way you remove the mountain you've built in your mind. And that way you can begin to work on your issues.
I want to jump ahead of some posters on here though, who I know dislike my advice and always say "women can't understand retroactive jealously" etc. It doesn't matter that I am a woman. Women have OCD's and obsessions too. And being a person who is prone to such thoughts I understand them very well. I know exactly what you mean, OP, when you describe how your obsession controls you. You "know" one thing, but your mind is taken over by irrational thoughts. You know these thoughts are just crap, but that doesn't change the power these thoughts have over you. They control how you feel, how you act, what you think. The obsession takes on a life of its own, out of your control.
" fuels my retroactive jealousy into a fiery inferno where I become this comatose psychopath" Your obsession is triggered by your wife. It's not her fault. It isn't really much your fault either, you have a mentality incapable of dealing with it. That is your obstacle. Self treatment is very very hard if your mind lacks the ability to control it's thoughts. Your condition is WORSENED by your wife's presence. Not because she did anything wrong, but because your mind has her as it's target. You're fixated on her, on this problem. And it's grown bigger over the years. What you MIGHT have been able to treat and control had you seen professional help at the beginning of your relationship, is now beyond control.
Sadly I think it will not be a good idea for you and your wife to remain married. It worsens your condition. If you are to have any chance of healing, or at least controlling your behaviour and thoughts, you need to put distance between her and you and give her a new role in your life.
If you have a mental disability, which an OCD is, then that is a medical condition. Remember that. If you are diagnosed with personality disorder then that is a medical condition. You need to respect that and understand that when something is missing in your brain for it to function properly, then you trying to function properly anyway will be like a man with no feet trying to walk anyway. Don't feel hopeless, but respect your boundaries and see yourself for what you are, and respect your condition. Respect your medical condition. Respect that there are things you can do and things you can't do, and work within your limits. Fixing this marriage and "fixing" your condition is not within your limits. Not at this point in time anyway.
Continue in therapy. Therapy gives you the tools you need to help yourself, and it is a process, not a "fix". It is so helpful for anyone to see a therapist that I recommend it to everyone, whether they themselves feel they have a problem or not. If you have the financial means to see one for the rest of your life, or periodically for the rest of your life, then do that.
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