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Mum has outstayed her welcome but she has nowhere else to go!

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Question - (31 August 2011) 20 Answers - (Newest, 6 September 2011)
A female United Kingdom age 51-59, anonymous writes:

my 79 year old mum has got a fear of living on her own and spending nights on her own. she is fit and well for her age, she does not even look 79, she is not like a frail old lady.

when i had my baby and got a house of my own and moved out she moved out of her house and came with me. my house is only a 2 bedroomed one so i shared my room with my little boy until he was about 5 and then he moved into the other room that my mum had been using, she continued to stay here a few days a week and spent the rest of the time at my elder sisters house with her family. she has her own room in their house.

my mum is a nice person but she irritates me by interfering and dictating and poking her nose in every little bit of my business. my son is 13 years old now and i think is is wrong that she still comes and shares his room a few nights a week, not only does it invade his privacy but he likes to stay up late during school holidays and play and chat on xbox live in his room, and she likes to get in bed early, she also snores really loudly so i think she disturbs his sleep when he has got school the next day.

i mentioned my concerns to her the other day (not for the first time!)and she fails to understand the problem. she is now like 'oh poor me' and she told my sister that she would have to spend all her time there because of the sleeping situation at my house. it is not only the fact that i do not have a spare bedroom though - she irritates the hell out of me most of the time. she does not even knock on the door before entering our bedrooms, even though i have asked her to.

I am currently single but the last 2 long term boyfriends i have had she has interfered in the relationships and ended up arguing and i have ended up stuck in the middle of animosity. when she is here she has the run of the place, she watches what she wants on tv and has the volume up very loud because she is partially deaf, she never cooks anything so i have to do all that and she starts moaning about being hungry at about 4pm so i always make our dinner earlier than the 6.30 that me and my son would usually eat if she wasn't here.

anyway, she told my sister that she would have to spend all her time at their house in future (even though i had not said this!) and my sister has told her that she does not want her spending all her time at their house either! mum is usually there at weekends.

me and my sister just don't know what can be done about this situation, we feel cruel to her that we just want our own space sometimes without this overbearing mother in our houses.

my mum said to me the other day that if she had to live somewhere on her own she would rather throw herself off a bridge! we want her to be happy but she is being happy at the expense of our sanity! whenever i am going shopping she wants to come with me and the shopping trip ends up being a trip around places that she wants to go and then she is bored, hot, hungry, wants toilet, wants to come home so i cannot shop for what i want in peace. she has got no friends to see and only one of her sisters is still alive but she will not go anywhere with my auntie coz she does not like to be around other people.

what shall we do? i have another sister but she lives an hour away with her husband who she no longer shares a bed with so if mum is ever up at theirs one of them sleeps on the couch. mum also irritates her so this sister hardly ever phones her and very rarely invites her to stay.

View related questions: moved in, moved out

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A reader, anonymous, writes (6 September 2011):

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@ciar - they don't share a bed, just a room. when mum stays here she has my sons bed and he sleeps on a mattress on the floor, its a smaller one which pulls out from underneath his bed. he will soon be getting too tall for it also. the whole situation is just wrong wrong wrong :( i hate it. we are a few days into our new plan where i have her here everyday and take her back to my sisters after dinner to stay the night there (when i said 'home' that is where i mean't. - she sold her own house some time after she followed me to my house!) anyway, like i was saying, this is not working for me, i feel like i don't have a minute to myself and last night because i told her that dinner would be later than she wanted it, she asked me to take her back to my sisters.

the words narcissist and emotional blackmail are absolutely correct. i have clear insight into what is going on here but i do not feel like i have the back up of my sisters. it is down to me to tell her that its wrong, it is down to me to tell her that she should be living independently somewhere else. one sister just sticks her head in the sand and quietly broods about it and the other just completely avoids all contact with her but then defends my mum by saying 'aw don't worry, you can come here every weekend if you want to!'

the way things are now i feel like i am stuck with her MORE than i was, but i had to offer *something* up in order to end the bedroom sharing situation

i could be hard and take her key off her and let the three of them (mum and two sisters) just get on with it - except my conscience would kill me.

i think i probably need to read up a bit more on 'dealing with a narcissist'

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A female reader, Ciar Canada +, writes (6 September 2011):

Ciar agony auntWhen I said 'I believe it is illegal in any western jurisdiction for a grown woman to be sharing a bed with an adolescent boy.' I should have said it might be legally questionable for a grown woman to share a bed with an adolescent boy on a regular basis.

People have had to suffer through all sorts of sleeping arrangements during times of transition or upheaval so I don't think anyone would bat an eye if it happened occasionally. To do so regularly might raise some uncomfortable questions.

Again, not to stress you out, but to strengthen your resolve....

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A female reader, Ciar Canada +, writes (6 September 2011):

Ciar agony auntIf I'm not mistaken, somewhere in your post you mentioned something about your mum going home. Does this mean she has a home, but chooses not to live in it?

You're right about not being able to change who your mother is, but taking advantage of her family is not who she is. It's what she does. You CAN influence what she does by changing what YOU do.

Your mother actually does like being around other people. Narcissists don't thrive in isolation. She's learned that her manipulative ways won't work with some people so she avoids them. And if she can learn to accomodate their boundaries, she can certainly learn to adapt to yours. Time to set some.

Decide what you're willing and able to do for your mother, comfortably. By 'comfortably' I mean COMFORTABLY, not what is the least torturous.

Then talk to your sisters. Tell them that you are going to be setting some limits with your mother. Make it clear that you are not doing this to encumber them. Encourage them to follow your lead, but inform them that whatever they decide, you're going ahead with your plan.

Then inform your mother of what your limits are. Keep it brief and be decisive. Do not get distracted with explanations and examples. It will only weaken your resolve and it would be lost on her anyway. Do NOT tell her how badly you feel having to set these limits. No matter how guilty you feel, don't show it. This may seem ruthless compared to how you're accustomed to treating her but it isn't.

Her behaviour is absolutely attrocious and potentially more troublesome than you think. I believe it is illegal in any western jurisdiction for a grown woman to be sharing a bed with an adolescent boy. The state may fear that either there is sexual interference or that the mother is unable to provide properly for her son. He is school age, yes? One slip of the tongue to a hyper vigilant teacher could cause you a world of grief. I don't say this to increase your stress, but to galvanize you to implement necessary changes.

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A reader, anonymous, writes (5 September 2011):

This is verified as being by the original poster of the question

hi battista

no it hasn't been suggested, but already 'been there done that' for a long time. the snoring is a huge problem in itself. the fact of the matter is that no one should be having to share a bedroom with her but its what she wants. its a long story, your right and while i'm dealing with a mum who just refuses to see rational sense, its a no win situation, for everybody. one of the other aunts suggested i read about 'emotional blackmail' which i have done and i can see that this is exactly what she is doing to us. i always say that you can't change a person though, and she has gone through her life like this and got to 79, she is not gonna change now :(

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A female reader, Battista United Kingdom +, writes (5 September 2011):

Hi OP

I'm afraid I don't have the time to read over all this right now so perhaps this has already been said but is there any chance you could share a room with your mum if she comes to stay rather than your son having to? I know this doesn't address your main concerns but it just popped into my head.

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A reader, anonymous, writes (5 September 2011):

This is verified as being by the original poster of the question

thank you all for helping me to realise i'm not the bad guy! well the latest is that i decided it would be a good compromise if i let my mum come here every day if she wants to, my sister and her family are all out all day, but the problem is that they don't like to come in and face a barrage of chatter the minute they come in, my sister hates the fact the she comes in from work and is met by 'what are you making for dinner?' before she has even taken her coat off (mum does that to me too) so i am willing to have mum at mine every day but on the understanding that she goes home after dinner and sleeps at my sisters (mum goes to bed early anyway, she likes to read a book then lights out quite early)

when i spoke to my sister, she seemed ok with this but then when i have seen mum today she tells me that J would still prefer it if mum spent some weekends here, friday and saturday overnight, not every week, just sometimes, and that there is no need for her to come here to mine everyday. so basically i feel like nothing has changed! my sisters house is about three times as big as mine and i haven't even got a spare bedroom like she has.

mum rang my eldest sister G who was apparently 'appalled' (though she lives one hour away and can go for months sometimes without even ringing mum, they have seen each other, probably 2 or 3 times THIS YEAR) G now says mum is welcome there whenever she wants, every weekend even, she'll get a fold up bed and mum can have her room, blah blah blah - it won't happen coz G has told me that she gets very irritated with mum

i suppose i will just have to strong and dig my heels in as much as my sisters do if i feel like i am having too much of this put on me. i don't want any of it. what chocoholic said about this 'souring the relationship' is spot on! i resent the fact that mum cannot accept the fact that i just want to do what 'normal' people do, which is not see their mum every day. we don't really get on, there is just a gulf of difference in our opinions about pretty much everything.

i let her stay here until last evening and she was playing up then when it came time to take her to my sisters, telling me she felt sick, didn't want to go, mentioned G's daughter getting a new house and hopefully there would be a 'bed available there' for her. she doesn't even LIKE this granddaughter OR her children (great-granddaughters) the rest of the time she spent gazing out of my living-room window with a really sad look on her face, telling me she would be going straight to bed when i took her to J's. i didn't give in though, i took her there anyway.

so she came back today for a daytime visit and asks me is it ok to spend SOME weekends here, while my son doesn't have to get up for school the next day coz thats what J suggested to her. well, what could i say?? just said 'hmm, i suppose it will have to be won't it?' - not very assertive of me that, was it :(

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A female reader, chocoholicforever United States +, writes (2 September 2011):

I'm glad you're gathering more information and gaining awareness and clarity of the underlying dynamics in your family situation. I agree with So_Very_Confused that your mom is also being very manipulative. That's often found in co-dependent relationships. The dependent person is not taking responsibility for their own problem, they want their loved one to make them feel better by doing stuff for them or doing things their way, so to get the loved one to do whatever is the dependent person wants, he/she uses tactics of manipulation.

Another aspect to read up on (if you're so inclined) is 'emotional blackmail' which is a kind of manipulation tactic whereby someone tries to get you to do what they want by making you feel guilty or bad, which is what it sounds like your mom is doing too.

This is also very toxic and contributes to a souring of the relationship. There are strategies for dealing with these individual "issues" but in your case they are also part of a bigger picture which is that this relationship between you (and your sister) and your mom is co-dependent, centered around your mom's dysfunctionality.

Don't feel bad for having been an 'enabler', it's very common that people who are kindhearted, loving and caring can easily fall into this trap without even knowing it. Many people who find themselves in a co-dependent relationship actually would not have become co-dependent (which is what you and your sister are in relationship to your mother, who is the 'dependent') if they were otherwise in relationship with a healthy person. But, many people are not emotionally healthy and do not take steps to heal or manage their problems adequately so they stay that way. And, they do also get married and start families of their own while still being emotionally unhealthy. And thus a dysfunctional family system comes about.

Family relationships unfortunately are some of the 'worst' settings for developing and exacerbating dysfunctional behavior because there is an expectation of providing love and care and loyalty to one's family members so it's often difficult to know where to draw the line. (and also because you can't escape your problem family members, as you can escape from other people like co-workers.) But now that you're more aware of the dynamics at play - and these family situations are quite common though to varying degrees of severity - you are in a better position to make decisions for the future.

Another option is for you, your sister, and your mom to go together as a group for counseling with a family therapist. (your mom also would benefit from individual counseling to help her deal with her fears). Since none of these interactions happen in a vacuum but are all inter-related, when one individual is emotionally unhealthy and there are lack of boundaries then the whole family system becomes dysfunctional. So for healing to take place, it could be more effective if the family as a whole was addressed.

Your mom does sound like she has a very deeply ingrained fear of being alone and has lived most of her adult life like this, so it's definitely not easy for her to change. But that's not to say it's impossible either. Even small positive changes can make a HUGE difference in bringing about relief or lessening the toxicity in the relationships.

If you could perhaps frame this to your mom as being for her own benefit, to help HER to feel better, to feel less anxious and fearful, then maybe she will be more cooperative with whatever path you choose.

Your mom is 79, but that's not to say she may not live another 20 or more years, so I think it would still be worth trying to work towards healthy change, and if things improve maybe you won't have this lingering feeling of just "waiting to be free of her." If healthy and positive change can be brought about, then her twilight years would be so much richer and happier for both her and you. good luck

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A female reader, RedAthena United States +, writes (1 September 2011):

RedAthena agony auntFrom what you described, your Mom might have an severe anxiety/panic issue. They have meds and therapy for that.

Remember-Fear is

F-alse

E-vidence

A-ppearing

R-eal

Good for you for sticking to your guns. Good luck with your sister. Personally, I think all the siblings should helping with your Moms care either with hostessing her at a home or helping her arrange her finances and schedule so all of you can have something that you want and need.

No one person will get ALL what they need.

Also (hugs) do not feel bad about your own emotions. They are normal! You are overwhelmed with her guilt trips.

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A female reader, So_Very_Confused United States +, writes (1 September 2011):

So_Very_Confused agony aunti think to be honest, your mom is being a bit manipulative of you and your sister. I am sure if you "threw her to the wolves" so to speak she would "man up"

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A reader, anonymous, writes (1 September 2011):

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thank you all for your answers, i feel like i can sort of see a way forward now. i got up this morning ( i let her stay at mine last night coz my son had gone to stay at his dads for the night) and we had a talk this morning, she told me she had hardly slept all night coz she was so upset, felt awful in the night and felt like she might have a heart attack or stroke (trying to scare me, but i did not give any response to this comment, like i said, she has no real health problems anyway and cannot possibly know how an imminent stroke or heart attack feels!) then she changed her tactic and told me that she would give me all the inheritence (including my two sisters share!) if i would let her live with me and either let her sleep on my couch every night or get a conservatory built at the back of the house for her to sleep in) i refused. she also reminded me that after my dad died she brought up my sister and me as a single parent. basically trying different angles of persuasion on me, but i am not so stupid - i know what she's doing!

this fear of living and sleeping alone is a very deep rooted one though. she tells me that when she was young and first married my dad had to give up his night job and do a day one because she was so scared to be left in the house alone with her baby all night, she would cry and whine to him about this and he enabled this coz firstly he used to lock her and my brother in the bed room for the night with a chamber pot, he would do this on his way out to his night job, then when he was able to he gave up working nights and she was happy then coz she could have him with her.

me and my sister have been guilty of enabling, i know that. its really tough though, she is elderly, so we have just kind of been tolerating this, knowing that it won't be forever. we should be enjoying her company though in her twilight years, i sometimes feel like i am waiting to be free of her though. how bad is that?? :(

me and my sister are gonna have to have a talk about this. the other day on the phone she said that coz she cannot stand to spend too much time with mum that she would like me to have her some weekends too, but to be honest i dread this thought. i think that the best thing we can do is i let her visit me everyday if she wants to but on the understanding that she goes 'home' to their house after dinner in the evening and not to sleep here anymore. hopefully my sister will be in agreement.

i know its not ideal as i don't WANT her to visit everyday and expect her dinner to be made and then a lift home, even when i have been at work all day, but i couldn't stand the guilt and i KNOW this is what she is counting on and i KNOW that this is further enabling her, but i guess she iw too old to change.

@chocoholic - i read up on co-dependency in families and yes, my mum definitely fits that profile! even down to the bit about offering unwanted help all the time, as to pull you into an obligation to give the co-dependent what THEY want in return

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A female reader, celtic_tiger United Kingdom +, writes (1 September 2011):

celtic_tiger agony auntShe sounds like my Nan, who is about the same age, and since my Grandfather passed away she has engineered as many opportunities as she can to have my Mum and Uncle running around after her and looking after her. We have had crying, moaning, lying, and making up all sorts of stories that have involved needing to take time off work and run down to sort her out. She also refuses to go into a home or into sheltered housing. She doesnt make friends easily, and those she has she pisses off because of her attitude.

It is all about her and she is very selfish - everyone should be running after her like slaves.

Don't let it get this bad. You need to stand up to her, tell her she needs to get her own place, because at 13 your son is growing up. It is no longer acceptable to be sharing a room with Granny. (think about it...) He is growing up and needs space to be a teenage boy, go out, get drunk, start learning about girls etc etc etc.

She is a grown up, and as you say, still has all her faculties about her. She is just being lazy. She doesnt want to have to cook and clean for herself.

Have you considered sending her on a SAGA holiday or something? These are full of older people who dont think they are old, and she could learn new skills, meet new people. Painting, history.... all sorts.

My neighbour used to go on these and thoroughly enjoyed herself!

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A female reader, chocoholicforever United States +, writes (1 September 2011):

Your mom may have depression, it sounds like. And, she is putting all her eggs in one basket which is you. She's making you responsible for her emotional and mental health. This is not healthy for her and it's unfair to you, and it's just unrealistic and non-sustainable over the long term (you've been doing this for 13 years already, you're running out of steam) because it suffocates the relationship between you and alienates you which then creates exactly what she fears most which is being alone. So she digs her heels in even more and latches on to you even tighter, which in turn suffocates you even more. And so it's a toxic cycle.

it may be that your mom could really benefit from professional help such as counseling and maybe also including antidepressants (a psychiatrist would be needed to make a diagnosis and prescription). She is able-bodied and fit so she's not physically dependent on you, instead she is completely dependent on you to meet all her emotional needs. And it shouldn't be this way, it's not a healthy way to live, certainly she's not happy either, in fact it sounds like she's miserable.

It sounds like she's lived most of her life struggling with fears of abandonment or of loved ones disappearing. Fears and anxieties, if not faced and dealt with, often increase over time unless the fear trigger goes away. But for fear of abandonment, the trigger can't go away except by her latching onto whomever she seeks comfort from. And that's exactly what she's been doing, she latches onto you. it sounds like she needs some help to become a more emotionally balanced person, because maybe she's spent most of her life being unbalanced so it's pretty deeply rooted by now. She would need to learn new ways of thinking, and maybe she might need medication as well to feel better.

But as long as you continue to play into her fears and anxieties, she will resist getting the help she needs, because it's easier for her to continue latching onto you and having you meet her emotional needs if you let her. This is what a co-dependent relationship is. If you're not familiar with that term here are many articles you can google and read up on co-dependent family relationships and why they are unhealthy and create a lot of problems both within the individuals involved and between them (such as strained relationships and a sense of despair and entrapment, which is what your situation is like).

Unfortunately this may be a situation where you need to stop "helping" her even though you will feel a lot of pain and guilt and anxiety at how much distress it creates in her. You may feel that you're being cruel if you stop playing the role you have been for the last 13+ years. But the big picture is that she needs to get help of some kind to deal with her anxieties and fears that are holding her back from enjoying her life and are destroying her family relationships. Or at least to try hard on her own if she's never really done that in her life before. And as long as this unhealthy pattern continues where she demands that you take care of all her emotional needs and you capitulate and do it (even if it's just to get rid of your own discomforting sense of guilt or to just shut her up so you can get on with what you need to do), you're feeding into it and reinforcing this pattern. So the cycle has to be broken at some point, and stay broken, if anything is to change. And she's not going to be the one to break it so it has to be you.....

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A male reader, anonymous, writes (1 September 2011):

I think it's time for drastic action.

I know that it's easier said than done, but things have got to change. It probably won't be pleasant and it will cause a lot of bad feeling but you've got to do something.

The best thing is for the three daughters to get together and talk this through. See if you can come up with a compromise. Things certainly aren't working out at the moment. Your teenage son for example is not really going to want his grandmother walking into his room whenever she wants to. He needs his space and privacy, the same way that you do.

I went through much the same thing with my grandmother though she lived near my aunt rather than my mum. She rattled round in a two bed detached house that had been her marital home but was really too big for her to cope with. She wasn't that steady on her feet, but insisted on carrying her dog up and down the stairs. In the end her doctor threatened to take action if she didn't move out into something more sensible. She ended up buying a McCarthyandStone flat, but went on to tell everyone that her family had forced her to sell her house so that they could steal her money! She'd turn up for Christmas and sit in the dark watching the TV while we had Christmas dinner and then tell us that no-one spoke to her. The next year we all made an effort to sit with her and involve her, that was wrong because we disturbed her soaps!

You say that she's got money from her house sale, could she buy herself a flat? She could get somewhere close to you and your sister so she could still visit. At the end of the day this situation can't go on. You'll end up resenting your mother. Talk to your sisters face to face and then talk to your mother. As I said it won't be pleasant, but you have to do it.

PS my grandmother was very happy in her flat (even though she'd tell us how miserable she was!). We found out by talking to some of the other residents who told us how popluar she was with everyone (again my nan would tell us she never spoke to a soul!)

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A reader, anonymous, writes (1 September 2011):

This is verified as being by the original poster of the question

thanks, she has no friends, hates pets, doesn't drive, has no hobbies or interests. i feel like i am not dealing with a normal and rational person so although i think your suggestions are really good, she will twist this into something bad! she is impossible to have a conversation with, all she wants to talk about is the past and people that she knew as a child and growing up, she will actually interrupt a conversation to go off on these tangents.

she had arrived at mine first thing this morning from my sisters house so i awoke to find her in my sitting room, sitting in silence and then when we started talking she started to cry about how unwanted she feels after her convo with my sister. she then went on to tell me that when i was born it was as if i had been given to her by god because he knew that he was gonna take my dad away (when i was 5 years old) and then when my brother died at age 43 god gave her my son as a replacement. i said to her that this evokes a feeling that it is 'all about her' the thought that people are born into the world just so the universe can give HER people to replace the ones that SHE has lost is just totally and utterly wrong. it is the same with this housing situation. she said that living with us makes her feel safe and loved (which is fair enough) but there is no consideration to how it makes US feel. me and my sister are not close so we rarely bother to call each other but when i spoke to her this evening she told me that she and her teenage children spend a lot of time in their rooms (which i already knew coz mum has told me) but the reason for this is so they can have some space away from her coz she spends all her time in their sitting room and talks endlessly at whoever comes in. it made me sad to know that this is happening. its like as if she is a nuisance. its not that we don't love and care about her, its just that sense of 'too much' that gets us

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A female reader, RedAthena United States +, writes (31 August 2011):

RedAthena agony auntMy Mother had to make this choice when I was a teenager. My Grandmother was very much like your Mom and was causing the same issues.

Eventually it was my Father that told Grandma that the living arrangments no longer worked for any of us. She was VERY unhappy, complained the whole time, and did little to change the situation. Mom and Dad found her a Senior Apartment that was safe and clean.

Grandma had huge social anxieties and was generally a very unhappy person. We made plans to invite her over, visit her, travel with her on occasion, but our family had sanity again.

I think you might just have to be brave and arrange an intervention with your sisters. Mom needs to be addressed on her boundaries. You need to insist she move to her own place and deal with her anxities. Come up with a schedule where you can hostess her one night a week.

Consider a roommate, a pet, anti anxiety meds, social groups, church, etc. It is your Mom's choice to avoid these things, but you can assert your needs for your life.

Assure Mom that you are meeting your first priority, your SON and taking care of his best interests first.

Your Mom is able bodied and it is unfair of her to lay a guilt trip into you. Lay one back into her about her Grandson. Do not let your Mom try and manipulate you or give into her fears.

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A female reader, anonymous, writes (31 August 2011):

I can so identify, I live with my mum too and she drives me nuts but thankfully, it's her house and I am moving out in 3 weeks!

My mum is different, although she is 76 she is very independent and not scared of being on her own. I do think your mum needs to move out as the relationship will suffer badly otherwise. You have been given some great answers as to where she could stay. Also, does she like pets? It does sound like she has a genuine fear of being alone and also possible suffers with anxiety? That is no laughing matter and I suggest you deal with this matter delicately. Anti depressants dont work with people with anxiety as I am a sufferer too and they just made it worse. If she does like pets how about a dog or cat in her new home?

Also, she wont like it but could you and your sister sit down with her and be honest and tell her how you feel, you know, explain that she can be controlling and although you love her, it pushes you away? I do think that people still need to hear about themselves and how there behavior can affect others no matter how old they are. Everyone has the capacity to change.

Good luck.

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A reader, anonymous, writes (31 August 2011):

This is verified as being by the original poster of the question

@chocoholic - that is a lovely idea. it would be perfect if she had someone to move in with and they could be company for each other. money is not the problem for her, she sold her own house and just put the money in the bank where it stays, she does not pay to live with us you see. i have a cousin who is 50 something, a single lady whose grown up son should be moving out soon to go and live with his pregnant girlfriend, maybe she could go there. its definitely worth considering. the thing is that i told my mum she is always welcome here in the day (she has key and lets herself in) i will give her dinner and then take her to my sisters in the evening so my son gets his bedroom to himself, but she takes this the wrong way and gets upset! i don't see why she lays the guilt onto me, i am not asking for anything out of the ordinary

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A female reader, chocoholicforever United States +, writes (31 August 2011):

You must change this living situation because right now, all kinds of personal boundaries are violated (and have been for the last 13+ years) and the result is, well, the way you're feeling and the way the family relationship is which is clearly not good. This is no way for her and you to spend her golden years.

"my mum said to me the other day that if she had to live somewhere on her own she would rather throw herself off a bridge!"

I think your mother has a lot of fear of living on her own. Rather than the solution being that she lives with you (because that is clearly not working out) or your sister (same thing will happen), I think the better approach is to try to address the root cause of this, which is your mom's fear of living on her own, and try to find alternative solutions.

Since she is able-bodied and fit, what if you and your sister combined money to pay for her own apartment, and find her a roommate (someone similar to her in life stage perhaps another senior citizen). You could help her transition to taht situation by at first only having her stay in her own apartment every other day, then a few days a week and maybe bit by bit she'll get used to living on her own.

Another option is if she continues to stay with you, but you upgrade to a bigger place so she can have her own room. However this may or may not be financially feasible, but who knows you may be able to find a good deal.

Maybe you can also encourage her to develop hobbies and interests that help her make new friends, to ease her sense of loneliness and fear of being alone. This might make her an easier person to live with, if she had to continue living with you.

"i am really not sure there is any answer to this problem coz everything i suggest is met by her refusal."

Maybe now it's time to set some boundaries. Right now the relationship has been one-way : her way. She crosses lines, you try to say no, suggest alternatives for her, and she refuses, and you have to accept her refusal.

It's hard but maybe you simply have reached the stage where you have to just say "mom I love you very much, but I am getting you your own apartment, and I've found you a roommate to help offset the expenses, and you will be staying there for the next 6 months to 1 year. At the end of 6 months (or 1 yr, depending on the lease) we can discuss this situation again, but until then I've made this decision, and I believe it's going to be best for all of us so I would appreciate it if you would at least give it a try and in 6 months' (or 1 year) we can talk about it again."

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A reader, anonymous, writes (31 August 2011):

This is verified as being by the original poster of the question

thanks for your answer, do you mean apartments where there is a warden there to keep an eye on residents? yes we have plenty of those but she has always said that would be her worst nightmare! i am really not sure there is any answer to this problem coz everything i suggest is met by her refusal. she will not join any clubs to meet friends coz she says that all old ladies are just interested in nasty gossip. when she was working it was in a job caring for the elderly in their own homes and in sheltered accommodation and she has always said she would hate to end up living somewhere like that. she shies away from making friends even though she is good at striking up conversations with old ladies that she meets while out shopping etc. she tells me she has what sounds like a social phobia, but yet she is able to friendly with strangers and has nice conversations with them so i don't really understand her. it contradicts what she is saying about not wanting to mix with others.

she says she gets panic attacks if she has to be alone overnight and this is why if ever i go out at night she expects me to come home rather than leave her all night on her own. she is a 'young 79' with no health problems except for high cholesterol and aching feet!

she basically just relies on us (mainly me) for all her companionship needs. i have pointed out to her that this way of life is not what most people do and she is lucky that us daughters have been willing to share her between our homes the way we have been doing, but it just seems like this is not enough for her. i was hoping that as my son got older, mum would naturally stop expect to come over and share his bedroom a few times a week. he is growing into a young man now and it doesn't seem right that he has to share a room with his granny. it worries me coz now my sister has voiced her opinion now that she doesn't want mum at her house every night, it looks like this situation will have to continue

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A female reader, So_Very_Confused United States +, writes (31 August 2011):

So_Very_Confused agony auntdo you have assisted living or adult apartments where you are? sounds like she's lonely

maybe find her a day care program so she's not so lonely?

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