A
female
age
51-59,
*nxiousmom
writes:I need advice about my how to deal with my husband's family, in particular, his dad.. He is old school and I get the distinct feeling he has little respect for women. His current wife is number 3, who was a mistress he got pregnant and brought her home to live with the family when his other children were very young. This is the kind of man I'm dealing with. That aside, I've done my best to get along with this man. I've been with my husband for 20 years. His dad has always been difficult for me to handle. I am somewhat feminist, and I am a strong and opinionated woman who isn't afraid to speak my mind. I've done a lot of tongue-biting over the past 2 decades. Despite his shortcomings, my husband loves him dearly and has done his best to keep the peace. His father is a man who, if crossed, cuts all ties. He has not seen or spoken to his sister in 30+ years. He cut off his father for over 30 years, and over a fight with his son, hasn't even met 2 of his grandchildren. He is a stubborn old mule who cannot, will not, admit his own mistakes.Here is my problem. I have an anxiety disorder which is fairly well managed, but I need to be cautious about situations that get me worked up. Christmas day, the father brings up a volatile political topic during dinner, a topic I am very sensitive about, and I KNOW we are on opposing sides. I respectfully ask if we cannot have this discussion, not today, not on Christmas, not over dinner. He continues to pursue. I ask again, please, lets not discuss this, its very personal to me and I don't want to discuss it. He continues to pursue. I beg him, please, don't do this? Please. He won't let it go. I quietly finish my meal and leave the table. My husband is defending "our" views, and the debate is on. It gets heated. My children, under 10, ask grandpa, please stop fighting? His wife asks him to stop. An hour passes, they're still at it. The father is getting very worked up. I'm doing my best to not have a panic attack. My husband FINALLY gets him to move on. They come to sit where the rest of the family is gathered, and not 2 minutes pass, and he's back at it again. "Why don't you understand? blah, blah, blah"I see this isn't going to end well. I instruct my children to collect their things and we get ready to leave. He is extremely agitated. He's been drinking, but I don't think enough to explain his behaviour. It's time for us to leave. I make my way to the door, and he comes after me."Hey! Why can't you sit down and have a debate about this like an adult?"I answer, "because this topic is sensitive for me, and you're not debating. You're telling us why you're right, and we're wrong". Not listening to my answer, he yells, "is it because you're too ignorant?".That's when I lost my temper. "You've got your head shoved so far up your ass that you can't hear me anyway!""What did you say to me?!" he screamed. Then he runs to my husband, and yells, "Your wife just told me I have my Head up my ass! What are YOU going to do about it?!"My husband says, OK, I guess we're leaving now.The father is yelling at him now, so I get in front of him and I say, "if you have a problem with me, you talk to me. He (husband) has done nothing wrong, so leave him out of it"Well, I got told! inches from my face he screamed at me that I was ignorant, uneducated, disrespectful, so damn stupid I can't even string a sentence together without subjecting to rhetoric. It went on, but the words kept spewing at me and I have never seen or heard anything like it.When he paused, I thanked his wife for a lovely afternoon, and he told me to get the F*** out of his house.Wow. The ride home was quiet.Fast forward 10 days, and all the Christmas gifts we gave them show up on our doorstep.My husband has done nothing. I'm angry. I'm having anxiety attacks. Husband thinks something must be wrong with dad, but I disagree, I think the truth finally came flooding out. So now, the father gets to shut out another member of the family. His son, who has worked SO hard to keep peace with this impossible man. And what do I do now? I've reached out to the wife to no avail. All of me wants to fight this man, to make sure he knows he won't get away with speaking to me that way, I want action. My husband is the opposite. He wants to sit and wait for an apology. That's not going to happen.I'm so frustrated I just don't know what to do next. Can somebody please offer me something to do with all this anger and hurt I have from this man?.
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female
reader, chigirl  +, writes (15 January 2016):
 If you need a release from the anger and hurt, I suggest you pray. Or remind yourself of karma, or that the universe is always in balance. Mean people have bad things happening to them. It will not be your revenge, but he will still get what's coming to him, from other sources. Don't poison your soul with anger and hate. Meditate.
Or if you really need to get it out and none of the above has helped, do the dishes and clean the house. That always works for me. Then swear the words you'd have liked to tell him as you scrub away. Make sure you're alone, so you're able to let it all out without scaring anyone.
A
female
reader, chigirl +, writes (15 January 2016):
Oh, been there done that. My family is the same way. You got to leave these toxic people and don't look back. Don't bother waiting for an apology, and don't even waste your time thinking you can DEMAND one, lol. Are you nuts? Did you not experience yourself how irrational and abusive and self centered and mentally unstable this man is? Did you not yourself experience his aggression, his inability to just drop the darn debate?
Listen, sweetie, you are naive. He got into that debate because he WANTED to argue. It's what gives him his kicks. Throwing your gifts back in your face is just another thing that rocks his boat. He LOVES the attention and the drama. He loves the feeling of anger and arguing. He craves it. Your husband trying to be peaceful with him is not something he appreciate, because he does not want PEACE! He wants WAR. Get it? Some people just love it, need it, and will always try to get it.
The worst thing you can do to him is leave him alone and don't pay him any attention. Which is what you did at the dinner table, and then were about to leave. He got desperate. That's why he lunged at you. You weren't giving him what he wanted until the very end. And now he's trying to drag you down into this shit even further, and you're about to take the bait.
No, here's what you do: IGNORE HIM. You honestly do not need him in your life, your children will be much happier without such a role model, and as for your husband.. well, leave it up to him to do what he wants to do. It's his dad after all. If he wants to sit for 30 years and wait for an apology he has every right to.
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A
female
reader, anxiousmom +, writes (15 January 2016):
anxiousmom is verified as being by the original poster of the questionTo Anonymous.Thank you so much for your words and sharing your story. It seems to me you've been through much worse and I appreciate your insights.The only place where you haven't hit the mark is his relationship with his son, my husband. My husband says he was a great father,alwasy kind, thoughtful and forgiving, and he has never in his life seen him this angry before, which is why he thinks there might be a medical issue here. I don't quite agry with his assessment, but this man has 4 sons, and I've only ever seen this kind of hatred toward his son's wives/girlfriends. Whether it's a control issue for him that no woman could ever be good enough for his boys, or the simple fact that he hates women, I HAVE seen this hate before.I know in my heart the best thing to do is just move on and avoid him. It should be fairly easy, in fact. But I still struggle with the fight in me that wants to say, "how dare you speak to me that way and get away with it!" I don't want him to get away with it. I know it's childish of me, but I want him to know he can't get away with pushing me around, I am a strong woman, dammit! That's my real struggle right now. Letting it go. Sigh...My husband says he plans to talk with his brothers and find out if there may be something more here. He's planning his move carefully, as his dad is clearly volatile right now. I respect that and I appreciate that. I guess theres just a deep down desire that despite everything, my husband would grow a pair and tell this asshole off. But thats not his style, and I need to accept that too.Thank you everyone for your insights, I really appreciate hearing that this isnt my fault. I know it in my heart, but its still good to hear.
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A
female
reader, anonymous, writes (14 January 2016): HiPlease understand that he is doing this on purpose. I have been on the receiving end of this exact behaviour from an abusive ex.Think about it. He brought that subject up ON PURPOSE because he knows that it is sensitive for you. You asked him very nicely to not do this. Someone who wanted harmony and happiness would not have brought this subject up in the first place, let alone carry on when asked to not do so. He really wanted a reaction from you and you didn't give him one. You moved away and your husband managed to change the subject and move things along. Your father in law did not want this outcome. He wanted you to react. So ...he carried on. Please realise this has nothing to do with his opinions on the subject and nothing to do with you per se. He wants control, he wants subservience, he wants disharmony. Difficult to believe I know, but he is thoroughly abusive and this is a ploy of abusive men. When you finally reacted after being pushed and pushed, he got what he wanted. Then he went to town on you and this is what he wanted an excuse to do. To react as you did was a perfectly normal reaction. He took what you said and then tried to instantly make you the bad guy, trying to create even more disharmony. He wanted to rope you into a family argument and make you the centre of it. You were the victim that day. You were always going to be the victim, he had planned it before you arrived probably. 'I know how I'll get her all riled up, I'll start to talk about that subject that I know she is sensitive about. That should do it.' When you kept your cool, he had to ratch it up a notch until you did react.He is vicious, nasty and abusive. Men like this feed off disharmony and everyone is their pawn to play with. What you can do with the hurt and anger is realise what he is doing and why. When you understand about abuse, this I think, will help you enormously. To think that he is rational, logical and thinks like a decent person will leave you so confused. He does not think like a decent person, he loves situations like these and will continue to create other situations like it until he dies. Abusive men are very good actors. He knew what you were going to do. You are human after all and he knew if he pushed you enough, he would get a reaction. Then he fed off it. Would you like to hear a very similar scenario that happened with an abusive ex of mine that I have never told anyone?It is similar to your situation in as much as I was pushed and pushed until I reacted and then I was the bad guy. Always happens like that.I was helping my ex who was foreign and who didn't read or write English well by filling in an online form for him. He wasn't in the room when I started to fill it in, but was in another room. He came in, looked over my shoulder for one second at what I was doing (which he would not have been able to read anyway) and shouted as loud as he could in my ear 'NO!!! You're doing it wrong!!' I wasn't, but that wasn't the point. The point was he wanted me to lose my temper. I didn't react as I had learnt by now that this gets me nowhere and usually makes things worse. So I got up from where I was sitting and sat down on the settee. Not a word did I say.He is now thinking 'Mmmmm, that didn't work, got to increase the aggravation'. So he then got the laptop I had been using and he came to where I was sitting and showed it to me. It was as I had left it. He shouted again as loud as he could, 'THAT WAS THE PAGE YOU SHOULD HAVE BEEN ON!!' I said still quietly, 'That was the page I was on' He then shouted again as loudly as he could 'NO!!!' Then I lost it. I got up and snapped the laptop shut. Saying as I did so that I'd had enough of this. That was when he put his face in mine and told me to leave. I later realised he had staged all this because I had voiced my concerns that if I let the lease on my rented house run out, then I would have nowhere to go when we 'argued' (I realise now, we didn't argue, he created situations like these as does your father in law).So, he created an argument. He went on and on until I finally lost control. Then he was in the driving seat. He could show me that I had nowhere to go if he chose to behave like this. He had reassured me that if I had nowhere else to go, that I could stay and he would go until I found somewhere else to live.So I answered, very angry now, 'You fucking go!'. This is when he knocked me down, put his hand around my throat, pretended to be incredibly angry (because remember, this is all staged) and told me he was going to kill me if I ever swore at him again. The abuse carried on all night until he had to leave for an appointment early the next morning, which is when I got my stuff and ran. This is different I know from your situation, but the fact that your father in law went on and on until you reacted and then created something from your reaction, which was perfectly normal, rings bells with me. A neighbour of my sister is married to an abusive man, who didn't want his wife's parents over for Christmas Day. They were already coming, so on the day, her husband decided that something (can't remember what now) needed servicing thereby ensuring there was no hot water and no heating on the day. He was crashing and banging around, making the day very unpleasant. They went home early and this being the second time he had ruined Christmas, he got his wish when the parents said they wouldn't come when he was in the house anymore, they would only come to see their daughter.Abusive men do not care about anyone but themselves, they don't care about upsetting people etc. Please I would say, do not expect your husband to BE ABLE to react to this situation as you would like. He has probably been subject to it all of his life and has been conditioned as all victims of abuse are, to not retaliate. This will have been very deeply planted in him throughout his childhood and I would imagine he is incapable of confronting his father. IT'S NOT HIS FAULT. My father was abusive and I could not have confronted him for all the tea in China. Deeply ingrained from an early age that things will only get worse when you try to confront. Also, if you look at this from the viewpoint that your father in law is angry, then I am very confident that you will have got it wrong. As I say, abusive men are incredibly good actors and there was no anger there. Just the opposite I should imagine. Giggling up his sleeve because things went according to plan. When you realise how he's really thinking and what this is really about, your father in law will lose some of his power. He may wish to split you and your husband up, this may be what's behind it. Join with your husband and try to understand how awful this is for him and don't hold it against him for not confronting. It would be nigh on impossible for him. Many psychological phenomena happen when someone is abused, bonds between the abuser and the abused are in fact incredibly strong. They're called Betrayal bonds or Trauma bonds. I urge you to read books about abusive behaviour as I did and I now have read for England on the subject. I believe I can see abuse from a mile off. I have learned all the tactics that these sick individuals apply to gain control and the upper hand. Read about trauma bonds and the best book I ever read on abuse was 'Why Does He Do That?' by Professor Lundy Bancroft. You I believe, will see your father in law's behaviour between the pages and it will empower you once you understand better what's going on. I would advise that you avoid him as much as possible, do not in any way fall out with your husband over this, none of it is his fault and read the books and take away his power. Once you take away the smoke and mirrors you'll see him for what he is. If you can, walk away and be grateful if he eliminates you from his life. Saves you having to do it.
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A
male
reader, Garbo  +, writes (14 January 2016):
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You'd be surprised in how many "progressive" people are equally stubborn about certain modern subject matters that saying something to the contrary would trigger endless accusations of being a "phobe" (pick the prefix). The best course of action is to do what you are been doing for 20 years, which is avoid him. I think it was clear to you, long ago, that at some point he will know how to get to you.
Therefore, happily accept the presence back, then stay still and do nothing. His threats of cutting off ties with you are like threatening someone with a suicide: actions detrimental to him and not you. Your husband seems to have realized that something isn't right with him, and I think that is a sufficient signal for you to feel secure about your husband, and that is the only thing that matters to you in this situation.
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A
male
reader, Garbo +, writes (14 January 2016):
Even though you have lot of anger, justifiable at that, it does not necessarily follow that you must act on that anger. It may feel good as an emotional relief, but going bunkers on him again is pointless because it will win you nothing, it will prove nothing and probably have no impact on that man.
You
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A
female
reader, Honeypie +, writes (14 January 2016):
 I'm sorry you had to deal with this fella at all, but this is not something you can fix. He was gunning for a fight. My guess is he hasn't been pissed of at someone for a while and you ended up being the target because you didn't want to play his game.
I think you did the right thing. WHO the heck wants to "debate" issues over Christmas dinner? And WHO the heck wants to put their kids through that?
It's your husband's dad so I'd follow his lead. If he doesn't want to confront his dad (which I think would be pointless anyways) then don't force the issue.
Personally, I'd rather NOT have such a person in my life.
And I get why you feel angry and hurt. However, best thing YOU can do is LET it go. Because you CAN NOT change this man. And by letting HIM keep you angry and hurt - he "wins".
Instead ACCEPT that this man is a TOTAL a-hole. And also, your FIL. And that no matter what... if you are lucky you won't have to deal with him ever again. And you won't have to expose your kids to such a petty small minded person.
IT IS 100% HIS LOSS!.
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